Locking in trunk (revisited)

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YogSothoth

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I did a search before submitting this, but didn't find anything specific to my question, so hopefully I'm not forcing folks to repeat themselves.

I know I can keep my handgun locked in the trunk of my car (or in a locked case/container in the car) as long as it's unloaded. What must I do with the ammunition to stay within the law? Can I lock it up in a separate section of the car (gun in trunk, ammo in locked case in cabin)? I couldn't find anything specifying what to do with the ammo. I thought that it had to be out of the car completely if the gun was locked in the trunk, but now I'm not sure. Any clarification would be much appreciated.

I've been carrying the mags in my mag pouch on my belt (concealed) while in the office and then get the Glock out of the trunk when I got in to my car. My coworkers know I carry and one of my two bosses appears to be actively seeking ways to stop me from doing so (the other boss doesn't like it either, but he's not actively trying to stop me anymore...not since he called HR to get familiar with the rules. These are the same guys, plus one other, who are certain I'm going to come in and shoot the place up because I got licensed. No amount of reasoning has assuaged their fears). He was in my office the other day talking to me about my handgun and asking me why I felt I had to carry it, and why I couldn't just leave it at home. Today, he walks in with a new amendment to the employee handbook where "dangerous items" now includes ammunition in its definition. I think he's hoping that if I have to leave both the ammunition and the handgun in the car, I won't be able to carry at all. I want to find a workaround so that I can still carry without breaking either the law or company policy.

Did I mention this boss is an extremely liberal French Canadian? hehe
 
Nickle said:
French Canadian isn't bad. My boss is. He's not a Liberal, though.
Click to expand...

These are the same asshats who booed the national anthem in the NHL playoffs two years ago. Real Class act... [roll]
 
Oh, yeah I know. One of the supervisors here (Don) is a Liberal of French Canadian descent (US born). My boss (Al) is also his boss. Fun to watch them go at it some times and see Al call Don a "Hard Headed Stubborn Frenchman".


Hell, I figure the south won the Civil War. The North got stuck with the Frenchmen.
 
OK, you lost me on exactly what you want to do in the office, so I'll leave that to your boss, you and HR! [twisted]

MGLs say that any handgun left in a car must be Unloaded, and in a locked container (NOTE: Trigger locked and sitting on/under the seat or in the glovebox will NOT comply). Ammo must be also in some sort of locked container (loaded mags are OK, just not in the gun). Ammo can be side-by-side the gunbox in the trunk, that's OK.

If you don't have a trunk, then in a lockbox behind drivers seat or passenger seat (out of reach of the driver is the rule) is OK.

Personally, I wouldn't flaunt the loaded mags on my belt in the office. That's "just cruisin' for bruisin'" . . . it doesn't take much for the narrow-minded to write a new HR policy and use it to hang you with. Thus, leaving the whole works in the car while at work (or lock up the mags in your desk, don't let anyone see them, and don't mention it to anyone) would be a wiser choice IMNSHO.
 
Lucky for me my boss also carries as well as a few of my co-workers.

I could not find any specific reference to if the ammo could be left unattended ( i would say it cannot ).

I carry my .38 on me at all times... I carry two speed loaders on my hip. When I have left my firearm in my vehicle it has been secured with a trigger lock. I also continue to hold onto the ammo.
 
LenS said:
Ammo must be also in some sort of locked container (loaded mags are OK, just not in the gun). Ammo can be side-by-side the gunbox in the trunk, that's OK.
Click to expand...

Thanks much for the info, Len. This is exactly what I was looking for.

As far as the office goes: I don't like the fact that I have to leave the gun in the car, but since I already do that to conform to company policy, I'm happy to hear that I can also have the ammo locked up in the car as well. It's private property, so I'm willing to abide by their rules in order to maintain my employment, no matter how much I disagree. My boss, however, was trying to find a way for me to stop carrying altogether (he doesn't like the fact that my gun is only as far away as my locked car). He was hoping that if I couldn't keep the ammo in the car with the gun, then I'd be screwed and have to leave the gun at home (his initial hope).

I've kept my mags concealed on my belt and don't flaunt them, but I've been forthright with my coworkers, as we are a tight-knit unit (only 6 of us). I realize now the error of my ways. I would have been much better served to have been silent about my efforts to get licensed and trained. The fact that we're all friends outside of work made it more difficult for me to not talk about something I was enjoying, and to believe my getting licensed would cause so many problems. Lesson learned.

derek said:
Watch the language...
Click to expand...

hehehehe...I know it. I've got a lot of Canadian friends (both French and non-French) and they're all pretty liberal/anti-gun. My boss is a good guy and extremely intelligent, but apparently somewhat pig-headed when it comes to the 2nd Amendment.
 
From what you said, I'd cease any further discussion with your boss about firearms.

If he raises the question, I'd "divert" and ask him if he'd like to join you at the range as your guest someday. Play like a politician . . . NEVER answer a question that you don't want to (or could cause you grief).
[twisted]
 
This whole thing is so ridiculous

MGLs say that any handgun left in a car must be Unloaded, and in a locked container (NOTE: Trigger locked and sitting on/under the seat or in the glovebox will NOT comply). Ammo must be also in some sort of locked container (loaded mags are OK, just not in the gun). Ammo can be side-by-side the gunbox in the trunk, that's OK.

OK, let me ask a specific question. If it is OK to have an unloaded gun in the trunk of your car, isn't it also OK to have ammunition in the trunk of your car as well?? Where does this "side by side the gunbox" come from? What gunbox? The law says the locked trunk IS the gunbox. Are you saying that in order to have ammunition in the trunk your gun has to be in a locked box inside the trunk??????

Someone please be clear on this. I do not read the law this way. As I read it, the locked trunk is OK to carry both a firearm and the ammunition in and they do not have to be in locked boxes inside the locked trunk.

Thanks..I'm just trying to understand this
 
Yes, in theory you could have the gun and ammo rattling around the trunk. That would be legal, but NOT a very sensible thing to do and here's why:

- Most LEOs in MA "think" that all guns have to be locked up in a separate box. Educating a LEO that stops you for anything is a "losing proposition" even if you are correct. Not worth the hassle.

* Something to think about: You get a flat tire, a local PO or Trooper stops to help and you open the trunk. He sees guns and ammo scattered loose on the floor of your trunk! You'll have some fancy explaining to do and an almost guaranteed detainment/arrest. [Be advised that MA NEVER expunges arrest records, even if totally wrong ... this is both policy and practice, maybe law too.]

- Don't know about you, but I value my guns and treat them accordingly. I want all of them padded in some way so that they don't ding up something else or each other. Thus a box/padded case/etc.

Many times I put the mags (sometimes loaded, sometimes not) in the same gunbox, lock it and put it in the trunk. That's just me, I know it need not be locked (as the trunk is the locked enclosure) but this is convenient when I transport anything that isn't on my hip. I can put the box down in the house, walk away and still know that I'm legal.
 
I get that part

I'm just trying to be legal. I'm not terribly concerned about the hypthetical situations about what some idiot cop thinks.

I don't let my guns or anything else rattle around in the trunk. I put them in padded cases or range bags. I take care of my equipment.

What I'm talking about is the LEGAL way to carry guns and ammunition in the locked trunk of a car.

I don't mean to be dense about this, but as long as my guns AND ammunition are in the locked trunk, that is legal..isn't that correct?

They DO NOT have to be in seperate locked containers inside the locked trunk. As I read the law, both can be carried in the locked trunk..period.

Am I missing something here? I just want to be precise about the LAW,m not procedures and impressions.

Thanks for the responses.
 
Alright, you're being repetitive and I don't care to be, so here is a "cut 'n paste" of what I stated that directly answers your question. I don't think that I can be any clearer on this issue than this.

LenS said:
Yes, in theory you could have the gun and ammo rattling around the trunk. That would be legal,
Click to expand...
 
Re: sorry

News Shooter said:
PLEASE forgive me for being repetitive. I know that doesn't happen here very often

Thanks for the clarification
Click to expand...

No problem. I was just trying to give you an answer and my Personal opinion on how to proceed (> than the law).

I am an LEO and I can tell you that you do NOT want to tangle with the law, even when you are right and they are wrong. The system is stacked against you/me and having an arrest record for life is something that you will have to explain away forever . . . and will cost jobs/damage your credibility/allow "suitable person" judgments to go against you/etc. [No court awarded monetary damages can make up for all this in a wrongful arrest case. I fail to understand why this state will NOT expunge a record even in a case of a "mistaken identity" or false arrest, but we don't!]

What you decide to do is strictly up to you, I was just pointing out life's "practical gotchas" and how to avoid them.

ETA: I know that the term "wrongful arrest" grammatically sucks, I just can't think of a better way to express it right now in few words.
 
Thanks

I really appreciate your clarification.

Yours is a tough job and I am sensitive and appreciative of that.

I am also sensitive to my rights and duties as a law-abiding citizen. That's why i was trying to get a definitive ruling.

I know this isn't a court of law, but the folks here like yourself are a wealth of information. That's why we come here.

I hope there was no offensive taken.

Best :D
 
LenS said:
From what you said, I'd cease any further discussion with your boss about firearms.

If he raises the question, I'd "divert" and ask him if he'd like to join you at the range as your guest someday. Play like a politician . . . NEVER answer a question that you don't want to (or could cause you grief).
[twisted]
Click to expand...

I think you're absolutely right, with that decision. I haven't invited him yet, but I have invited several other folks. A couple of guys have taken me up on it, and I'll be taking them to Bob's Indoor one of these upcoming Sunday afternoons (at least until I finalize a membership at a club). I'm actually going to have one more conversation with him (let me know how this works, politically): I'm going to thank him for advising me of the updated rules and let him know that I will be more than happy to comply with company policy. No longer will he need worry that I will have any ammunition on my person in the office.

And then my attitude will be "never let us speak of it again".

I picked up a couple of small, lockable cases last night (one that will easily hold a couple of handguns and a smaller one that will hold several mags and a box of ammo) that will be going in the car today. Now I just need to figure out how to store my gun/ammo "legally" when I ride my motorcycle. I guess that's a good reason to get lockable saddlebags :)
 
I would let it go and not have the conversation. Keep inviting co-workers to the range until they're hooked and buy their own firearms. Then, when everyone's going to the range invite him along.
 
I bought my first pistol yesterday and while I'm telling you all here, I am not telling associates and family. I do not carry concealed, I'm determined to obey the law, but for the moment at least, I choose not to make this a matter of discussion. If I choose to carry concealed occasionally, it will be after formal training and it will be a private matter.

If I ever, God forbid, need to use a firearm for defense, I feel that it would be a small advantage to have it unknown that I was armed. I cannot tell you how much that I hope this situation never arises.
 
TonyD said:
I would let it go and not have the conversation. Keep inviting co-workers to the range until they're hooked and buy their own firearms. Then, when everyone's going to the range invite him along.
Click to expand...

Now, that's devious. Nice idea, Tony. Makes it really hard for the boss to refuse to go without losing face. After he shoots and LIKES it, watch his attitude change. I LOVE getting new shooters hooked after their first time to the range.
 
dvl said:
I bought my first pistol yesterday and while I'm telling you all here, I am not telling associates and family. I do not carry concealed, I'm determined to obey the law, but for the moment at least, I choose not to make this a matter of discussion. If I choose to carry concealed occasionally, it will be after formal training and it will be a private matter.

If I ever, God forbid, need to use a firearm for defense, I feel that it would be a small advantage to have it unknown that I was armed. I cannot tell you how much that I hope this situation never arises.
Click to expand...

What did you get?
 
derek, I got a Smith 1911PD. I've been wanting a 1911 for a long time and now I have one. I'm itching to take it out, but that may have to wait for a long time, like tonight or tomorrow.
 
dvl said:
derek, I got a Smith 1911PD. I've been wanting a 1911 for a long time and now I have one. I'm itching to take it out, but that may have to wait for a long time, like tonight or tomorrow.
Click to expand...


[lol] [lol] [lol] Sweet!
 
dvl said:
derek, I got a Smith 1911PD. I've been wanting a 1911 for a long time and now I have one. I'm itching to take it out, but that may have to wait for a long time, like tonight or tomorrow.
Click to expand...


Congrats on your Purchase --- I hear those are a "blast" :)

I cannot always offer it but if someone here ever wants to hit a range as my guest I would be more than happy to show them the HHRG club in Haverhill.
 
dirtypacman,

I cannot always offer it but if someone here ever wants to hit a range as my guest I would be more than happy to show them the HHRG club in Haverhill.
Click to expand...

{raising hand}

HHRG club is on my short list of gun clubs to check out. I'd love to go check it out, and having a member to show me around would be even better...
 
Sorry bout the Hijack of the thread:


I would be more than happy---- I will most likely be going to the club next Sunday 24th--- a few other NEShooters will be there... I could meet you directly and take you around the club :) I may even go by this Sunday afternoon but thats only tentative--- PM me if interested
 
Re: Thanks

News Shooter said:
I really appreciate your clarification.

Yours is a tough job and I am sensitive and appreciative of that.

I am also sensitive to my rights and duties as a law-abiding citizen. That's why i was trying to get a definitive ruling.

I know this isn't a court of law, but the folks here like yourself are a wealth of information. That's why we come here.

I hope there was no offensive taken.

Best :D
Click to expand...

Thanks.

No offense taken. Just trying to help.

Most of you folks know more about the gun laws than the average cop on the street. It's a convoluted mess and nonsensical at best.
 
Jay G said:
{raising hand}

HHRG club is on my short list of gun clubs to check out. I'd love to go check it out, and having a member to show me around would be even better...
Click to expand...

Jay, we'd be happy to take you over, but things are a bit busy this week. Between DH or me, we should be able to get you over there.
 

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