Hey all. So my mom's partner passed away last week. He was a Florida resident and has a newer Glock 17 which he willed to me. Unfortunately there is no documentation of that. I am a Mass resident with am ALP concealed carry. Is there any way I can legally take possession of that firearm in Mass? Thanks in advance.
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Willed noncompliant glock from Fla to Ma.
- Thread starter ReLoDer
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Your statement is a contradiction. If he willed it to you, he did so with some documentation. If so, you simply take possession of it and do an eFA-10 when you return to MA with it as "REGISTRATION" (NO info on gun source).
If there is "no documentation" stating that you are to get the gun, sorry you are SOL as taking possession would be a federal felony and unless you are a LEO in MA, no dealer in MA should do the transfer (it would have to be shipped to a MA Dealer per Federal Law).
There is a sticky thread in the laws forum specifically on all the nuances of inheritance. You should read it as your question has come up and been answered on here at least 100 times in the past 10 years.
If there is "no documentation" stating that you are to get the gun, sorry you are SOL as taking possession would be a federal felony and unless you are a LEO in MA, no dealer in MA should do the transfer (it would have to be shipped to a MA Dealer per Federal Law).
There is a sticky thread in the laws forum specifically on all the nuances of inheritance. You should read it as your question has come up and been answered on here at least 100 times in the past 10 years.
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Not without an FFL to FFL transfer. The federal exemption to this requirement is only for bequest; not disposition of the handgun subsequent to bequest.
But, of course, she could do an FFL to FFL transfer of a stripped frame, though in doing so, he would be conspiring to commit an unfair and deceptive trade practice against himself if he were to bring back the non-frame parts, reassemble the gun, and file an eFA-10.
dcmdon
NES Member
If it wasn't explicitly willed to the OP, the only way I see to gettiing it legally would be to establish spend a few weeks down there. Establish residency in FL. (The ATF is very loose on this. See the instructions for quesitons 2 and 20 on the ATF form 4473) Then do a secondary transaction between your mother and you and bring it up to MA then FA10 it.
Of course, it would just be easier to sell the gun in FL and buy another in MA. You will pay a premium, but its less than the cost of an airline ticket.
Don
Of course, it would just be easier to sell the gun in FL and buy another in MA. You will pay a premium, but its less than the cost of an airline ticket.
Don
steve8140
NES Member
Separate the parts. Tell your mother to ship just the lower from a FL FFL to a MA FFL. Then have her mail you directly the complete slide assembly. As far as the state or dealer are concerned your only getting a lower, which you can buy any day of the week from Glock or glockmeister.
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greencobra
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you sure about this? sounds bogus to me and that's from my personal experience with glock.
steve8140
NES Member
I've bought a new gen 3 frame from glockmeister.com and had it shipped to my FFL. Then I ordered a brand new G19 complete slide assembly and had it shipped right to my door. I put it together and now have a brand new gen 3 G19 for $450.
The gun is legal to own and posses here in MA, its a matter of getting it here. The frame is the part that is considered a firearm, but MA doesnt see it as a gun unless it goes bang. So sending the frame is the same as buying a AR lower receiver from the gun shop and building the rest and then registering it. Once you have the complete gun in hand all you do is E-FA10 as the buyer/maker and there would be no seller.
dcmdon
NES Member
This is absolutely legal. Just don't forget to FA10 it once you have the slide and frame.
To the OP. I have spoken DIRECTLY with the FRB about this. They have explicitly told me that a frame is not a firearm per MA law. So when the transfer is done, it is just federal. Which means a NICS check and a 4473.
Don
Andreas
NES Member
Despite being 100% legal.... if you can find an FFL to do this for you, I would be amazed...
But also very happy for you.
They exist. Some actually read and understand that law . . . maybe not many but some do.
steve8140
NES Member
Almost any dealer would do this, but if it make you feel better, don't tell them its a complete firearm being split into parts. Only tell them you got a frame, that's all they need to know.
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There is nothing bogus about this. A stripped frame in MA is not a firearm under MGL, and can even be transferred without an LTC (though I don't know of any dealers who will - they generally require an LTC as an exercise in caution). All federal laws apply.
The law is a bit ambiguous on complete frame assemblies, as they can be made into operational guns with simple operations, whereas stripped frames require more work beyond the stripping/assembly recommended for consumers by the manufacturer.
I am intrigued by the legal aspects of someone moving a Glock into MA via the "stripepd frame/parts separated, eFA10 filed once reassabled". Assuming it's a Glock on the EOPS list, the only possible charge could be "conspiracy to defraud yourself".
As to "personal experience with Glock". Glock's general counsel, Carlos Guevara, is VERY pro gun rights, but walks a very cautious and conservative line, and does not get into walking on the finer edges of the law like sending stripped frames into MA. His caution, while quite understandable for a company of Glock's size and stature, is not an indication as to actual legal status of stripped frames in MA.
one-eyed Jack
Manufacturer
When you stand before the judge, you might be faced with the difference between a stripped frame which was never a part of a complete firearm and a frame that was taken from a complete firearm. Personally, to me , it's a grey area and may require a test case to resolve. My two cents. Jack.
dcmdon
NES Member
Jack,
Its not grey. I explicitly asked Michaela Dunne via email if a frame was considered to be a firearm in MA. Her response was black and white. A frame is not a firearm per MA law.
If you want to be very cautious based on Rob Boudrie's comments re complete frames, its very easy to pull the guts out of a glock frame. Then ship the guts with the slide. And all is legal.
If I was an out of state dealer, I'd probably not engage in this kind of thing. However, as a means for a non-licensee to legally move a personal firearm into the state, its well within the law.
Re Carlos Guevera - I got a chance to sit next to him on my flight back from SHOT this year. Nice guy. Very pro gun rights. And when I told him I was from MA, he immediately told me how impressed was with some guy named Rob with a french last name. Ha.
Don
Its not grey. I explicitly asked Michaela Dunne via email if a frame was considered to be a firearm in MA. Her response was black and white. A frame is not a firearm per MA law.
If you want to be very cautious based on Rob Boudrie's comments re complete frames, its very easy to pull the guts out of a glock frame. Then ship the guts with the slide. And all is legal.
If I was an out of state dealer, I'd probably not engage in this kind of thing. However, as a means for a non-licensee to legally move a personal firearm into the state, its well within the law.
Re Carlos Guevera - I got a chance to sit next to him on my flight back from SHOT this year. Nice guy. Very pro gun rights. And when I told him I was from MA, he immediately told me how impressed was with some guy named Rob with a french last name. Ha.
Don
RandomBS
NES Member
How's that work with regard to serial numbers? Are the slides/barrel numbered at all or just the frames? I guess it doesn't really matter since the frame is the only part counted as the gun, but it would kind of irrirate me to have a different serial number on the barrel than the frame.
steve8140
NES Member
Exactly that, my frame has the registered serial number. The slide and barrel match each other but not the frame and those numbers are meaningless. It doesn't bother me one bit that they don't match. Most of my guns show holster wear, I've had a few of them in the sand or have bounced them around a time of two. I've never really cared for trophy handguns, all of mine get used.
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As a bit of trivia, the Glock Frames/Slides/Barrels that have a single letter before the digits were manufactured as replacement parts. If you have replacements parts with two or three alpha prefixes on a Glock, they were scavenged from other guns.
The two gray areas to be concerned about are an "unstripped lower" and constructive possession if you have a stripped frame and all the parts to assemble a gun, however, this would probably only be an issue for someone possessing all the parts and not the FID or LTC as needed.
steve8140
NES Member
Also, my g19 frame was only a frame. It did not come from a complete firearm and my serial number is TKGxxx. My slide and barrel were also bought as a complete slide assembly as parts but not a full firearm and those are VPXxxx
once the gun is built / reassembled, what is the requirement to fill out an FA10. Everything I read says we don't have registration, just the documentation of transfer of a firearm. Is it a transfer if you assemble or build the firearm? I have filled out the FA10 on a firearm I assembled before, I just want to know how that is considered a legal transfer.
steve8140
NES Member
I've done the same thing. You are correct on the transfer but when it comes to building there are a lot of answers you'll get. I do register mine but my opinion is that it is not required. Again that's my opinion. I'm sure Len will add to this and probably give a legality and a best case.
EOPS opinion is that "making" a gun is the same as "acquired" (word used in the law) and therefore requires the eFA-10.
