Given the realities of enforcement (and I agree with a lot of the points calsdad is making -- to have meaning a law like this must employ a great deal of force), why not push supporters to admit they have no intention of enforcing this thing? Then offer to formalize their intentions. If they really just want to engage in grandstanding, suggest adding a sentence that says, "This bylaw (or whatever it is), intended as a symbolic gesture and statement of town feelings and concerns regarding guns, is not meant to be enforced, nor are stated penalties meant to be applied". If they don't like that, make them say exactly what they intend to do to enforce it, how they intend to handle those who ignore it, and what they are willing to spend to get all of this done.
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Update 2/21 Westford Ban
- Thread starter FrugalFannie
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Given the realities of enforcement (and I agree with a lot of the points calsdad is making -- to have meaning a law like this must employ a great deal of force), why not push supporters to admit they have no intention of enforcing this thing? Then offer to formalize their intentions. If they really just want to engage in grandstanding, suggest adding a sentence that says, "This bylaw (or whatever it is), intended as a symbolic gesture and statement of town feelings and concerns regarding guns, is not meant to be enforced, nor are stated penalties meant to be applied". If they don't like that, make them say exactly what they intend to do to enforce it, how they intend to handle those who ignore it, and what they are willing to spend to get all of this done.
Anyone who sent me their email address and has not received a response via email, please send it again.
If you are a Westford resident we will be holding a meeting on Thursday night the 7th. We are trying to firm up a time and location but we do have a couple of offers.
If you are a Westford resident we will be holding a meeting on Thursday night the 7th. We are trying to firm up a time and location but we do have a couple of offers.
If they are grandstanding - somebody somewhere is going to get screwed over by this "law" unless it changes from being a "law" to just being a political statement. IMHO the way to force the issue is to find some way to get them to realize that if they pass a "law" without any real reinforcement - they may get their asses sued if something goes wrong because they didn't enforce that "law".
That's my point - use a different logic - to appeal - or screw with - their emotion.
I'm betting that if you logically point out that in order to REALLY enforce this law - they're going to have to go do a house to house search- that would get a few emotions going.
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I suggested just that a the BoS meeting, and got the proverbial eyeroll in response.
And this is why it needs to be taken out to the citizens of Westford. Arguing with idiots (selectmen) is not going to accomplish anything.
Write up something similar to what I wrote above - explain the realities of "assault weapons" - and what must inevitably follow if this law is TRULY to be enforced - drop the letter in everybody's mailbox - and then sit back and watch the fur fly.
I read the screed that I posted earlier to my wife - who is not a huge fan of my gun ownership (all things being equal she would wish I didn't have them but she doesn't give me crap either and understands in general why I have them) - and asked her what she would think if the cops showed up to search our house top to bottom.
She was pissed.
We've done a lot of work to our house in the years we've owned it - and a few years back the assessor was caught walking around in the yard one day when the wife came back on a whim at lunchtime. The wife was pissed about that - and she was even more pissed when the assessor basically barged her way into the house.
What I'm saying is this - all you people who think the sheep are just going to willingly go along with the police searching every single house in town top to bottom (how many places could you hide an AR lower in your house??) - are ignorant.
People would be PISSED about that.
The people of Westford also need to be reminded that anything else illegal that is found in the house while the searches are going on - would also be grounds for an arrest. Some pot stashed in the back of the fridge? What else do you have that is illegal in your house?
Poke the tiger people .
Awesome turnout at the WSC meeting tonight. I had to duck out at 9:00 to pick up my son from work, but it was great to see so many people anxious to help defeat this. It was also great to have the GOAL reps in attendance.
Yes it was definitely packed tonight. Good to hear from the GOAL folks. It was sad to hear that their membership is so low with the amount of gun owners in the state though. I will be joining them in the next few days.
James
James
I woke up this morning thinking of this.
Along with all the stuff I wrote previously - it might be advantageous to remind the people of Westford that if the Police start going around confiscating , that they don't need search warrants, and they don't need to knock - to enter people's houses. The drug war and the war on terrorism has given them the power to basically barge into your house and do whatever they want.
And that war on terrorism - is the key point. Because that bill is essentially saying that gun owners are terrorists ( they would use that gun to shoot up a school) - so all of the provisions of the Patriot Act could potentially be brought into play.
They have opened Pandora's box - somebody needs to carefully explain to the people of Westford what that FULLY means, because my bet is that they are living in a bubble.
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I was going to go last night - but just couldn't make it - what is the Thursday meeting about specifically?
Along with all the stuff I wrote previously - it might be advantageous to remind the people of Westford that if the Police start going around confiscating , that they don't need search warrants, and they don't need to knock - to enter people's houses. The drug war and the war on terrorism has given them the power to basically barge into your house and do whatever they want.
And that war on terrorism - is the key point. Because that bill is essentially saying that gun owners are terrorists ( they would use that gun to shoot up a school) - so all of the provisions of the Patriot Act could potentially be brought into play.
They have opened Pandora's box - somebody needs to carefully explain to the people of Westford what that FULLY means, because my bet is that they are living in a bubble.
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I was going to go last night - but just couldn't make it - what is the Thursday meeting about specifically?
The Thursday meeting is to bring people up to date as to what we have accomplished and what we need people to do next week. We will also fill people in on what support we have from non-residents and our local organizations.
We have been planning and strategizing for several weeks and we want others to know what they can do to help.
Come to the meeting.
We have been planning and strategizing for several weeks and we want others to know what they can do to help.
Come to the meeting.
You can listen to it recorded here Westford May Ban Certain Types Of Weapons | WBUR
Re: Update 2/4 Westford Ban
SO two major highways go thru westford Rte 3 and 495. Does this mean every truck and car going thru will be in violation of their ban? What about when I go to the westford gun club with my semi auto? Seems like a lot of things were not thought of. Town should prepare to be sued.....
SO two major highways go thru westford Rte 3 and 495. Does this mean every truck and car going thru will be in violation of their ban? What about when I go to the westford gun club with my semi auto? Seems like a lot of things were not thought of. Town should prepare to be sued.....
Yes Woodsy... Any motorist driving on 495 or 3 would be in violation and subject to the $100/$200/$300 fines.
From the beginning this whole this was proposed on a whim. No thought, no research, no discussion...
From the beginning this whole this was proposed on a whim. No thought, no research, no discussion...
NHCraigT
NES Member
Here's another thought: I currently possess a NONRES MA STATE Issued LTC, that says right on it "Class A Large Capacity" License to Carry.
Makes me wonder how any local "town-passed" law(s) would interact with a State Issued license like that (if it were to come-up)?
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Re: Update 2/4 Westford Ban
FOPA?
Oh, don't forget the second and forth amendments, Heller, MacDonald. ..
But that never stopped a determined gun grabber/banner. NYC and New Jersey have been ignoring FOPA since the beginning.
FOPA?
Oh, don't forget the second and forth amendments, Heller, MacDonald. ..
But that never stopped a determined gun grabber/banner. NYC and New Jersey have been ignoring FOPA since the beginning.
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FOPA only covers interstate, not instate.
Re: Update 2/4 Westford Ban
Even if it did, it wouldn't cover carry.
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Even if it did, it wouldn't cover carry.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk 2
Re: Update 2/4 Westford Ban
My point was the lefties don't care what the law is. They're hell bent on pushing this moronic crap.
My point was the lefties don't care what the law is. They're hell bent on pushing this moronic crap.
Re: Update 2/4 Westford Ban
Well if you happen to see Bob out in public, be polite and say Hello. Hes only trying to trample on the 2nd amendment so criminals won't have firearms. One wonders if he realizes 99% of gun crime is handguns.....oh and if your town or firm is using TBA architects suggest another firm.
Well if you happen to see Bob out in public, be polite and say Hello. Hes only trying to trample on the 2nd amendment so criminals won't have firearms. One wonders if he realizes 99% of gun crime is handguns.....oh and if your town or firm is using TBA architects suggest another firm.
Attachments
TBA Architects looks like a firm trying hard.... never heard of them before and I deal with a lot of architectural firms.
I bet they do a lot of municipalities... I know Westford just did a lot of renovation to the police and town hall. I wonder who did the design?
Jeffries released this statement to the Westford Eagle, rather than letting them interview him:
Westford selectman says intent was to spur discussion - Westford, MA - Westford Eagle
Westford selectman says intent was to spur discussion - Westford, MA - Westford Eagle
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What a hippocrite - he says his intent was to spur discussion, but when given the chance to answer questions from the Eagle, he refuses to have a discussion and releases a statement instead.
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Typical statist douche bag. He thinks that the power of government can and should be used casually to spur conversation, debate and cajole obedience to the whims of the small minded. Just how much of a debate is there if you have a gun to your head? So why did he feel the need to "point a gun" (ie; the power of government) to your heads?
