BATFE Reaction to VA Tech Shooting

[Len-2A Training]

Received a letter to all FFL holders today from BATFE (dated May 9, 2007) addressing the issues that occurred at Virginia Tech in April.

18 USC 922 (g) (4) states that people adjudicated as a "mental defective" or who have been committed to a mental institution are prohibited persons.

They further mention that 27 CFR 478.11 contains the definitions of the above prohibited persons.

As a result of the shooting, this paragraph has some "interesting" language in it, describing what the BATFE is going to do to "prevent" another occurrence. Text is verbatim, emphasis is mine. [NOTE: They apparently didn't get the memo from Scrivener and still refer to themselves as "ATF"everywhere, not BATFE! ]

To assist you and your customers to better understand this provision, ATF is clarifying the Firearms Transaction Record (ATF Form 4473), to make it clear, for example that any person who has been found by a court, board or other lawful authority to be a danger to self or others is prohibited from purchasing a firearm or ammunition.

My Editorial Comments:

- This could mean that a school disciplinary board, your local chief, etc. could legally declare you "prohibited" with no due process.

- Since 4473s have nothing to do with ammo sales, it sounds to me that they will be bringing back the "sign in book" for all ammo sales where you attest (under pains and penalties of perjury) that you aren't a prohibited person when you buy ammo. I wonder if they will require a NICS check for ammo purchases too?


. . . But if it saves just one life . . .

 

[depicts]

When I got the letter I thought it was a CYA attempt by BATF.

 

[Scrivener]

[NOTE: They apparently didn't get the memo from Scrivener and still refer to themselves as "ATF"everywhere, not BATFE!

Which pretty much sums of that entity's ability to change its mindset to adapt to its new missions....

My Editorial Comments:

- This could mean that a school disciplinary board, your local chief, etc. could legally declare you "prohibited" with no due process.

And since when does "a school disciplinary board, your local chief, etc. " have the authority to determine mental competency and thus "legally declare you 'prohibited?;"

 

[Moderator]

I received mine today as well.

 

[Dirtypacman]

Yup brought that letter around to all the shooters I know to see what the BATFE had to say about the recent events.

 

[drgrant]

Sounds like the ATF just trying to throw their weight around again, like they
did with the akins accelerator. (eg, take a poorly written law and stretch
things a bit to fit your agenda type deal. )

Thing is I doubt with this issue if that weight tossing is going to get very
far, because IIRC, a "prohibited person" actually has a defined meaning
somewhere in US code, which means that ATF would effectively have to
whine to congress if they want it changed. (I would imagine case law
also exists to back up that definition, as well).

-Mike

 

[Jose]

And since when does "a school disciplinary board, your local chief, etc. " have the authority to determine mental competency and thus "legally declare you 'prohibited?;"

+1

Lawful authority is the operative phrase here. Neither a school board nor a police chief have the lawful authority to declare anyone mentally incompetent/defective/etc.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Watch how it plays out in real life! That will be the acid test.

Also, read the quote: The ". . . any person who has been found by a . . . board or other lawful authority to be a danger to self or others" part does NOT say to me (IANAL) that these people adjudicate someone as mentally ill, just that the "lawful authority" has "reason" to believe that the person COULD be a danger to self or others. I think that this is subject to abuse as a pretty low standard.

We'll see!

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Things are done without lawful authority all the time. I attended dealer NICS training and the agent explained the things for which one could be denied - various criminal records databases, arrest warrants, and being on the US Secret Service "watch list" (which is not, in and of itself, a crime).

 

[Len-2A Training]

Thank you Rob!