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H&K Coming to MA!!!
- Thread starter whatluck
- Start date
They (the 4 models mentioned) were on the roster like 2+ years ago, maybe longer. That's how long this "HK is coming to MA" meme has been going.
-Mike
I guess I won't hold my breath, and stick to my Sigs then.
![[sad]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/004.gif "Sad [sad]")
For the record, Coakley does NOT confirm anything.
If she objects, they get a cease & desist order, order to retrieve every gun sold in MA, under the cloud of a $5K fine/gun to BOTH the mfr and dealer.
Mfr must "self-certify" to sell in MA, that's how the system works.
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2008
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Isn't that funny I heard that rumor too, only it was 10 years ago.
![[popcorn]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/043.gif "Popcorn [popcorn]")
HKs as a general rule are a "love or hate it" kind of brand. They also retain their value moderately well in MA, unlike a lot of other handguns, so the seller can probably get most of the money back that they put into it. In the past couple of years there have also been a flood of LE trade in USPs in .40 S+W, among other things. Lots of pre-98 exempt USP .40s, and the like. (which can be legally imported via a dealer from anywhere. )
So, the short answer is, no, there's no "conspiracy" afoot.
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
-Mike
I love the P7, but.... frankly, there isn't a huge demand for a $1200-$1600 handgun (With magazines that cost $50+ apiece) that gets too hot to hold after firing 60 rounds through it. The gun is complicated and expensive to produce (eg, ill suited to modern factory processes) so that makes it unattractive to HK's bottom line profits.
-Mike
Number 6
NES Member
Not really thinking "conspiracy" so to speak...just people are rational actors and like in the stock market, if you have inside information (or THINK you have good inside information) you trade on it. If new USPs are being sold at Four Seasons, chances are I'm not going to be able to get my money back on that $1k pre-1998 pristine USP in the safe.
But otherwise I think you're right.
But otherwise I think you're right.
HKs as a general rule are a "love or hate it" kind of brand. They also retain their value moderately well in MA, unlike a lot of other handguns, so the seller can probably get most of the money back that they put into it. In the past couple of years there have also been a flood of LE trade in USPs in .40 S+W, among other things. Lots of pre-98 exempt USP .40s, and the like. (which can be legally imported via a dealer from anywhere. )
So, the short answer is, no, there's no "conspiracy" afoot.
-Mike
+1 I love the P7 as well. I would pay a premium for an updated version of the squeeze cocker design. It's hard to imagine a mass market appeal though.
I suppose there's some credibility to that. That said, they'd be foolish to "bet" on something becoming compliant. My guess is they simply owned the gun, it sat around in the safe for awhile, and they simply don't like it taking up space anymore. We get a wave of (insert brand here) every year around this time. A crappy economy the past few years also plays into used gun sales. The guns liked the least tend to get sold first.
-Mike
Yup. If I had the cash, I'd get one for its coolness factor. But it would likely spend a lot of time keeping my other safe queens company.
Thanks for the offer. I might take you up on that sometime.
What I was getting at is that this gun is commanding top dollar right now because there is a limited supply. I bet they could still do very well if they restarted the supply of these and brought the price down considerably from where it is now. This would surely be a hit.
A hit? I doubt it. The price wasn't the only thing that kept this a niche gun. Squeeze cocking is different and then there are all the drawbacks of the gas system.
I guess I don't know the ins and outs of H&K and how they market their guns.
I thought these guns were very expensive due to high demand and low supply. This is why I made the suggestion. Apparently, I hit a sore spot for people, or otherwise stirred something up. I find it odd that just putting together a few observations and making a suggestion would develop such a discussion.
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
. Is there any hk that you don't have two of?
Certainly, if the supply was greater the price would be lower. That said, even if HK decided to mass produce them, I believe that they would never approach the price of a Glock. The P7 has significant additional complexity in the design -- squeeze cocker and gas system -- and those complexities add cost.
If the price was lower, would HK sell more? Sure. But would it be "a hit." Sorry, but I just disagree. The HK P7M8 is a relatively large, single-stack 9mm. How many 9mm guns that large with a capacity of 8+1 are very popular? Furthermore, the squeeze cocking system is just different. And then there's the "60 rounds and it is now very hot" issue. I've read that the P7 is relatively hard to find a good holster for, due to its relatively short slide and heavy butt, but I don't have any direct experience with that.
I'd love to have a P7. It is a very neat design, with some significant advantages. But it also has some very significant disadvantages, and I just don't see it as being anything other than a niche gun, even if the price were significantly lower. YMMV.
Sore spot? No. I just disagree with you.
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Let me offer some perspective about the P7M8 squeeze-cocker.
In 1999 these were plentiful (Four Seasons, Village Gunsmith, etc. all had them). They were supposedly NJSP guns that were factory refurbed. They were sold (like hotcakes) for $700 each, used, with an ugly grind mark (done as part of factory refurb) on the slide and re-blued purple! IIRC, new ones were ~$1100 each anywhere.
They would easily pass the EOPS and AG Regs requirements (largely due to the squeeze-cocker design).
My non-expert opinion is that they are a very expensive to produce, niche market item and thus H&K probably has no interest in building any more of them.
[Please Note: In 1999, no List had been issued yet and thus dealers were free to sell anything in spite of the 1998 law. So the above info does not involve any "warped market forces" of low supply, high demand.]
In 1999 these were plentiful (Four Seasons, Village Gunsmith, etc. all had them). They were supposedly NJSP guns that were factory refurbed. They were sold (like hotcakes) for $700 each, used, with an ugly grind mark (done as part of factory refurb) on the slide and re-blued purple! IIRC, new ones were ~$1100 each anywhere.
They would easily pass the EOPS and AG Regs requirements (largely due to the squeeze-cocker design).
My non-expert opinion is that they are a very expensive to produce, niche market item and thus H&K probably has no interest in building any more of them.
[Please Note: In 1999, no List had been issued yet and thus dealers were free to sell anything in spite of the 1998 law. So the above info does not involve any "warped market forces" of low supply, high demand.]
And, as usual, the AG regs and EOPS list are responsible for the high price of P7s in this state. If it weren't for those, a used P7 would be reasonably priced.
http://www.topgunsupply.com/h-k-p7-psp.html (out of stock now but they often get more in)
Paul, I can't speak to the model you noted. BUT take a look here for the P7M8 and tell me "MA is the problem"! Most of these guns are available in "free states" and the prices are still sky-high. [If it cost $700 (free market price) used in 1999, it's not going to be $500 . . . the $1200+ price is truly market price on these guns today anywhere.]
http://www.gunsamerica.com/Search.htm?T=P7M8
Ah, sorry Len. The difference is the "M8" part which I believe gives you the newer style HK mag release, as opposed to the heal catch. So you definitely have a point.
Still though, while the P7M8 is expensive in free states, I'm sure it's even worse here.
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