Saiga 12 magazines

[SKS Ray]

Anyone know a source for Saiga 12 magazines? I'd like to get a 10 round one, but at almost $60 for the only one I found, I may pass. For now I'd like a few extra 5 rounders.

 

[heron163]

Anyone know a source for Saiga 12 magazines? I'd like to get a 10 round one, but at almost $60 for the only one I found, I may pass. For now I'd like a few extra 5 rounders.

60 bucks is cheap for a 10 round, esp. if it is Russian. The US made 10 rounders typically go for $75 each.

btw - a 10 round shotgun magazine will get you in trouble in MA...

 

[drgrant]

60 bucks is cheap for a 10 round, esp. if it is Russian. The US made 10 rounders typically go for $75 each.

btw - a 10 round shotgun magazine will get you in trouble in MA...

Please cite the law that says so. I don't see anything WRT 10 round
shotgun magazines being illegal. Might be within the context of
hunting or something, but not mere possession.

-Mike

 

[EddieCoyle]

Please cite the law that says so. I don't see anything WRT 10 round
shotgun magazines being illegal. Might be within the context of
hunting or something, but not mere possession.

-Mike

Here you go Mike:
From MGL Chapter 140: Section 121.

“Large capacity feeding device”, (i) a fixed or detachable magazine, box, drum, feed strip or similar device capable of accepting, or that can be readily converted to accept, more than ten rounds of ammunition or more than five shotgun shells; or (ii) a large capacity ammunition feeding device as defined in the federal Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act, 18 U.S.C. section 921(a)(31) as appearing in such section on September 13, 1994. The term “large capacity feeding device” shall not include an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with,.22 caliber ammunition.

Along with:
From MGL Chapter 140: Section 131M.

No person shall sell, offer for sale, transfer or possess an assault weapon or a large capacity feeding device that was not otherwise lawfully possessed on September 13, 1994.

There are no "pre-ban" mags for the Saiga.

 

[drgrant]

I wasn't aware of that wonderful perversion in MA law.

That means that the Knoxx sidewinder isn't legal here as well, at least
not with the 10 round drum that comes with it.

It also means that a buttload of people can easily break the law WRT
certain shotguns that will readily take more than 5 shells. By logic of that
law, this makes many pump or tube fed riot shotguns on the market
illegal in MA, because most of them will hold more than 5 rounds or can be
modified to hold more than that.

-Mike

 

[JonJ]

It also means that a buttload of people can easily break the law WRT
certain shotguns that will readily take more than 5 shells. By logic of that
law, this makes many pump or tube fed riot shotguns on the market
illegal in MA, because most of them will hold more than 5 rounds or can be
modified to hold more than that.

-Mike

No...
Chapter 140: Section 121. Firearms sales; definitions; antique firearms; application of law; exceptions

“Assault weapon”, shall have the same meaning as a semiautomatic assault weapon as defined in the federal Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act, 18 U.S.C. section 921(a)(30) as appearing in such section on September 13, 1994, and shall include, but not be limited to, any of the weapons, or copies or duplicates of the weapons, of any caliber, known as: (i) Avtomat Kalashnikov (AK) (all models); (ii) Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil; (iii) Beretta Ar70 (SC-70); (iv) Colt AR-15; (v) Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR and FNC; (vi) SWD M-10, M-11, M-11/9 and M-12; (vi) Steyr AUG; (vii) INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9 and TEC-22; and (viii) revolving cylinder shotguns, such as, or similar to, the Street Sweeper and Striker 12; provided, however, that the term assault weapon shall not include: (i) any of the weapons, or replicas or duplicates of such weapons, specified in appendix A to 18 U.S.C. section 922 as appearing in such appendix on September 13, 1994, as such weapons were manufactured on October 1, 1993; (ii) any weapon that is operated by manual bolt, pump, lever or slide action; (iii) any weapon that has been rendered permanently inoperable or otherwise rendered permanently unable to be designated a semiautomatic assault weapon; (iv) any weapon that was manufactured prior to the year 1899; (v) any weapon that is an antique or relic, theatrical prop or other weapon that is not capable of firing a projectile and which is not intended for use as a functional weapon and cannot be readily modified through a combination of available parts into an operable assault weapon; (vi) any semiautomatic rifle that cannot accept a detachable magazine that holds more than five rounds of ammunition; or (vii) any semiautomatic shotgun that cannot hold more than five rounds of ammunition in a fixed or detachable magazine.

And...

“Large capacity weapon”, any firearm, rifle or shotgun: (i) that is semiautomatic with a fixed large capacity feeding device; (ii) that is semiautomatic and capable of accepting, or readily modifiable to accept, any detachable large capacity feeding device; (iii) that employs a rotating cylinder capable of accepting more than ten rounds of ammunition in a rifle or firearm and more than five shotgun shells in the case of a shotgun or firearm; or (iv) that is an assault weapon. The term “large capacity weapon” shall be a secondary designation and shall apply to a weapon in addition to its primary designation as a firearm, rifle or shotgun and shall not include: (i) any weapon that was manufactured in or prior to the year 1899; (ii) any weapon that operates by manual bolt, pump, lever or slide action; (iii) any weapon that is a single-shot weapon; (iv) any weapon that has been modified so as to render it permanently inoperable or otherwise rendered permanently unable to be designated a large capacity weapon; or (v) any weapon that is an antique or relic, theatrical prop or other weapon that is not capable of firing a projectile and which is not intended for use as a functional weapon and cannot be readily modified through a combination of available parts into an operable large capacity weapon.

 

[flotter390]

Anyone know a source for Saiga 12 magazines? I'd like to get a 10 round one, but at almost $60 for the only one I found, I may pass. For now I'd like a few extra 5 rounders.

I've pd $145 for one, and been happy the get it.

 

[drgrant]

No...
Chapter 140: Section 121. Firearms sales; definitions; antique firearms; application of law; exceptions


And...

Course a problem lies in the fact that it exempts the gun and not
necessarily the "large capacity ammunition feeding device" (mentioned in
C140 sec 121) So you're saying that if the LCAFD is -part of- a pump action
shotgun that it doesn't count as one? So the 7 round tube on a riot shotgun
gets a "free ride" because the gun its attached to is not considered to be "large
capacity" (by virtue of its pump action) ?

I only mention this because MA law appears to have a clear delineation between a "large capacity weapon" and a
"large capacity ammunition feeding device".


-Mike

 

[EddieCoyle]

Course a problem lies in the fact that it exempts the gun and not
necessarily the "large capacity ammunition feeding device" (mentioned in
C140 sec 121) So you're saying that if the LCAFD is -part of- a pump action
shotgun that it doesn't count as one? So the 7 round tube on a riot shotgun
gets a "free ride" because the gun its attached to is not considered to be "large
capacity" (by virtue of its pump action) ?

I only mention this because MA law appears to have a clear delineation between a "large capacity weapon" and a
"large capacity ammunition feeding device".


-Mike

The is same logic whereby the possession of recent (LEO marked) Glock magazines is a felony. If you have a Saiga magazine capable of holding more than 5 rounds, don't get caught with it.

I'm going to stick with the 5-rounders. The law seems clear in this instance, and it's not worth losing my guns over.

 

[SKS Ray]

Lousy Massachusetts laws.
And here I was gonna save up and get one of these in time for next year's pumpkin shoot just to have something to compete with Fred and Jim's (flotter390 & EddieCoyle's) guns.

 

[EddieCoyle]

I don't know what that is, but I want one.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I don't know what that is, but I want one.

Looks like a "blue pill dispenser" to me!

 

[SKS Ray]

30mm grenade launcher, you can find them and more goodies we'll never get to touch here: http://www.zastava-arms.co.yu/english/vojni.htm

 

[JonJ]

Course a problem lies in the fact that it exempts the gun and not
necessarily the "large capacity ammunition feeding device" (mentioned in
C140 sec 121) So you're saying that if the LCAFD is -part of- a pump action
shotgun that it doesn't count as one? So the 7 round tube on a riot shotgun
gets a "free ride" because the gun its attached to is not considered to be "large
capacity" (by virtue of its pump action) ?

I only mention this because MA law appears to have a clear delineation between a "large capacity weapon" and a
"large capacity ammunition feeding device".


-Mike

Mike, check this thread:
http://northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=6162&highlight=pump
Good info.

 

[drgrant]

Mike, check this thread:
http://northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=6162&highlight=pump
Good info.

Yeah, I remember that thread. Maybe I'm just a knucklehead, but when I made that observation,
it seems to me that there is still a difference between what an LCAFD is and a "large capacity weapon" is.
I have the same reservations that M1911 and Amicus had in that thread.

Now, a court case might say "Well, because we don't consider the shotgun
to be large capacity, it's impossible for it to have a large capacity feeding
device" but I don't clearly see that delineated in the law. It's possible
that case law has vetted that out, however, and thats why people have
maintained it to be a non issue. (EG, it is rather nonsensical that pump
guns would be exempt from being LCW's but that the magazine typically
attached to the guns explicitly exempted would not be legal. )

-Mike

 

[EddieCoyle]

Mike,

I remember that thread too. I had a similar experience when I first joined here and placed an ad to sell a 10-round drum mag on a Mossberg pump.

The mag for the Saiga is different. It is illegal to even possess a >5 round mag for the Saiga in Mass, plain and simple. Whether you have a LTC/A, LTC/B, FID, or library card, a mag for a Saiga that holds more than 5 rounds is illegal because:

A). Under Mass law it is defined as a high capacity feeding device... and ...
B). It was made after 1994.