National Guardsmen in schools?

[Matt-CZ]

What seems to have worked is securing/rendering bullet proof the cockpits of planes

If durka durka cant get control of the plane then they cant use it as a flying bomb

The rest of TSA is nothing more than kabuki theatre

I accidentally flew with my CRKT 4" blade knife to ATL and back this thanksgiving. I found it in my carryon bag (a camera bag) weeks later, having forgot it was in there. X-rayed and checked both ways by TSA. Absolutely worthless. But they did flag my gf's bag. Apparently swedish fish set off the bomb residue machine.

Wish I had known at the time, seems like a waste not to hijack the plane.

 

[Climbnsink]

First problem, you are buying into the do anything for the children frame. That ends with us in camps. Second problem is you can't armor a school, you can't put enough cops in a school. And all of it is security theatre. None of it will help the children or slow down the gun grabbers. Get your head out of your enemies frame, you think what they want you to think and they have defeated you.

I think there are two different issues here. But the main point of this whole anti gun agenda that nobody is talking about is that the democrats support the gun free zones and they do not want to protect the children. For if the children were protected and threats squelched before any loss of life there would be nothing for the dems to use to try and take our guns. You can disagree with me. You can call me a moron. You can say I am clueless or call me any other thing you want.

But the ANTI GUN Folks love these deaths. They love when a nut job goes in and shoots up a school. The more deaths the better for them. Schools are gun free zones. After Sandy Hook everyone said put armed security or police in the schools. "The dems said throwing more guns into the mix won't fix the problem. That we need to ban and restrict gun rights. That's how to stop these school shootings...." What they meant is that they hate guns and 2A and to get rid of the guns and 2A they need more dead children.

Make no mistake, the antis want us to do nothing. They want dead children on the evening news. If we do nothing it just emboldens their position that guns are bad.

I don't no if the NG is the answer. But I do know that if we leave these gun free zones unprotected future school shooter wannabes will be just as successful.

I think doing noting plays into their hand. If we show equal force and start neutralizing these threats before any loss of life then that will show that there may not be a way from preventing a gunman going to a school but we can still send all the children home safely at the end of the day.

Remember...."All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

 

[Jason Flare]

I accidentally flew with my CRKT 4" blade knife to ATL and back this thanksgiving. I found it in my carryon bag (a camera bag) weeks later, having forgot it was in there. X-rayed and checked both ways by TSA. Absolutely worthless. But they did flag my gf's bag. Apparently swedish fish set off the bomb residue machine.

Wish I had known at the time, seems like a waste not to hijack the plane.

I’m more interested in the possibility of a Swedish fish bomb.

 

[enbloc]

Man. It must be tough to be a kid today...

 

[amm5061]

I’m more interested in the possibility of a Swedish fish bomb.

That sounds rather delicious to me.

 

[Climbnsink]

I’m more interested in the possibility of a Swedish fish bomb.

I'm now more scared to eat Swedish fish.

 

[enbloc]

I’m more interested in the possibility of a Swedish fish bomb.

The Swedish fish were most likely made in a Chinese factory that had just finished up making sparklers and didn't clean the equipment...

 

[Jason Flare]

The Swedish fish were most likely made in a Chinese factory that had just finished up making sparklers and didn't clean the equipment...

We’re you the guy worried about fluoride?

 

[enbloc]

We’re you the guy worried about fluoride?

Drinking it yes. Carrying in checked luggage on a plane... not so much.

 

[TheGreekFreak]

This is all kind of nutty. I don't know the answer and I understand people are looking for answers to stop these tragedies but wtf have we come to when we're taking about putting soldiers in schools as a solution??

I really think the quest to find a quick fix on both ends of the political spectrum is the wrong approach. The best resource is the actual shooter himself! Its rare we catch one of these guys alive but with this one, the movie theater guy, etc we have a golden opportunity to get real information instead of baseless theories and politically motivated "solutions". Only when we really understand similarities and patterns between these people can we hypothesize what significant environmental (or biological) factors can take someone in a similar situation over the edge.

Just saying "its a gun issue" or "mental health issue" is useless. We need real evidence and only then can we build a system rooted in schools that may have an impact.

 

[Picton]

Yeah. No.

I loved my time in the Guard, and the nature of the Guard makes their soldiers VERY MOS-proficient.

But I would not have wanted most of my buddies securing schools.

 

[Matt-CZ]

Yeah. No.

I loved my time in the Guard, and the nature of the Guard makes their soldiers VERY MOS-proficient.

But I would not have wanted most of my buddies securing schools.

Plus, the guard is supposed to be part time soldiers. They already have foreign deployments with the never-ending wars. Add domestic guard duty and it's a full time service practically.

 

[JayMcB]

it's absurd to think a resource officer in a school won't lower the likelihood of one of these cowards going somewhere else as it is no longer a free fire zone. someone shooting back may give them pause.

Arming teachers in Israel has worked for over 40 years

once you get past the simple fact that not gun free zone is safer than gun free zone, then it's a matter for the community to decide.

local PD? private security? train and arm teachers? Combination? It's always been up to municipalities, and it should continue to be so based on threat assessment.

however....there should be language holding these munis responsible if they decide to do nothing. I say thi sas a taxpayer who pays for schools in 4 different towns, and after June, my kids won't be using any of them.

GFZ's don't work.

Give me an internet connection and I can work from a school a couple of days a month, and as an LTC holder and as a CORI-checked adult, I'd gladly volunteer.

 

[Matt-CZ]

I’m more interested in the possibility of a Swedish fish bomb.

It was an explosion of flavor. Don't think that counts.

 

[Matt-CZ]

Maybe this thread should be shut down and ported into a mega dumpster fire of absurdity of the school shooting subject

 

[daveyburt]

Even though arming staff/security at schools may work - to the anti's - that would mean that guns were a solution to a problem. Can't have that be the case when they claim guns are the problem. - just doesn't fit their story.

Which essentially means, their 'cause' is more important than the lives they claim to be trying to protect.

yup - sounds about right
:/

 

[robjax]

First problem, you are buying into the do anything for the children frame. That ends with us in camps. Second problem is you can't armor a school, you can't put enough cops in a school. And all of it is security theatre. None of it will help the children or slow down the gun grabbers. Get your head out of your enemies frame, you think what they want you to think and they have defeated you.

I think your assertion are a little extreme in regard to us ending up in camps.


Having said that....I'm not actually buying into the "anything for the children" frame. But I am of the opinion that we are playing directly into the anti's hands by doing nothing. We are the adults. It's up to us to find solutions or strategies to deal with these events. We know theses events exist and they occur and there are copycats so there will be more. I am not an anti so I believe we need to work to spoil all future attempts be it in a school, church, mall, concert...wherever. That means good people must take up arms so they are ready to respond immediately to a potential threat.

I am under no illusion that stopping these events will slow down or change the gun grabber's mind. It will just take these situations off their radar and strip them of a bit of ammunition. Their ultimate goal will never change. But why do we need to sit by doing nothing and watch children die? I am also not of the mind that we just let the kids sit there unprotected and be slaughtered.

The goal isn't to slow down the gun grabbers. That is a different fight. The goal would be to slow down the gunman/shooter. I am of the mind that if these people are met with any type of resistance it can cause enough of a delay to allow support to get on scene and eliminate the threat. In most of these cases it is a lone gunman. One, two or even three people shooting back is going to force him to alter his plans quickly. See, these are "GUN FREE" zones and they do not expect to see any GUNZ.

If you want to let the kids shelter in place that's fine. Just put processes in place ensure that nobody can get to them until the threat is neutralized.

I believe your solution or at least you implied that teachers whether armed or not to charge the gunman armed with a semi-automatic firearm....And I agree that this is potentially a last ditch effort to subdue the gunman but it might make more sense to try and neutralize him with our own firearms from a covered position. But I could be wrong.

 

[Matt-CZ]

I think your assertion are a little extreme in regard to us ending up in camps.


Having said that....I'm not actually buying into the "anything for the children" frame. But I am of the opinion that we are playing directly into the anti's hands by doing nothing. We are the adults. It's up to us to find solutions or strategies to deal with these events. We know theses events exist and they occur and there are copycats so there will be more. I am not an anti so I believe we need to work to spoil all future attempts be it in a school, church, mall, concert...wherever. That means good people must take up arms so they are ready to respond immediately to a potential threat.

I am under no illusion that stopping these events will slow down or change the gun grabber's mind. It will just take these situations off their radar and strip them of a bit of ammunition. Their ultimate goal will never change. But why do we need to sit by doing nothing and watch children die? I am also not of the mind that we just let the kids sit there unprotected and be slaughtered.

The goal isn't to slow down the gun grabbers. That is a different fight. The goal would be to slow down the gunman/shooter. I am of the mind that if these people are met with any type of resistance it can cause enough of a delay to allow support to get on scene and eliminate the threat. In most of these cases it is a lone gunman. One, two or even three people shooting back is going to force him to alter his plans quickly. See, these are "GUN FREE" zones and they do not expect to see any GUNZ.

If you want to let the kids shelter in place that's fine. Just put processes in place ensure that nobody can get to them until the threat is neutralized.

I believe your solution or at least you implied that teachers whether armed or not to charge the gunman armed with a semi-automatic firearm....And I agree that this is potentially a last ditch effort to subdue the gunman but it might make more sense to try and neutralize him with our own firearms from a covered position. But I could be wrong.

I feel the same way. We have to be seen doing something to address the problem of lone killers, because if not, the dialogue will only be populated by the voices of anti-gunners. The conversation about this problem is happening. Responsible gun owners need to be part of it or end up getting hosed again.

If these shootings keep happening, which seems likely, it's only a matter of time until someone gets Iphone video of kids getting executed at school. Politically that will be a KO punch. Need to figure something out.

 

[not new guy]

We have to “do something” so that the antis aren’t the only ones talking about it? How about we just talk about it too?

 

[Climbnsink]

I gots the solution. We need Chris Kyle types on sniper overwatch of every school child in Murica. Safety through pink misting school shooters. -> Sarcasm disclaimer

 

[TLB]

Just repeal GFSZ.

 

[1776]

Just rotate some armed liberal politicians through the schools for guard duty, they're all well trained...aren't they?
However, their full auto mouths would have to be suppressed which would lead to legal implications

 

[enbloc]

 

[tuna]

Are those two GAs wearing shoulder rigs for open carry? I can't see the off side well. I thought the GA were an anti-gun group?

 

[robjax]

Are those two GAs wearing shoulder rigs for open carry? I can't see the off side well. I thought the GA were an anti-gun group?

I have no issue with them exercising 2A.

 

[tuna]

I have no issue with them exercising 2A.

No, I meant I can’t see the left side and tell if they have firearms or not. I have no issue with anyone exercising 2A, but the Guardian Angels had a very anti gun position.

 

[weekendracer]

why does everyone think put military people in our schools is a good idea?! WTF?!
And more importantly, I've seen how "well trained" a lot of these people are. GMAFB

And FYI, before the haters jump on me, both my husband and I were NG, he was also FT Army 3 years.

If they start talking MP's, I might go along for the ride. Regular Army or any other service is not trained to deal with civilian issues.

Some here may say neither are cops, so there's that.

 

[FrugalFannie]

It's all well and good till some idiot forgets his AR in the shitter, besides, everyone knows the national guard isn't trained for this shit, it's a much better roll for the TSA to take hold of.

I do NOT want the TSA in our schools! These cheese ***** I need to stop before I explode.
I am NOT for militarizing/locking down our schools. Talk about a big slide down the "slippery slope". You do this type of thing and the side of the mountain just came and wiped out the village! GOVERNMENT is NOT the answer. Let the teachers be armed. On their own dime. Hell, there's enough bootlickers who worship "every public servant" that businesses would step up and offer to help train them. And you know, they would then probably have more training than your average LEO.

 

[Drix]

I do NOT want the TSA in our schools! These cheese ***** I need to stop before I explode.
I am NOT for militarizing/locking down our schools. Talk about a big slide down the "slippery slope". You do this type of thing and the side of the mountain just came and wiped out the village! GOVERNMENT is NOT the answer. Let the teachers be armed. On their own dime. Hell, there's enough bootlickers who worship "every public servant" that businesses would step up and offer to help train them. And you know, they would then probably have more training than your average LEO.

Chillax, I was being sarcastic about how useful the TSA is. Can you imagine the shitstorm when Julio gets a full body cavity search after getting a drug hit for trying to smuggle a gram of weed into homeroom?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Unlike police, soldiers and national guardsmen are not treated as "highly trusted". Not only are they generally not allowed to be armed off duty, but when you see them doing security theater (like hanging around airports post 9-11), they often are required to do so with no ammo in their weapon, though I don't know if they are allowed to have ammo on their person. Also, unlike cops, if one is involved in a force incident off duty, their status does not provide them with the presumption of innocence provided to a LEO.

The solution is like the FFDO program. Govt types were so worried about arming mere civilians, that they had to deputize the pilots as LEOs. That could be done with trained teachers as well. Put an ordnance locker in each classroom, and keep it secret which teachers are weapons qualified and have EBRs in their locker.