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Cub Scout camp at Chicopee Sportstmen’s Club in Granby canceled over safety concerns

After controversial decision to stop Cub Scouts camp at gun club, Granby Board of Health plans Wednesday meeting
Updated Jul 16, 7:30 PM; Posted Jul 16, 7:11 PM


GRANBY — The Board of Health had “grave concerns” about the safety of Cub Scouts preparing to attend a day camp at a gun club in town, Chairman Richard Bombardier said. But the board also violated the state’s Open Meeting Law when it prevented the camp from going forward, he said.

The board plans to meet Wednesday at 11:15 a.m. at the municipal building, 215B West State St. One member said it will be an opportunity for the public to ask questions about the decision.
 
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Rob Boudrie said:
Perhaps they are actually concerned that the cub scouts will find shooting to be an interesting activity and come home with a positive image of gun ownership.
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Our troop tries to do a "shooting sports weekend" every April... right when the new kids cross over from Cubs, basically end of 5th grade. Teach rifle and shotgun for merit badges. Pretty much all the kids want to do it, and although the parents might be "anti", it's hard to tell your kid that he can't go on a scout trip with all his buddies because of the material being taught. We've even had a couple moms show up for the day to "watch" and end up shooting for the first time... baby steps.
 
EMTDAD said:
Our troop tries to do a "shooting sports weekend" every April... right when the new kids cross over from Cubs, basically end of 5th grade. Teach rifle and shotgun for merit badges. Pretty much all the kids want to do it, and although the parents might be "anti", it's hard to tell your kid that he can't go on a scout trip with all his buddies because of the material being taught. We've even had a couple moms show up for the day to "watch" and end up shooting for the first time... baby steps.
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This is a great post and your last sentence jogged a memory:


 
EMTDAD said:
Our troop tries to do a "shooting sports weekend" every April... right when the new kids cross over from Cubs, basically end of 5th grade. Teach rifle and shotgun for merit badges. Pretty much all the kids want to do it, and although the parents might be "anti", it's hard to tell your kid that he can't go on a scout trip with all his buddies because of the material being taught. We've even had a couple moms show up for the day to "watch" and end up shooting for the first time... baby steps.
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Same thing I just went through in June at WGC. Boy scouts had a day of shooting there. One boy had his mom and sister come along. They shot .22 rifles and they even shot a little trap. The mom use my 12 ga. o/u. She did great. Found out her daughter who fired a gun for the very first time ever, my Ruger American bolt action .22 knows my daughter. Small world. Anyway, they all had a great time. The parents and the scout leaders and the kids couldn't thank us enough. One scout leader asked what needed to be done to get his LTC. The guy running it does classes so I pointed him in that direction. So a good day when a mild interest turns into a guy getting his LTC. Don't know if he did or not but he had the interest at the time.
 
JAD said:
In most places there are regulations that are applicable to day camps and the facilities that they use and certain protocols surrounding their operation. In many places there are inspection processes before camps can operate and sometimes unannounced visits by officials from certain agencies while programs are in session.
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This is true. However these inspections are very specific and the health inspectors should be able to point to the exact reasons why they, in accordance with regulations, shut down the camp. If they cannot point to an actual, specific health hazard, then the parents and the BSA may have cause to take action against the Granby BOH.

And I hope they do.
 
FPrice said:
This is true. However these inspections are very specific and the health inspectors should be able to point to the exact reasons why they, in accordance with regulations, shut down the camp. If they cannot point to an actual, specific health hazard, then the parents and the BSA may have cause to take action against the Granby BOH.

And I hope they do.
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Exactly. This is their lead quote and they managed to get 'feelings' in there twice. Feelings are not regulatory.

“The board felt very strongly that having active firing going on in the vicinity … was a thing that we felt is too much of a safety concern for children,” Bombardier said.



 
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FPrice said:
This is true. However these inspections are very specific and the health inspectors should be able to point to the exact reasons why they, in accordance with regulations, shut down the camp. If they cannot point to an actual, specific health hazard, then the parents and the BSA may have cause to take action against the Granby BOH.

And I hope they do.
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Plenty of government inspectors start to get into "over reach". I deal with USDA inspectors at work regularly. I had one close my freezer warehouse down in the middle of the night once because she "felt" that a row of staged pallets was not safe and blocking the emergency exit door. I got the cell phone call, got out of bed and drove in to see her. First....the staging rows we have set up are in accordance with OSHA regulation. Painted lines on the floor and everything. She took me into the freezer and pointe to the staged row and said I don't think this is safe it's not a wide enough lane for people to get by. I said show me the regulation your using to determine this. She said I don't have that. I said that's right because your a USDA inspector not an OSHA inspector and you have no authority to shut down the warehouse if you can't quote the reg. She actually agreed and walked away.

Sometimes you just gotta call bullshit when you smell it.
 
SERE said:
After controversial decision to stop Cub Scouts camp at gun club, Granby Board of Health plans Wednesday meeting
Updated Jul 16, 7:30 PM; Posted Jul 16, 7:11 PM


GRANBY — The Board of Health had “grave concerns” about the safety of Cub Scouts preparing to attend a day camp at a gun club in town, Chairman Richard Bombardier said. But the board also violated the state’s Open Meeting Law when it prevented the camp from going forward, he said.

The board plans to meet Wednesday at 11:15 a.m. at the municipal building, 215B West State St. One member said it will be an opportunity for the public to ask questions about the decision.
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Who is going to be there at 11:15?
 
they deemed the club as "one site". where the cub scouts would have doing their activities was over 400 plus feet from the first seat of the range. It was in their opinion that it was a significant risk of the children's safety. based on no evidence, law, bi-law or code. when questioned then why has it been ok for 6 years? their reply was that they didn't know shooting was happening on the property at the same time the day campers would be there. As for breaking the open meeting laws, they deemed it an emergency so that they could make a decision. The scout staff was well prepared and has all of necessary training.
 
I hope that someone from GOAL and Comm2A have seen this thread. If what I suspect happened, did happen, then this could lead to a legal case.
 
“When it’s all done, we have to stand up and say we took the stand to make sure no kid gets killed,” Bombardier said.
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Sanctimonious, holier-than-thou pile of subhuman trash. This smug piece of crap uses KIDS to get his anti agenda pushed. Unbelievable.
 
whacko said:
Plenty of government inspectors start to get into "over reach". I deal with USDA inspectors at work...

Sometimes you just gotta call bullshit when you smell it.
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Likewise. I deal with FDA and customer auditors daily. It’s amazing the personal beliefs they try to pass off as regulation.

I looked at Granby’s Health dept web page. It lists their published regulations in line with NH 147.1 and nothing approaching this case is listed.
I also looked at NH HHS web page and found a Health Dept Inspectors Training program here
Www.dhhs.nh.gov/dphs/holu/documents/ho-enforcement-duties.pdf

It does not provide anything I could see that would empower a Health Dept to shut down this camp based on an activity and no regulation about what safety provisions should be in place for archery, target shooting etc. despite the presence of detailed requirement for swimming pools. NH law require pubslished regulations and standards and in their absence there is nothing to enforce.
I’d say they are Very Much Vulnerable on the procedural level and suggest pushing there rather than belief this is anti-firearms
Best of luck
 
my daughters are at that venture scout overnight camp. This morning they did ATV's. Right now they are shooting trap. I feel like I am missing their first steps...lmao. My older daughter sent me a video of my younger daughter calling "pull" and then hitting the clay. Totally awesome. I need to go buy a 20 ga gun so I can shoot with them.

the wife is going to be pissed....lol

This is the type of stuff these idiots are trying to eliminate. That cannot happen. These activities are great for the kids.
 
EMTDAD said:
technically, the Cubs (K-5th grade) can only shoot BBs. Boy scouts can shoot .22 rifle and shotgun. No handguns IIRC.
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yeah you're right, it was BBs in cub/webelo and 22s as a boy scout.

Someone needs to invent an alternative to Boy Scouts now that the once great organization has caved into liberal nonsense and allows girls.
 
Engineer said:
Likewise. I deal with FDA and customer auditors daily. It’s amazing the personal beliefs they try to pass off as regulation.

I looked at Granby’s Health dept web page. It lists their published regulations in line with NH 147.1 and nothing approaching this case is listed.
I also looked at NH HHS web page and found a Health Dept Inspectors Training program here
Www.dhhs.nh.gov/dphs/holu/documents/ho-enforcement-duties.pdf

It does not provide anything I could see that would empower a Health Dept to shut down this camp based on an activity and no regulation about what safety provisions should be in place for archery, target shooting etc. despite the presence of detailed requirement for swimming pools. NH law require pubslished regulations and standards and in their absence there is nothing to enforce.
I’d say they are Very Much Vulnerable on the procedural level and suggest pushing there rather than belief this is anti-firearms
Best of luck
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Granby is in MA.
 
jhblaze1 said:
yeah you're right, it was BBs in cub/webelo and 22s as a boy scout.

Someone needs to invent an alternative to Boy Scouts now that the once great organization has caved into liberal nonsense and allows girls.
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yeah.. I know I was angry at first.. I do think it's GREAT that girls get to do all the cool stuff the boys do. Too bad Girl Scouts was stuck in the 1960s. They blew a real good opportunity which BSA took advantage of. The boys and girls are mixed in the Cub Scout ranks, but the Scout Troops are not co-ed. In addition to the obvious teen issues, it just would cause too much challenge with 2 deep leadership and having to have 2 men and 2 women scout leaders minimum on every trip. Hard enough to get parents to volunteer for simple jobs.

the alternative is Trail Life USA but they are not that common.
 

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