Can we bring our leagally registered (CT) 20 round mags to MA and NY for matches? I bought some 10 rounders when the bullship started in my state but I don't need any crap while traveling and I still use the 20's.
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Traveling to matches in MA and NY
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No you can't legally bring an AR-15 (pre-ban or other) into MA w/o a MA NR LTC, not for any reason other than a LEO.
This goes against what GOAL has on their website. If Im reading this correctly, its ok, as long as its ban compliant. Conflicting info somewhere else?
http://goal.org/masslawpages/travelinfo.html
GOAL is wrong, plain and simple!
ALL of us were wrong prior to a bit of education by Jason Guida. A few people I explain it to get it, whereas many only read/hear what they want to read/hear. GOAL's website won't get you anywhere in a court of law.
There are still no prosecutions under Guida's interpretation though, right?
BTW: It is NOT just Guida's "interpretation" it is in plain English if you know how to deal with proper sentence structure. One of my MA Gun Law Seminar students who happens to be an attorney (not a gun attorney) picked up on the proper interpretation before I even started to explain it. A PO on the Cape also told me that it is plain as day (and he's never taken my seminar), a few other students have also picked up on it as well. So it seems to me that one needs to be lucky (if stopped and queried) to avoid an ugly situation.
To honestly answer that question, you'd have to search the records of every District & Superior Court in MA by hand . . . visiting each one, looking at all the Docket Sheets.
It's not computerized outside the building (other than Board of Probation and they can't give you the right time of day) it happened in and most things are pled out, so the original charge may not be anything like the disposition.
I don't know anyone who has volunteered to test it out.
I haven't read the law, but is there no clause saying that there is an exemption for those shooting in registered competitions or not staying overnight?
There is FOPA for travel through a state. Supposedly that is Federal law as long as you are traveling through and stopping only for gas/food. But whose to say how long that stop can be? Can it be 2 hours? If it can be 2 hours, why can't it be 4 hours? Or 6? I can get in a match at Reading in 6 hours.
Apparently, I've been breaking your state law for 8 years or so, along with everybody else I know from Maine and New Hampshire
There is FOPA for travel through a state. Supposedly that is Federal law as long as you are traveling through and stopping only for gas/food. But whose to say how long that stop can be? Can it be 2 hours? If it can be 2 hours, why can't it be 4 hours? Or 6? I can get in a match at Reading in 6 hours.
Apparently, I've been breaking your state law for 8 years or so, along with everybody else I know from Maine and New Hampshire
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Who would have known that I am a lawbreaker. Now that I know I have to wonder if it's worth it. I guess between my state (which has only 200 yard ranges) and those we're bordering I'm screwed.
The government can only control criminals. Hence the explosion in the number of laws to make everyone law breakers.
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Federal Law has what is called the "Safe Passage Act", this law allows anyone who legally possesses in the their state to travel to or through a state for purposes of competition or dealing with an FFL ( in the act of repair or trade) as long it is transported in a locked case.
For instance if we are going to Camp Perry...we travel trough NY, or if shooting a match in Calif, you can possess your legally own firearm. You can't extend your stay beyond a responsible time...in other words the match or hunt ends the beginning of a given month and till the following.
For instance if we are going to Camp Perry...we travel trough NY, or if shooting a match in Calif, you can possess your legally own firearm. You can't extend your stay beyond a responsible time...in other words the match or hunt ends the beginning of a given month and till the following.
This isn't what the safe passage provision of FOPA does. The item in question must be legal in the origin state and the destination state to be covered under the safe passage law. If you were to take a rifle banned in california into california for a competition there, you would be breaking state law (unless CA has a special allowance) and FOPA would not protect you. On the other hand, if you were going from Nevada to Oregon through california, you would be protected by FOPA as long as you properly secured your guns and didn't stay overnight/make un-necessarily long stops in California.
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There are two problems with the MA exemption:
1. The clause "issued by any state that prohibits the issuance to drugs users or felons". No state meets this requirement - not even MA at present
.2. Commonwealth v. Cornelius, which established the "new resident exemption" does not apply to high cap weapons. That logic would logically extend to the non-resident exemption not applying to them either.
That being said, people do it all the time, and even S&W advertises the exemption. I am not aware of any prosecutions.
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In NY the relevant handgun exemption covers NRA or IMHSA sanction matches, and is limited to +/- 48 hours surrounding the event. The NRA competitions division will grant special event sanction to non-NRA matches free of charge to meet this requirement. I think the relevant NY penal law section is 265.20-13(b) (I know it's in 265.20-13).
Also, the out of state licensing requirement only applies to pistols and revolvers. Unlicensed non-residents can bring AWB-compliant rifles and shotguns to ranges within the state under a separate exemption in section 129C.
Mike, see Rob's post just above yours.
Believe me, I'd like to believe that GOAL is correct, however my 9th grade English teacher would disagree (and she was an excellent teacher) due to sentence construction rules (most of us have forgotten those over the years).
This was on my list of "technical corrections" that I'd like to see happen (most especially since MA changed the MJ law) that was discussed with a highly connected state official a few months ago. We have ~18 months to see if my meeting bears any fruit in this legislative session. [Even a clarification of the language would be an improvement either way, just to avoid the confusion and different interpretations.]
I wonder if the SCOTUS ruling on Obamacare could be applied to this law. Clearly the intent of the law is to provide an exemption for competitors traveling to MA with their firearms, so the fact that the law as written doesn't actually do that is irrelevant and the court should "interpret" it to mean what it doesn't actually say.
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Sign up, attend and you'll find out!
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
Someone that looked like that would be a major distraction to learning. You'd spend all your time drooling on the floor instead of learning.
The reason you (and probably 100s of others that do the same thing) haven't had issues in MA is most competitive shooters are pretty adept at keeping their nose clean when they come down here.... you'd have to be "ridin dirty", be stupid about it, AND have a douche cop that wants to run a search... AND have that cop be a prick to the point where they wanted to charge you, in order for it to be a problem.
Also FOPA can be used in a "these aren't the droids you're looking for" soft of way, if it really comes down to bones. If you expect to pull that trick off though, you should probably have a realistic story lined up ahead of time.
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
-Mike
The only way Guida's interpretation is "wrong" is if a bunch of DAs have sort of informally agreed not to prosecute people running under this exemption because it's pretty obvious what the original "spirit and intent" of that exemption really was. The problem with this theory is I doubt any of these people would ever admit this in public because it doesn't fit with their typically anti-gun narrative.
-Mike
Pretty depressing if I can't shoot in MA or NY. Do the match directors give a rats backside if I show-up with a evil black rifle? I did shoot a prone match a while back and the only one that even noticed (or cared) was the guy who asked "how did that work out for you". I think he commented only because I hit him with the first two or three ejected cases. Moved my stool and didn't bother him the remainder of the day. Since the match no longer cares about anything other than match rifles, I guess I was at the end of the stat sheet but when shooting more, I used to dust more than a few of those shooting match rifles. I guess it's a sign of the times but it's pretty depressing that they average 10 or twelve shooters for a match. Maybe if they still had a service rifle catagory... Until I hear that I won't wind up in lock-up if caught, I guess I'll just play golf..
Here is the comprehensive list of things that you won't end up in the lock-up for in MA, if I understand the AG's statement correctly: being an undocumented alien.
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What does GOAL's cadre of leading lawyers say about the import of Commonwealth v. Cornelius on the possession and use of high capacity weapons under the competition/show exemption?
Nope, read the law for yourself . . . no mention of gun clubs.
This sounds like a classic case of can I afford to be proven right! FOPA is only for traveling thru with you being legal at start and finish of trip. I never heard of a registered match exemption. Personally having dealt with Guida when he was employed by the state I would tend to follow his advise on possession and transport, but I just prefer a window view without bars!
Dave
Dave
