What did you do in the reloading room recently?

daekken

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I think a motivator for me will be competition. Going to try 2/3 gun this year and it might be a big enough incentive to crank out .223/9mm for budgetary as well as accuracy considerations. I have around 1200 9mm projectiles sitting, and probably about 5000 .224 diam projectiles.
 

1903Collector

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I got a Hornady progressive that I’ve been using since 2013. No issues yet and it’s a little cheaper than the Dillon.
If you shoot pistol calibers often you really need a progressive IMO. I would go nuts otherwise. YMMV.
I've been running 2 LNL progressives for 2-3 years now, never had one issue with them, but I'm not loading g tens of thousands of rounds per year either and all my rifle stuff I do on a Redding single stage.
 

p..

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I didn't get all my reloading equipment at once, just pieced it together over a couple years as things came up for sale used when I had some money to spare, but I did go straight for a (used) Dillon 550. It took me maybe 3 years to get all the stuff I needed to start loading, but now I have a decent setup and don't feel like I have to start over.

Loaded up 50 9mm today. I've never loaded anything but 115 grain FMJ, but today tried some Hornady 124 grain FMJ round nose. Ran five over the chrono out of a 3.9" barrel:

5.6g Power Pistol, thrown from Dillon measure
Blazer brass, untrimmed
CCI 500
Hornady 124g FMJ RN loaded to 1.145"-1.150"

Average 1056 fps
High 1080 fps
Low 1026 fps
ES 54 fps
SD 22 fps
 
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I think a motivator for me will be competition. Going to try 2/3 gun this year and it might be a big enough incentive to crank out .223/9mm for budgetary as well as accuracy considerations. I have around 1200 9mm projectiles sitting, and probably about 5000 .224 diam projectiles.
What are the accuracy requirements for 3 gun,
i tried 3 gun way back close to 20 years ago. At the time there where not as many events as today so i dropped that and picked up trap shooting
 

daekken

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What are the accuracy requirements for 3 gun,
i tried 3 gun way back close to 20 years ago. At the time there where not as many events as today so i dropped that and picked up trap shooting
I have heard to expect "CQB" style targets as well as shots up to 200 yards, but I believe those are steel (i.e., pass/fail). Not looking for CMP-style accuracy, but I wouldn't run factory seconds (like I often do when just shooting for pleasure),
 

C. Stockwell

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What are the accuracy requirements for 3 gun,
i tried 3 gun way back close to 20 years ago. At the time there where not as many events as today so i dropped that and picked up trap shooting
Pistol? Pretty low. The longest shot I had to do last year was about a 60 or 70 degree shot at a cardboard silouette at say 30 yards. Most others are typically between five to ten yards on steel or cardboard. Put it this way, I had no complaints shooting Winchester White Box.

Rifle? 2MOA would probably be about perfect. I'm going to shoot 2-gun at Pemi Fish and Game this year and they theoretically could put us on the 600 yard range.
 

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This. I would shoot one round and verify it left the barrel before shooting another round. I think you'll be fine as long as you're not loading like 1.5 grains of BE [laugh]
Guess what?!?!

The 158 jacketed over 3.5 bullseye is a total no go in the Henry carbine!

Tested tonight with my son. 1st shot made a pfffffffft sound and we saw the bullet bounce off the floor about 20 feet downrange and go into the backstop media (indoor range). It was like a hangfire almost......click pfffffft pop. I though maybe it was a hangfire or a primer only load. He racked the gun and fired again and same thing. I put some in my revolver and they worked perfectly! Went to shooting cast lead 158 with 3.5 bullseye and the are great.....nice and accurate.

Strange!!!! Didn't realize jacketed was that much of a friction difference. What's stranger is that 158 jacketed with 3.5 bullseye is a published 38 load ......doesn't say anything in the nosler manual that it's a pistol only load.

Damn!!! I was hoping to be able to use bullseye or 700x powder with these jacketed bullets but guess that's a no go.

I'll have to research a .38 plus p jacketed load with a slower burn powder.
 
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Michael J. Spangler

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Guess what?!?!

The 158 jacketed over 3.5 bullseye is a total no go in the Henry carbine!

Tested tonight with my son. 1st shot made a pfffffffft sound and we saw the bullet bounce off the floor about 20 feet downrange and go into the backstop media (indoor range). It was like a hangfire almost......click pfffffft pop. I though maybe it was a hangfire or a primer only load. He racked the gun and fired again and same thing. I put some in my revolver and they worked perfectly! Went to shooting cast lead 158 with 3.5 bullseye and the are great.....nice and accurate.

Strange!!!! Didn't realize jacketed was that much of a friction difference. What's stranger is that 158 jacketed with 3.5 is a published 38 load ......doesn't say anything on the nosler manual that it's a pistol only load.

Damn!!! I was hoping to be able to use bullseye or 709x powder with these jacketed bullets but guess that's a no go.

I'll have to research a .38 plus p jacketed load with a slower burn powder.
Wow that’s interesting. Thanks for the info!
 

andrew1220

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Guess what?!?!

The 158 jacketed over 3.5 bullseye is a total no go in the Henry carbine!

Tested tonight with my son. 1st shot made a pfffffffft sound and we saw the bullet bounce off the floor about 20 feet downrange and go into the backstop media (indoor range). It was like a hangfire almost......click pfffffft pop. I though maybe it was a hangfire or a primer only load. He racked the gun and fired again and same thing. I put some in my revolver and they worked perfectly! Went to shooting cast lead 158 with 3.5 bullseye and the are great.....nice and accurate.

Strange!!!! Didn't realize jacketed was that much of a friction difference. What's stranger is that 158 jacketed with 3.5 bullseye is a published 38 load ......doesn't say anything in the nosler manual that it's a pistol only load.

Damn!!! I was hoping to be able to use bullseye or 700x powder with these jacketed bullets but guess that's a no go.

I'll have to research a .38 plus p jacketed load with a slower burn powder.
Well shit, thats interesting.
I wonder if it would help to use 357 brass and load them a little warmer? I don’t reload 38 spl brass. Just load 357 brass to 38 spl velocities. That way I don’t have to mess with the dies aside from the crimp die.
With plated/coated bullets I was using ~4.2 gr of bullseye. Haven’t tried it with the Zeros yet. Then again I don’t have a 357 lever gun....working on that...
 

whacko

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Well shit, thats interesting.
I wonder if it would help to use 357 brass and load them a little warmer? I don’t reload 38 spl brass. Just load 357 brass to 38 spl velocities. That way I don’t have to mess with the dies aside from the crimp die.
With plated/coated bullets I was using ~4.2 gr of bullseye. Haven’t tried it with the Zeros yet. Then again I don’t have a 357 lever gun....working on that...
Friggin wierd isn't it? A 38 load using published data that will consistently FAIL in a carbine rifle. I've shot factory 38 158 grain jsp ammo out of it with great results. Also fmj 130 grain 38 factory runs great.

I was trying to keep it to 38 special because the indoor range at the club only allows 9mm and 38 special through a rifle. Outdoors we shoot ,357 all the time....but even making my own the powder is pricier than what I use for 38. I'll have to look up a plus p 38 load with a slower burning powder and jacketed 158.
 

Michael J. Spangler

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I was trying to keep it to 38 special because the indoor range at the club only allows 9mm and 38 special through a rifle. Outdoors we shoot ,357 all the time....but even making my own the powder is pricier than what I use for 38. I'll have to look up a plus p 38 load with a slower burning powder and jacketed 158.
I’ll have to look back through my notes. I swear I’ve put jacketed through my rifles without issues.
I know for a fact that recently I put the HST Micro wadcutter loads through my rifles but I think they are +P
 

pastera

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Guess what?!?!

The 158 jacketed over 3.5 bullseye is a total no go in the Henry carbine!

Tested tonight with my son. 1st shot made a pfffffffft sound and we saw the bullet bounce off the floor about 20 feet downrange and go into the backstop media (indoor range). It was like a hangfire almost......click pfffffft pop. I though maybe it was a hangfire or a primer only load. He racked the gun and fired again and same thing. I put some in my revolver and they worked perfectly! Went to shooting cast lead 158 with 3.5 bullseye and the are great.....nice and accurate.

Strange!!!! Didn't realize jacketed was that much of a friction difference. What's stranger is that 158 jacketed with 3.5 bullseye is a published 38 load ......doesn't say anything in the nosler manual that it's a pistol only load.

Damn!!! I was hoping to be able to use bullseye or 700x powder with these jacketed bullets but guess that's a no go.

I'll have to research a .38 plus p jacketed load with a slower burn powder.
I had similar issues with plated bullets in 38 spl cases with 232 - that was with a pistol.
Worked perfectly with 357 cases.
I think the large jump allows too much of a pressure drop to keep the powder burning properly.
 

whacko

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I’ll have to look back through my notes. I swear I’ve put jacketed through my rifles without issues.
I know for a fact that recently I put the HST Micro wadcutter loads through my rifles but I think they are +P
I'd appreciate any data to start with.

I'm doing some research now and 158 grain jacketed at 38 special pressures can be a problem when using fast powders. Lead and cast lead is not an issue.....just jacketed.

I'll bump things up to plus p and use a slower powder. Any suggestions on powder?
 

Michael J. Spangler

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I'd appreciate any data to start with.

I'm doing some research now and 158 grain jacketed at 38 special pressures can be a problem when using fast powders. Lead and cast lead is not an issue.....just jacketed.

I'll bump things up to plus p and use a slower powder. Any suggestions on powder?
Try unique. If 9 grains can get a 550 grain cast bullet out of a long trapdoor barrel I would venture to guess you could get a jacketed bullet out of your Henry. Though this thread has proved me wrong once already
 

meh

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Try unique. If 9 grains can get a 550 grain cast bullet out of a long trapdoor barrel I would venture to guess you could get a jacketed bullet out of your Henry. Though this thread has proved me wrong once already
Yeah, makes one a little gun shy. I've loaded up Zero JSPs in 38 special over Titegroup, Universal, HS-6, BE-86, Ultimate Pistol, and Auto Pistol. I just don't remember whether I shot them out of a carbine. I know I've shot standard pressure 250gr jacketed 45C loads over Titegroup in a carbine before, so I don't think it's the case that one needs that much of a slower burning powder than Bullseye. I don't think the burn speed is the problem. Probably Bullseye just didn't generate enough gas.
 
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p..

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Out of my Lyman 49 manual:

38 Special data:
lyman_49_38jhp.jpg

I don't see 38 rifle data, but here is some info for reference on 357 handgun vs 357 rifle data, both for 158 grain jacketed hollow point.

handgun first
lyman_49_357_158jhp.jpg

And here's 357 rifle

lyman_49_357_158jhp_rifle.jpg
 

whacko

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Out of my Lyman 49 manual:

38 Special data:
View attachment 327270

I don't see 38 rifle data, but here is some info for reference on 357 handgun vs 357 rifle data, both for 158 grain jacketed hollow point.

handgun first
View attachment 327271

And here's 357 rifle

View attachment 327272
Awesome thanks. My I think my best bet is to choose a powder that gets the highest velocity out if a 38 load no? That would be unique or 2400 in a plus p loading (I can use plus p on the indoor range from a rifle). I'll check my chart and see where unique sits on the burn rate. If its truly slower than bullseye or 700x I'll buy a pound today.

Edit....just checked and 2400 is a slower powder than unique ....I'll try some 2400

This all has me thinking......maybe the bore is "tight" on the Henry carbines? I dont know how to slug a bore for size but it would be interesting to know.
 
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Artie

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This all has me thinking......maybe the bore is "tight" on the Henry carbines? I dont know how to slug a bore for size but it would be interesting to know.
I have used Cerrosafe in the past on a Mauser with great results. Unsure how it would work for the Henry.
View: https://youtu.be/DByaASz_HNk
 
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whacko

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Out of my Lyman 49 manual:

38 Special data:
View attachment 327270

I don't see 38 rifle data, but here is some info for reference on 357 handgun vs 357 rifle data, both for 158 grain jacketed hollow point.

handgun first
View attachment 327271

And here's 357 rifle

View attachment 327272
I'm using Lyman 50th and same problem......700x and bullseye are not there for 38 spec with jacketed 158. I got my 3.5 bullseye with a 158 jacketed data from nosler manual. I'll attest it is a handgun only load!!!!! Glad I only made 50. I shot em all through my revolver last night to get rid of em. Good loads out of a snub revolver though.

I'm going to get some 2400 today up at kittery.
 
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Michael J. Spangler

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Awesome thanks. My I think my best bet is to choose a powder that gets the highest velocity out if a 38 load no? That would be unique or 2400 in a plus p loading (I can use plus p on the indoor range from a rifle). I'll check my chart and see where unique sits on the burn rate. If its truly slower than bullseye or 700x I'll buy a pound today.

Edit....just checked and 2400 is a slower powder than unique ....I'll try some 2400

This all has me thinking......maybe the bore is "tight" on the Henry carbines? I dont know how to slug a bore for size but it would be interesting to know.
Get some soft lead like round balls. Oil the bore and oil the ball. Slam it through with a wooden or fiberglass rod.
Measure the slug diameter.

I would be very interested to see your results. I’m going to have to load some .357, .358 and .359 bullet to test the speeds.

I’ve heard tighter bores produce higher speeds due to higher friction giving higher pressures.
I’ve also heard the inverse where looser bores produce higher speeds due to less friction.

I was leaning towards the tighter bore giving higher pressures which in turn would give higher velocity but I need to do some more reading to back this up. Not just some fudd forum posts that I’ve found so far.
 

whacko

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Get some soft lead like round balls. Oil the bore and oil the ball. Slam it through with a wooden or fiberglass rod.
Measure the slug diameter.

I would be very interested to see your results. I’m going to have to load some .357, .358 and .359 bullet to test the speeds.

I’ve heard tighter bores produce higher speeds due to higher friction giving higher pressures.
I’ve also heard the inverse where looser bores produce higher speeds due to less friction.

I was leaning towards the tighter bore giving higher pressures which in turn would give higher velocity but I need to do some more reading to back this up. Not just some fudd forum posts that I’ve found so far.
I'm curious as hell now too.

With what I experienced with the Henry.....I think it has to do with fast burning powder......I think it "shoots it's wad" too fast lol.......and runs out of steam. The rifle literally had two distinct noises! Pfft.....delay.....then pop. Like the powder burned fast......bullet stuck for a moment then popped out the muzzle. I think the pfft was the powder burn......the delay was the "stick" and the pop was the bullet exiting the muzzle.

The data from Lyman supports this theory on fast powder being the issue......fast powders are not shown for 38 jacketed in 158 grain.

I'll check around to get something to slug this bore. I have to figure this out!!!!
 

andrew1220

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I'm using Lyman 50th and same problem......700x and bullseye are not there for 38 spec with jacketed 158. I got my 3.5 bullseye with a 158 jacketed data from nosler manual. I'll attest it is a handgun only load!!!!! Glad I only made 50. I shot em all through my revolver last night to get rid of em. Good loads out of a snub revolver though.

I'm going to get some 2400 today up at kittery.
What is KTP getting for 2400? Do they have it in 4 or 8 pound jugs do you know?
 

Michael J. Spangler

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I'm curious as hell now too.

With what I experienced with the Henry.....I think it has to do with fast burning powder......I think it "shoots it's wad" too fast lol.......and runs out of steam. The rifle literally had two distinct noises! Pfft.....delay.....then pop. Like the powder burned fast......bullet stuck for a moment then popped out the muzzle. I think the pfft was the powder burn......the delay was the "stick" and the pop was the bullet exiting the muzzle.

The data from Lyman supports this theory on fast powder being the issue......fast powders are not shown for 38 jacketed in 158 grain.

I'll check around to get something to slug this bore. I have to figure this out!!!!
So weird.
I’ve played with squib or mouse fart loads a ton and stuck bullets in the bore. I’ve never had that double noise thing though.
It reminds me of poorly made shotgun ammo with bad crimps or really old hulls with worn out crimps that kind of fizzle and pop.
Weird
 
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meh

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I'm using Lyman 50th and same problem......700x and bullseye are not there for 38 spec with jacketed 158. I got my 3.5 bullseye with a 158 jacketed data from nosler manual. I'll attest it is a handgun only load!!!!! Glad I only made 50. I shot em all through my revolver last night to get rid of em. Good loads out of a snub revolver though.

I'm going to get some 2400 today up at kittery.
I see that the Lyman manual has cast bullet loads that would be useful to somebody, but I can't remember a time when I was glad to have bought it because it provided me any useful load data I hadn't found elsewhere, and the Hornady manual is pretty much the same. Mostly I use the Lee manual and whatever the powder manufacturers/importers make available online, which I generally find duplicated in the Lee manual. Hodgdon, BTW, lists 4.0gr of 700-x for 158 grain Hornady XTP in 38+P, 866fps out of 7.7" barrel, they say.

2400 is a great powder, though. Seems like it would make a mediocre and relatively expensive 38+P revolver load, but in the carbine it might actually come to life.
 

whacko

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So weird.
I’ve played with squib or mouse fart loads a ton and stuck bullets in the bore. I’ve never had that double noise thing though.
It reminds me of poorly made shotgun ammo with bad crimps or really old hulls with worn out crimps that kind of fizzle and pop.
Weird
Dude that's exactly what it sounded like. Someone on the trap range using old moldy shotgun loads! That pffft.....pop! And the bullet barely came out of the barrel....landed 20 feet in front on the floor and bounced.
 
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I'm curious as hell now too.

With what I experienced with the Henry.....I think it has to do with fast burning powder......I think it "shoots it's wad" too fast lol.......and runs out of steam. The rifle literally had two distinct noises! Pfft.....delay.....then pop. Like the powder burned fast......bullet stuck for a moment then popped out the muzzle. I think the pfft was the powder burn......the delay was the "stick" and the pop was the bullet exiting the muzzle.

The data from Lyman supports this theory on fast powder being the issue......fast powders are not shown for 38 jacketed in 158 grain.

I'll check around to get something to slug this bore. I have to figure this out!!!!
Any chance the bullets are under sized or the brass is not holding the bullet tight, I had a problem with some cast loads in the mosin. Many rounds of the same load with out issues. Then I started getting odd squibs and bullets falling short of the target. I found my lock ring loose and the die must have adjusted down and appeared to be squishing the brass and bullet and the bullet was getting sized down.
I also had a issue with 30-06 cast loads. I forgot I used a different alloy in the pot and the 30 cal bullet I was casting was coming in under what I thought.with the old alloy they dropped right at .310” with the “other” alloy they where actually dropping just under 308”
What happened with those was a loss in velocity and really messed with my dope.

1580173759951.png
 
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