If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership The benefits pay for the membership many times over.
Be sure to enter the NES/MFS May Giveaway ***Canik METE SFX***
Have you ever chambered a round, forgot to decock, and then holstered? Or chambered, forgot to decock, and then surprised yourself with a super light pull?
Is this a concern?
I know, training = safety...
Why not carry cocked and locked? I carry my 1911, HK45 and P238 condition 1.
In the firearms accumulation game, one also accumulates various safety, decocker variants. Human nature being what it is it could be easy to forget what firearm/decocker style your packing in the heat of the moment or even on the range (you're so used to shooting that striker fired, you chamber and forget your now in SA mode not striker fired).
The same negatives that apply to manual safeties (forget to activate/deactivate) could apply to da/sa.
the funny part is that a DA/SA gun loaded and holstered while in single action is really no different than most striker guns with 4.5# triggers. it's the same.
Not quite, because a lot of DA/SA handguns break at a lot less than 4.5 pounds with the hammer cocked. Not to mention the obvious differences in pull length, etc. Plus 4.5 pounds on a striker gun is an anomaly or a really slicked up gun.
The closest example I've seen your example come to is a Steyr M series. Those ****ing guns, trigger doesnt move far at all, and despite the like 4 lb weight it feels like nothing. Least it has a trigger safety.
-Mike
Pyromancer, be careful holstering or drawing with da/sa cocked is great way shoot yourself.l
You need to be slower, and pay attendion to what your doing.
its not a toy...read the manual...practice. soon you wont even having to think
I don't know that I'd trust dropping a Sig classic DA/SA with the hammer cocked. I thought once in SA that some internal safeties were removed. I know they are quality pistols but I wouldn't want to test your theory.the funny part is that a DA/SA gun loaded and holstered while in single action is really no different than most striker guns with 4.5# triggers. it's the same. they're still drop safe and can only fire if trigger is pulled. A walther PPQ, HK VP9 or M&P pistol are all fully cocked strikers. same crap.
the idea of decocking has nothing to do with inherent safety of the gun, just the heavier DA trigger providing larger margin of error for the operator without having an ND.
as per above I just train to decock every time the gun comes back down from firing. this is how I was taught. it's pretty easy to build that into one's so called "muscle memory".
A stock Sig or HK single action trigger is no shorter or lighter than many striker guns such as VP9, PPQ or canik. people install a 3.5# connector on a glock and again it's on par with many stock SA trigger pulls.
I don't know that I'd trust dropping a Sig classic DA/SA with the hammer cocked. I thought once in SA that some internal safeties were removed. I know they are quality pistols but I wouldn't want to test your theory.
There are no safeties on classic p series pistols.
A stock Sig or HK single action trigger is no shorter or lighter than many striker guns such as VP9, PPQ or canik. people install a 3.5# connector on a glock and again it's on par with many stock SA trigger pulls.
I have 5 Da/SA Sigs and must respectfully disagree.
You are correctThere's definitely a firing pin safety that gets deactivated when you pull the trigger on a P series Sig.
-Mike
If you got a good one or a Legion, they're probably all under 4 lbs.
If you got a shit one (eg a generic p series made on the wrong day after nipplehead CEO Cohen took over) you probably have a 6 pound wall puncher in play.
I've had a bunch of both...
-Mike
There are internal safeties. Like the ones that prevent the hammer from contacting the firing pin when dropped.There are no safeties on classic p series pistols.
No, it's not. The sig P series I owned routinely broke at less than 4 lbs in SA mode, or at least they felt pretty damned light. I had some other ones that were probably on the other end of the scale as well. (my P229s sucked and felt like punching through a wall, bet they were over 6 lbs). That said, my lightest Glock trigger with a 3.5 in it is still just barely under 5 lbs. A 3.5 connector does not yield a 3.5 pound pull, not even close. (unless someone's monkeyed with the striker spring. )
Also, the take up slop in a USP or a Sig P series literally doesn't count. It practically weighs nothing so its like it's not even there. (take a pull gauge and you'll see what im talking about, initial vs peak pull. A cocked DA/SA handgun has little weight in the "slop phase" before it gets to the point of having to apply pressure to cause the sear to break.
I just think comparing the mechanics of the two systems is stupid to the point of absurdity. Not to mention every striker fired system is different, as well. Not to mention some DA/SA handguns might change the dynamics of the drop safety system, etc, when the handgun is cocked.
-Mike
There's definitely a firing pin safety that gets deactivated when you pull the trigger on a P series Sig.
-Mike
I wouldn't forget, I'll just leave it at that. It's kinda hard not to- the guns that have decockers nearly all weigh like 9000 lbs, are the width of a school bus (in some cases) and none of them look or feel like my Glocks or P320s do. Also nearly everything with a decocker has a hammer on it, and the striker fired guns without a hammer, that decock (like a Walther P99) have a striker indicator on them.
Even at my peak when I owned like 26 handguns, I never seemed to have a problem with this. I also don't "rush to holster" guns though, either, which probably helps.
-Mike
If you got a good one or a Legion, they're probably all under 4 lbs.
If you got a shit one (eg a generic p series made on the wrong day after nipplehead CEO Cohen took over) you probably have a 6 pound wall puncher in play.
I've had a bunch of both...
-Mike
Im fairly new to the game, trying to connect the dots...in addition to the usual safety rules I'm also trying to establish some additional personal rules, based on my understanding of human nature. When dealing with properly operating firearms, the operator is the weakest link in the safety equation. A LOT of our guns could be thrown out of a moving car, and not fired. Distracted, startled, or groggy operator and all bets are off. And that's before taking into account normal, or above normal, levels of stupid.
To that end I've mostly purchased guns that operate the same: Insert magazine, rack slide, shoot. If equipled with safety, safety sweeps down to shoot a la 1911 or AR. K.I.S.S. principle.
Very interested in experiences with DA/SA, LEM, DAK etc.