Firearms and the eldery

[djmefitz]

Here is an interesting topic that I must now look into. My father in law, an former NRA handgun instructor, is not doing well health wise. All this happened very quickly. He was diagnosed with vascular dementia and is already showing signs of forgetfulness. An aunt's father in-law has the same thing very advanced and in mostly sleeping when he is not screaming or threatening people. I am aware what I am showing is two ends of the spectrum, but this type of dementia does effects reasoning. I fully understand how when feels there guns are taken away. My younger brother committed suicide last April and I surrendered my key to family members because my children were scared. I got it back after I asked for it four months later.

At what point do you decide they should not have firearms?

 

[MisterHappy]

Each case is different. like when it's time to turn in the car keys, or get an aide in. Teh only person that can make the decision, IMO is someone that's competent with guns and knows the situation in detail.

I was involved in a similar situation (not directly, fortuantely) and the guns being passed down within the family made it more palatable to the Oldster.

I feel for you .....

 

[clerk.mvgc]

My Dad was diagnosed with Vascular dimensia around 2005 or so (he passed last Dec). Early on he realized he was not thinking correctly and in a lucid moment he asked me to take his guns as he was afraid he would hurt himself or another. This turned out to be a Godsend because as the disease progressed he became more and more combative and eventually spent the last 2 years of his life in a nursing home totally disoriented and angry. Several incidents percipitated his "incarceration" in the nursing home that could have been catastrophic had he had access to a firearm. My advice is to remove the firearms while he may still understand the reasoning and before he deteriorates to where an accident or worse may occur. Perhaps if he knows his guns are going to a deserving famliy member it may lessen his feelings of loss.

Good luck and be prepared for a long road, watching someone you love go down hill with this disease really sucks.

 

[Jose]

My younger brother committed suicide last April and I surrendered my key to family members because my children were scared.

So instead of soothing your children by letting them know that nothing would happen to you, you just validated their fears.

Good job.

It also sounds like some family members "demanded" that you surrender your key. Me? I would just have told them to go to hell and mind their own business.

But I'm just a dick.

 

[Spanz]

Good luck! I had to trick my dad into signing over his guns to me when he started thinking there was a bomb in his closet (a safe with digital lock), and started sleeping with a loaded colt .45 under his pillow. My mom was not amused.

The story I used was that in MA he needed to properly lock up the guns, and I had a big "approved" safe to do it. After I grabbed them....he kind of forgot about them.

 

[djmefitz]

Good job.

It also sounds like some family members "demanded" that you surrender your key. Me? I would just have told them to go to hell and mind their own business.

But I'm just a dick.[/QUOTE]

I'm going to break a rule of mine and respond while I'm pissed.
One don't ever tell someone that they did something wrong in a decision they made for there kids. My youngest daughter was scared, there is nothing I wouldn’t do for her. She wanted to feel comfortable while grieving so I made it so.

As for you being a dick, it sounds like you couldn't have been the pillar of support I was described as in the months following this. I helped everyone else, while dealing with it on my own. The only regret I have during the months and weeks that followed was supporting his bitch soon to be ex wife, (who happens to live next door as they bought the house 6 yrs ago when they married) She is now taking here anger she once had for him out on me. He moved out but never filed for divorce, so she gets everything and is suing me for the watch and chain she gave me at first. This is after I offered emotional and financial support for her. It was only after she wouldn't give the ashes back and her lawyer made it clear I had no right to them and I would never see them that it went down hill.

Sorry for the rant but that really pissed me off. I merely gave my key away for little bit, and my daughters are now fine with me shooting. the youngest is still upset when she sees them, so I clean them in workshop. I think overtime her fears will lessen, but I prefer the velvet glove approach with kids over the hammer.

 

[Jose]

Each of us handles things differently. You do your thing and I do mine.

 

[jobowker]

This is something that varies greatly case by case, for both the person person afflicted and the "strong one" in the family who is expected to make the tough calls. My dad had brain cancer when he was 67. One day he was fine, building a new set of steps & landing for the front door of the house and rewiring a couple of circuits in the house and a week later he couldn't find the house we grew up in. Radiation and chemo reduced the size of the tumor, but cut his IQ in half. He decided to take up smoking again after quitting for 25 years, and he obviously wasn't safe behind the wheel.

Taking away his license would have killed him, so instead I asked him not to drive until the doctor cleared him. That was a tough conversation to have, knowing full well he would never drive again and that the average survival rate for what he had was 9-12 months. I took both sets of his keys to my house and disconnected the battery. We closed his credit card but let him keep the plastic.

I think he had an idea, especially during a lucid period, that this wasn't going to be something he could beat, and he hinted that he would be ok with me moving some of his guns to my house, since I'd be using them more than him at least for the short term.

It wasn't easy. It's going to be difficult no matter what you do, and only get harder. Good luck.

 

[George D]

Not a good situation to be in, sorry to hear about it. I was storing guns for someone with a similar scenario and it was a bit touchy. If you are in MA, you should definitely read the inheritance thread in the MA laws section to make sure you aren't going to have issues later.

 

[edin508]

I "share", a safe with my father.
Things got moved into it a few years ago. He doesn't know the combo and I am not so sure he remembers what he has in there in the first place.
Easier this way.

 

[Rider]

The most common situation is that family members refuse to give up control, whether it be money, freedom, property, or guns. If it wasn't so sad, it would be funny seeing your parents get angry at you for trying to safeguard the things they want you to have someday anyhow.

The best thing you can do is talk to your elders ahead of time and encourage them to plan ahead, but it's hard. A now well-documented situation is that the Boomers can't come to terms with their own mortality. Having recently come to terms with putting their own parents in homes and getting their inheritances while their parents are alive, they are sitting on two generations of wealth and refusing to give anything to their kids or handle estate planning because they are afraid their kids will do to them what they did to their parents.

And the lawyers are making a killing.

 

[FreeWillie]

Here is an interesting topic that I must now look into. My father in law, an former NRA handgun instructor, is not doing well health wise. All this happened very quickly. He was diagnosed with vascular dementia and is already showing signs of forgetfulness. An aunt's father in-law has the same thing very advanced and in mostly sleeping when he is not screaming or threatening people. I am aware what I am showing is two ends of the spectrum, but this type of dementia does effects reasoning. I fully understand how when feels there guns are taken away. My younger brother committed suicide last April and I surrendered my key to family members because my children were scared. I got it back after I asked for it four months later.

At what point do you decide they should not have firearms?

Give him a safe as a gift, put his guns in it, don't tell him the combination. He keeps his guns and you are a good son for giving him a great gift. Problem solved.

 

[el duderino]

It sucks but its a good idea at the very least have access to them, in case they do become violent and in a place like MA they could be found unsuitable and have their firearms siezed and they might be gone before you get the chance to claim them.