Ma./Fed. laws re:ammo & primers [ qty ]

[BIG GUN]

I was talking to someone at a club meet the other night and he told me that the Ma.gun laws of 98 addressed the amount of ammo & primers that we are allowed to store. My powder permit only restricts smokeless & black, but nothing else.
I have heard that the Dem's. were thinking of passing a law, stating that anyone owning more than ten firearms, & or 1000 rounds of ammo, would be considered to have an arsenal, and be subject to a $300.00/yr. permit, and inspection by the BATFE as many as 4 times a yr. Is there any truth to these things?

 

[Pilgrim]

You think that the BATF has enough people not doing anything to visit perhaps 10 million (or more) houses 4 times each year ?

Who told you this - a Dem grabber trying to get you to ditch your guns?

 

[Chipperman]

http://www.goal.org/misc/faq/powder.html

(1) Exemption: License, Registration, or Permit: In accordance with the provisions of M.G.L. c. 148 § 13, the Board hereby prescribes the following quantities of explosive materials that shall be exempt from License, Registration, and Permit and may be kept, or stored in a building or other structure:

(a) Small Arms Ammunition

1. Not more than 10,000 rounds of rim fire ammunition.

2. Not more than 10,000 rounds of center fire ammunition.

3. Not more than 5,000 rounds of shotgun ammunition.

(b) Small Arms Ammunition Primers

1. Not more than 1,000 caps or other small arms primers.

(c) Smokeless Propellants

1. Not more than 16 pounds.

2. Persons under 18 years of age may not keep or store Smokeless Propellants.

3. Not more than two pounds of such propellant shall be stored in a multiple family dwelling or a building of public access.

(d) Black Powder

1. Not more than two pounds.

2. Persons under 18 years of age may not keep or store black powder.

Read the link for the full explanation.
You can store more, if you have a fire permit.

 

[Len-2A Training]

There have been a few prior discussions here wrt storage of ammo, powder and primers. The MA CMRs that put the limits in place have also been posted. I suggest setting your User CP to show ALL Threads and then doing a search here in the Gun Laws forum for "powder" and/or "primers". After you read all that, you'll qualify as an expert on the subject.

 

[KMaurer]

And, yes the limits on on how many guns and how much ammunition constitute an "arsenal" are on the Brady wish list and have been proposed by barking moonbats Dems on several occassions. Their primary purpose is to help portray the restrictions that they're really pushing seem like a fair and reasonable compromises.

Ken

 

[Fooped]

1,001 primers or more is TOO much? They come 1000 to a box! Am I to understand that having more than 1 box is illegal without a seperate permit?

 

[Len-2A Training]

Fooped, if that is what the CMR says, then yes (I haven't memorized the quantities).

You get the permit from the Fire Dept and it should be a no-hassle deal. It costs me $10 for 2 years.

 

[Lugnut]

It's late and I can't find it... but I thought somewhere on GOAL's web sight it said something about up to 5000 primers... and we wonder why MA sucks so bad?

 

[KMaurer]

The complete regulations are in 527 CMR 13.

The limits exempted from any permit requirements are

(a) Small Arms Ammunition
1. Not more than 10,000 rounds of rim fire ammunition.
2. Not more than 10,000 rounds of center fire ammunition.
3. Not more than 5,000 rounds of shotgun ammunition.
(b) Small Arms Ammunition Primers
1. Not more than 1,000 caps or other small arms primers.
(c) Smokeless Propellants
1. Not more than 16 pounds.
2. Persons under 18 years of age may not keep or store Smokeless Propellants.
3. Not more than two pounds of such propellant shall be stored in a multiple family dwelling or a building of public access.
(d) Black Powder
1. Not more than two pounds.
2. Persons under 18 years of age may not keep or store black powder.

With a permit from your local fire department, the limits are

(a) Small Arms Ammunition: Private Use. Small arms ammunition in amounts over that specified in 527 CMR 13.04(1), that do not exceed 100,000 total rounds at any one time, may be kept for private use provided none of the individual limitations listed below are exceeded.
1. 10,001 to 30,000 rounds of rim fire ammunition.
2. 10,001 to 50,000 rounds of center fire ammunition not to include shotgun ammunition.
3. 10,001 to 50,000 rounds of shotgun ammunition not to include center fire ammunition.
...
(c) Small Arms Ammunition Primers: Private Use
Not to exceed 10,000 Small Arms Ammunition Primers.
...
(e) Smokeless Propellants: Private Use
1. Not to exceed 48 pounds Smokeless Propellants.
2. Persons under 18 years of age may not keep or store Smokeless Propellants.
3. The head of the local fire department may limit the quantity of smokeless propellants stored by permit to as low as two pounds if such propellant shall be stored in a multiple family dwelling or a building of public access.
...
(g) Black Powder: Private Use
1. Not to exceed five pounds of black powder.
2. Persons under 18 years of age may not keep or store black powder.
3. The head of the local fire department may limit the quantity of black powder stored by permit to as low as two pounds if such black powder shall be stored in a multiple family dwelling or a building of public access.

Ken

 

[Chipperman]

So just suppose you get this permit from your local Fire Dept.
Then suppose, God forbid, your house catches fire.
Then suppose the Fire Dept is reluctant to go into your house because they know you have a lot of ammunition in there.

Sound far fetched? It has happened. Fire departments have let houses burn to the ground because of fear from ammunition in a dwelling cooking off.

Now this is the exception, as most firefighters will do their best to save your house. There are some, however that will not go in because of a perceived threat from ammo. How well do you know the Fire Dept in your town?

 

[KMaurer]

Fire departments have let houses burn to the ground because of fear from ammunition in a dwelling cooking off.

I've heard that said before, but would like to hear of some specific examples. Sounds like the sort of lazy, dumb tools from the California prison camps that my brother used to hate to supervise on fires and fire prevention work, always trying to play mind games directed at getting out of any work, and otherwise not knowing which end of an inch and a half line the water comes out. Anybody who's ever done any fire work knows that ammunition is essentially harmless in a fire unless it's in a sealed container or a loaded gun.

Ken

 

[Chipperman]

I'll look for documented examples, but here's a thread from THR:
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=222720&highlight=house+department+cooking

 

[Chipperman]

http://www.ci.corvallis.or.us/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=1565&Itemid=1904#ammo

There is a documented instance (which occurred elsewhere, by the way) in which a loaded rifle, mounted on a wall rack, kept discharging during a fire, hitting the command vehicle, causing fire personnel to believe that they were being shot at. They withdrew to a safe location and, consequently, the house was destroyed. Fortunately, no one was hurt in that instance. So, this is another good reason for not keeping loaded weapons in the home.

No direct reference to that one.

I'll keep looking

OK, here's the Waltham, MA site:
http://www.walthamfire.com/kids/tips/escape-from-fire.html

Gas mains, propane tanks, and even small arms ammunition can explode causing serious injury.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Ken, there was a news story on TV in the Boston area of this happening. I recall them interviewing the fire chief who told all the viewers that they pulled out of the house due to the fear of "exploding ammo" since the owner was known to be a reloader.

Subsequently I spoke to my fire chief about it and he told me what we all know, that their turn-out gear will deflect any spraying bits of ammo cases (the bullets won't fly unless in a gun barrel) and the men won't be injured.

Not a bad idea to discuss it with your fire chiefs and make sure that they are educated in the matter.

 

[BIG GUN]

I had a fire that was started by a defective dehumidifier in my gun room many years ago. I was home at the time, and the town fire dept. was aware of my reloading. I n fact one fireman lived next door to me and said that he would head south if I ever had a fire. He was the first one to respond when it happened. The burning powder actually put out the fire before they arrived, and ammo was all over the floor, but very little cooked off. The chief did ask if I had a storage permit, which I did, and that was it.
My major problem was with the insurance co. They only know devaluation of property. I hired a fire specialist, and am glad I did. He fought for me, and after a year, finally got a reasonable settlement. That was 6% well spent.