Can I hold onto someone else's guns

[LukeIronSight]

Mass is biased against men. Without a proven history of violence or an incident where the cops catch her assaulting him the judge/Clerk wont sign off on it. She will ultimately take out a cross complaint and get the 209a.

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On the contract sir, She would need proof for a 209A. He would not need any "history of viol e for a simple restraining order.
Remember an Abuse Prevention order (209A) is different than a simple harassment restraint order. But the idea is to have it filed, no motion. With it filled, the argument becomes much more compelling on his favor, id filed for a minor defamation of character suit as well.


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[UNSUB]

On the contract sir, She would need proof for a 209A. He would not need any "history of viol e for a simple restraining order.
Remember an Abuse Prevention order (209A) is different than a simple harassment restraint order. But the idea is to have it filed, no motion. With it filled, the argument becomes much more compelling on his favor, id filed for a minor defamation of character suit as well.


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Actually she does not she needs to convey a perceived threat. There is not a clerk or Judge that will not move the application forward. If they are wrong the ramifications are life and death and professional suicide. A 209A is a legal shield that only becomes a criminal action if it is violated. Men generally are not given the same treatment by the court. If you don't believe the courts treat men differently why don't fathers get custody of their kids when they are upstanding working citizens and their spouses may not be. I've seen drug addled women, alcoholics, and severe mental illness be given their kids back instead of the father who has no issues. I'm not dumbing this down to be foolish, I'm trying to show you there are basic biases in the system. If a police officer shows up for a domestic call who do you think are asked to leave the domicile more often men or women when the argument isn't clear. Im not boo hooing and saying oh poor men. These are real realities applied in the real world. Not some imaginary textbook scenario.

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[MachineHead]

Do it first thing tomorrow. Don't wait.

This.

The worst thing you can do is wait. I told my gf's brother to transfer them to his father even though she never filed an RO but they were getting divorced and she was very conniving. It's a safety net worth the transfer fee and more.

Ironically, his lawyer told him the same info a week later, but it had already been done.

OP, I hope your nephew is a 10-steps-ahead thinker, but if not, may he listen to someone who is.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Unsub, no apologies needed, even as a Constable most of the lawyers I've worked with are not on my list of "desirables"!

Tell him to look in to installing a location tracking app on his smartphone. Could be useful in proving that he was/wasn't at a specific location at a specific time. If she accused him of showing up somewhere and threatening her it could be used as evidence that she is a crazy bitch.

Judges in MA are unlikely to care what the guy has to say or what "evidence" he might have, the 209A will be issued against him, period.

Mass is biased against men. Without a proven history of violence or an incident where the cops catch her assaulting him the judge/Clerk wont sign off on it. She will ultimately take out a cross complaint and get the 209a.

Actually she does not she needs to convey a perceived threat. There is not a clerk or Judge that will not move the application forward. If they are wrong the ramifications are life and death and professional suicide. A 209A is a legal shield that only becomes a criminal action if it is violated. Men generally are not given the same treatment by the court. If you don't believe the courts treat men differently why don't fathers get custody of their kids when they are upstanding working citizens and their spouses may not be. I've seen drug addled women, alcoholics, and severe mental illness be given their kids back instead of the father who has no issues. I'm not dumbing this down to be foolish, I'm trying to show you there are basic biases in the system. If a police officer shows up for a domestic call who do you think are asked to leave the domicile more often men or women when the argument isn't clear. Im not boo hooing and saying oh poor men. These are real realities applied in the real world. Not some imaginary textbook scenario.

^^^^^^ This!

 

[robjax]

My concern would be that if you hold them for him and she decides to file a R.O. for whatever reason, the police will take his L.T.C. and will be looking for the guns. If they have in fact been transferred to you then they are yours, and should be the end of that discussion.

I agree with this. Transfer them and when his situation resolves you can transfer them back to him. It's cheaper to do it that way rather than losing your crap and having to hire a lawyer to try and get it back for you after the fact.

 

[jhagberg88]

Do the FA-10's or go to a gun shop and officially transfer them, don't leave anything to chance.

 

[dcmdon]

My concern would be that if you hold them for him and she decides to file a R.O. for whatever reason, the police will take his L.T.C. and will be looking for the guns. If they have in fact been transferred to you then they are yours, and should be the end of that discussion.

This is the winning answer. They should be out of his name in addition to being outside of the home.

If he has a lot of guns, in excess of the 4 guns per year limit. He has 3 choices.

1) Go to a dealer and have them do the transfer - This is the lowest risk, but most expensive route. Most dealers will give you a deal if you are doing a bunch of transfers all at once. Also considering the circumstances, most will really cut you a deal.

2) deleted because it was wrong.

3) Separate the firearms into uppers and lowers. Sell the lowers yourself to someone you know for a dollar. Its a legal transfer. But you aren't bound by the 4 gun limit because the MA doesn't consider them to be firearms. Do a very thorough and detailed itemized bill of sale for your records. Send the slides and uppers to a different friend to keep things on the up and up.

Don

 

[Len-2A Training]

Bad advice again Don!

2) Won't fly. 209A is the MA version of the Sen. Frank Lautenberg (NJ) Act and REQUIRES confiscation in any/every state. Documented case of this and Manchester NH PD did the confiscation for the MA PD. Refuse to tell where they are and you face C. 269 S. 10(i) charges that will stick (see Post #22 above) and make you a Federally PP for life!

3) PD isn't going to buy this, based on no FA-10 showing guns are gone, they are either going to round up the parts or prosecute and let you sort it out in front of a Marsupial Judge!

 

[Racenet]

My concern would be that if you hold them for him and she decides to file a R.O. for whatever reason, the police will take his L.T.C. and will be looking for the guns. If they have in fact been transferred to you then they are yours, and should be the end of that discussion.

Guns? What guns?

 

[Asaltweapon]

Sorry but I'm with Len on this.

They need to go into a FFL book for the paper trail to be complete. Even if the FFL charges you a few bucks it's money well spent. Also nobody gives a crap if a $2000 gun sold for a buck.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Sorry but I'm with Len on this.

They need to go into a FFL book for the paper trail to be complete. Even if the FFL charges you a few bucks it's money well spent. Also nobody gives a crap if a $2000 gun sold for a buck.

When they get confiscated, the owner gets $0.00 and Village Vault gets the money, so fair market value is less of an issue in cases like this.

 

[J.A.C]

Just my two cents, obviously do the transfers at FFL don't just hold onto them. To tie up loose ends, make sure the ammo goes to your house too. Divorces can get batsh*t quick. "Them" knowing he gave his guns to his uncle but kept all the ammo will just make the crazy go crazier. If for some reason they do pull his LTC off a made up charge by wife make sure anything requiring a license is gone.

 

[Asaltweapon]

Just my two cents, obviously do the transfers at FFL don't just hold onto them. To tie up loose ends, make sure the ammo goes to your house too. Divorces can get batsh*t quick. "Them" knowing he gave his guns to his uncle but kept all the ammo will just make the crazy go crazier. If for some reason they do pull his LTC off a made up charge by wife make sure anything requiring a license is gone.

And if you sell them she still gets half.

 

[gunofthrones]

You can not, but I can.

 

[dcmdon]

Bad advice again Don!

2) Won't fly. 209A is the MA version of the Sen. Frank Lautenberg (NJ) Act and REQUIRES confiscation in any/every state. Documented case of this and Manchester NH PD did the confiscation for the MA PD. Refuse to tell where they are and you face C. 269 S. 10(i) charges that will stick (see Post #22 above) and make you a Federally PP for life!

3) PD isn't going to buy this, based on no FA-10 showing guns are gone, they are either going to round up the parts or prosecute and let you sort it out in front of a Marsupial Judge!

Re sect 269S. 10(i) its referring to failing to surrender firearms in your possession. You are right. I am wrong. The loan doesn't change the fact that that they are yours.

re my number (3) It doesn't matter if it won't fly with the cops. If they are gone, they are gone. There is nothing in the law that says you need to provide proof that they are gone. You can be in full compliance with the law if you ship the full guns and parts out of state and there won't be an FA10 paper trail to show otherwise. Obviously if prosecuted, you could choose to reveal where they went. Please realize that I fully undertstand and tried to convey in my first post that this will probably result in the issuing authority refusing to ever reissue you your LTC. Which is why my number 1 is the lowest risk option.

This guy doesn't is not yet the subject of a protective order. So Glidden's opinion doesn't matter here. The guns should be transferred out of the person's name before the protective order is ever issued.

I realize that CT is different from MA, but I recently advised a person in a situation who became the subject of a protective order. He transferred his guns to a FFL out of state. When the cops came to talk to him about his guns his response was simple. "I am in full compliance with the protective order and CT statute 529-29-36K.). They pushed. They cajoled. They threatened. But when all was said and done, all they could do was ask him to put it in writing. Which he did. When the order expired, the CT DESPP reissued the Pistol Permit.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The short form is cute games with 209As won't work. About the best you can do it take the scopes off the guns and hold onto those.

One would be well advised to have pre-arranged with an FFL who can get to the PD *quickly* if there is a confiscation, and have a letter to the PD instructing the guns be turned over to this dealer ready to go with the guns when confiscated (I keep such a letter in my safe). This may help with some PDs who are only concerned with freeing up space in their property room; others want the guns to go to Dowd either to punish the gun owner or because they think it is an easier paper trail.

 

[gunofthrones]

Book a cruise under her name, and no one will ask why she never comes back.

 

[hollowman]

Thank you all for the information. I have passed it along to him and offered to help he should be contacting me soon. To think that someone can say they are afraid of you and make up a story to back the reason why. Then you get an ro and your guns and license are gone. Crazy

most likely sent from my bathroom

 

[Yazz]

Probably to avoid Herpes,AIDS, Genital Worts, Syph, MRSA, HEPC or worse dating[emoji7]

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Ya gotta do better than that!

 

[Dadstoys]

I still recall when my Sister got divorced.
The first shitbag lawyer she went to kept pushing her to say that she was being abused and she was afraid of him.
Not the case, there was no violence in their relationship.
The woman kept pushing and pushing, finally my sister had enough and told her to GFYS and got another lawyer.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

IF she is considering pulling an RO on him, could he beat the question "has your LTC even been revoked, etc" by voluntarily turning his LTC in to the PD after he transfers all the guns to someone else before she files for an RO?

 

[rhombus]

Seeing what a few guys I know went through in a similar situation, if no kids are involved I would recommend he immediately cease any contact either in person or via phone with his wife and only communicate through a lawyer. And get the hell out of the house.

Live in a car if you have to, just run far and fast. And that might not even work.

 

[browncoat]

IF she is considering pulling an RO on him, could he beat the question "has your LTC even been revoked, etc" by voluntarily turning his LTC in to the PD after he transfers all the guns to someone else before she files for an RO?

Pretty sure only the issuing authority can expire an ltc.

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[Len-2A Training]

Pretty sure only the issuing authority can expire an ltc.

True. He could turn in the LTC to the issuing PD PRIOR to the RO and ask them to expire it. An expired LTC can not be denied, suspended or revoked and would avoid all but admission that he once had an RO issued against him.

 

[robjax]

that would be the smart thing to do...transfer the guns, and ask the PD to expire the LTC and cease all contact with the woman. He's inconvenienced for a few months but at least he won't have his rights pulled for the rest of his life.

In fact this thread is a couple of days old. Are the guns transferred yet? Should be by now or he's playing with fire.

 

[CMEBoston]

My bud had a 209 pulled on him in mass a couple years ago, cops came and got all his guns. We called the PD and they had us get a notified letter stating my bud wanted the firearms in my possession instead of a bonded wharehouse. we brought the letter to the PD, they drew up papers for me to sign stating they released the guns to me and that I would not let my friend take possession until his LTC was re-instated... easy peasy. the safe was crowded that winter....

 

[Len-2A Training]

My bud had a 209 pulled on him in mass a couple years ago, cops came and got all his guns. We called the PD and they had us get a notified letter stating my bud wanted the firearms in my possession instead of a bonded wharehouse. we brought the letter to the PD, they drew up papers for me to sign stating they released the guns to me and that I would not let my friend take possession until his LTC was re-instated... easy peasy. the safe was crowded that winter....

What the PD did was humane, but violated MGL (in your favor). Release to other than an FFL or bonded warehouse is prohibited under MGL. He had a good PD!

 

[CMEBoston]

What the PD did was humane, but violated MGL (in your favor). Release to other than an FFL or bonded warehouse is prohibited under MGL. He had a good PD!

yeah, the bonded FFL wanted $50 per gun to transfer (about 14 guns, some heirlooms not worth the transfer cost but still priceless to him) and they wouldnt negotiate a flat rate transfer fee... i wont buy a single thing there after that..

 

[1903Collector]

Thank you all for the information. I have passed it along to him and offered to help he should be contacting me soon. To think that someone can say they are afraid of you and make up a story to back the reason why. Then you get an ro and your guns and license are gone. Crazy

most likely sent from my bathroom

It wouldn't surprise me to find out that 90% of ROs are based on BS.

 

[Knob Creek]

Happened to a friend of mine years ago. His wife told him pretty much the same thing. About week later he was outside raking leaves and three Police cars pulled up. His wife reported he pulled a gun on her and wanted him out of the house. They cuffed him. Cops wanted to seize the guns and the wife brought them inside the house and pointed them to the closet where he kept a couple shotguns and a rifle. Said he had just pointed a gun at her and then put it away.

But guess what? No guns. He had already moved them to his Dad's house.They searched the house and found nothing. Cops threatened her with filing a false police report. Un-cuffed him and apologized to him and left.