Hunter shoots himself in the chest while checking ice thickness

[whacko]

Fudds are typically associated with muzzleloaders and double-barrel shotguns, no? Fudds also often don't follow safety even though they think they do - even in my hunter ed course the fudd instructors were very unsafe. This story includes both parts of the fudd recipe, hence my comments. No need to be so defensive about it, gee...

Not all DBL barrel and BP rifle owners are fudds.....Not even close.

My point is.....Some gun owners enjoy hunting as much as the self defense part of owning fire arms. So they own a DBL barrel and a smoke pole......And Glocks and ars and all that as well. I just hate seeing hunters in general being lumped in with fudds just because they own hunting guns. And just cuz a guy hunts BP season does not make him a fudd. Its three extra weeks to tag out and fill the freezer.

This guy was 18......And apparently a dumb ass. Does not matter what gun he was toting.

 

[Woodstock]

If he was thumping the ice with the gun butt, the barrel was aimed upward and the slug probably went more vertical through the muscle rather than a horizontal through and through wound. Lucky it didn't catch him under the chin.

 

[drgrant]

Not all DBL barrel and BP rifle owners are fudds.....Not even close.

My point is.....Some gun owners enjoy hunting as much as the self defense part of owning fire arms. So they own a DBL barrel and a smoke pole......And Glocks and ars and all that as well. I just hate seeing hunters in general being lumped in with fudds just because they own hunting guns. And just cuz a guy hunts BP season does not make him a fudd. Its three extra weeks to tag out and fill the freezer.

This guy was 18......And apparently a dumb ass. Does not matter what gun he was toting.

I'm still wagering he was a fudd. Shooting yourself with a muzzleloader is a special kind of stupid. Not all hunters are fudds, that's not even close.

-Mike

 

[Jsfitzgerald85]

does anyone know how the firearm discharged? Was his finger on the trigger? Or did it discharge simply from the impact? If it was from the impact, is that a defect with the firearm, or are muzzle loaders held to different safety standards (drop test, etc)? I have no experience with them so im curious.

 

[MisterHappy]

Fudds are typically associated with muzzleloaders and double-barrel shotguns, no? Fudds also often don't follow safety even though they think they do - even in my hunter ed course the fudd instructors were very unsafe. This story includes both parts of the fudd recipe, hence my comments. No need to be so defensive about it, gee...

No. Fudds are gun owners that see no reason for evil black rifles, and handguns with more than six shots, unless it's for Gallery shooting. And, more importantly, think that YOU don't need what they don't want.

I have a muzzle-loader.....going out with my son tomorrow AM.....
I have fine SxS shotties.....and an old A5 or so, and others.....
I have a pistol for gallery matches


Am I a Fudd? (also I teach Hunter Ed....)


If I also had an EBR, some Milsurp, and a semi-auto handgun that held more than 10 rounds would I be a Fudd then?*


I shoot mostly Trap.....but I'm more than fine with USPSA IDPA, and AR15 folks. What about now?

It's sh!t like this, saying that a person with a gun that you don't like (in either direction, Fudd or Duff) is wrong, that makes the Moonbats cackle with demented glee.

Person referenced in the story was a dumbass. That's enough to say, as it was his actions that are being judged.

And, I'd say that a person that takes advantage of ML season is a hunter, not a Fudd.

Not being defensive. But if someone were to say that AKs have no place, some here might get a bit miffed.

Oh....I have no problem with AKs - in fact, I missed out on one, just before Healey did her thing. How does that rate on the Fudd scale?


*

Spoiler

I do, BTW.....

 

[whacko]

No. Fudds are gun owners that see no reason for evil black rifles, and handguns with more than six shots, unless it's for Gallery shooting. And, more importantly, think that YOU don't need what they don't want.

I have a muzzle-loader.....going out with my son tomorrow AM.....
I have fine SxS shotties.....and an old A5 or so, and others.....
I have a pistol for gallery matches


Am I a Fudd? (also I teach Hunter Ed....)


If I also had an EBR, some Milsurp, and a semi-auto handgun that held more than 10 rounds would I be a Fudd then?*


I shoot mostly Trap.....but I'm more than fine with USPSA IDPA, and AR15 folks. What about now?

It's sh!t like this, saying that a person with a gun that you don't like (in either direction, Fudd or Duff) is wrong, that makes the Moonbats cackle with demented glee.

Person referenced in the story was a dumbass. That's enough to say, as it was his actions that are being judged.

And, I'd say that a person that takes advantage of ML season is a hunter, not a Fudd.

Not being defensive. But if someone were to say that AKs have no place, some here might get a bit miffed.

Oh....I have no problem with AKs - in fact, I missed out on one, just before Healey did her thing. How does that rate on the Fudd scale?


*

Spoiler

I do, BTW.....

Articulated much better than my rebuttal. Good luck tomorrow. I have 2 more outings planned with my boy to hopefully harvest another buck. Cheers......here's to muzzle loader season.

Next week I'll dust off the black pistols for some plate shoots.....But till then I have a freezer to fill.

 

[whacko]

does anyone know how the firearm discharged? Was his finger on the trigger? Or did it discharge simply from the impact? If it was from the impact, is that a defect with the firearm, or are muzzle loaders held to different safety standards (drop test, etc)? I have no experience with them so im curious.

I would say that would depend on the gun. Probable it discharged with the impact if it was a bolt style muzzle loader (like a TC black diamond) with a safety not engaged. Older style hammer fired may have been the culprit but I would say the hammer would have had to be cocked. Percussion cap fired gun even with hammer down on the cap.......I'd think if you slammed the gun hard enough might fire the cap.

 

[Goliathan]

does anyone know how the firearm discharged? Was his finger on the trigger? Or did it discharge simply from the impact? If it was from the impact, is that a defect with the firearm, or are muzzle loaders held to different safety standards (drop test, etc)? I have no experience with them so im curious.

I'm going out on a limb to suggest that using the butt of a loaded rifle as a sounding hammer is a bad idea no matter what style of rifle it is.

But yeah. I think there are drop safeties in modern muzzleloaders, aren't there? There are, however, some reeealy old muzzleloaders out in circulation. I'd be interested to know what it was.

 

[kalash]

Just to clarify my earlier point - not all BP and double-barrel guys are fudds but all fudds are BP and double-barrel guys.

It's like cars - driving fast, on its own, isn't an issue. Driving a Honda, on its own, is perfectly fine. But if someone crashed a Civic at 100mph - hell, probably a ricer trying to street race.

So no, I don't have anything against those that hunt with muzzleloaders but when other factors are thrown in (such as being a moron and extremely unsafe), well, probably a fudd.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

I would say that would depend on the gun. Probable it discharged with the impact if it was a bolt style muzzle loader (like a TC black diamond) with a safety not engaged. Older style hammer fired may have been the culprit but I would say the hammer would have had to be cocked. Percussion cap fired gun even with hammer down on the cap.......I'd think if you slammed the gun hard enough might fire the cap.

Hunted with someone who was carrying a percussion sidelock horizontally with one hand and the hammer got caught on his cargo pocket as he was walking and it discharged. No one was injured.

Bob

 

[bigblue]

Sure is a lot of defensiveness towards the FUDD label in this thread, I wonder where that comes from?


Pop quiz: When you shoot skeet, how many cartridges do you load max at a time?

 

[MisterHappy]

Just to clarify my earlier point - not all BP and double-barrel guys are fudds but all fudds are BP and double-barrel guys.

It's like cars - driving fast, on its own, isn't an issue. Driving a Honda, on its own, is perfectly fine. But if someone crashed a Civic at 100mph - hell, probably a ricer trying to street race.

So no, I don't have anything against those that hunt with muzzleloaders but when other factors are thrown in (such as being a moron and extremely unsafe), well, probably a fudd.

But an ND with an AR or AK is a different thing?

Sorry....but this is rankling me.

There's a difference between Fudd and Unsafe. Actually, I've seen more sketchy behavior from people with stuff on the more Tacticool end of the spectrum. Main thread is that they tended to be younger/newer. There's a learning curve, until the (hopefully) well-taught safety stuff becomes automatic. Whether with a Parker, a T/C, or an EBR. We'll address handguns another time.

 

[kalash]

But an ND with an AR or AK is a different thing?

Sorry....but this is rankling me.

There's a difference between Fudd and Unsafe. Actually, I've seen more sketchy behavior from people with stuff on the more Tacticool end of the spectrum. Main thread is that they tended to be younger/newer. There's a learning curve, until the (hopefully) well-taught safety stuff becomes automatic. Whether with a Parker, a T/C, or an EBR. We'll address handguns another time.

I've seen the exact opposite - the younger "tacticool"-ish guys I shoot with are perfectly safe and I trust them 100%. The old seasoned fudds tend to swing their shotguns past me on the skeet field and then offer unsolicited advice. Oh, and the absolute least safe behavior I've ever seen was from hunter ed instructors who were legit fudds (no, really, they didn't get why anyone would "need" a semi-auto). So yeah, my experience indicates that fudds are pretty unsafe.

 

[bigblue]

But an ND with an AR or AK is a different thing?

Sorry....but this is rankling me.

There's a difference between Fudd and Unsafe. Actually, I've seen more sketchy behavior from people with stuff on the more Tacticool end of the spectrum. Main thread is that they tended to be younger/newer. There's a learning curve, until the (hopefully) well-taught safety stuff becomes automatic. Whether with a Parker, a T/C, or an EBR. We'll address handguns another time.

I've seen more sketchy safety behavior from idiots with over/unders sweeping the group with a closed shotgun. We'll address side-by-sides another time.

 

[kalash]

Pop quiz: When you shoot skeet, how many cartridges do you load max at a time?

Max I've ever loaded was the max my shotgun would hold. "Lemme get three doubles on report."

 

[MisterHappy]

Do you call our the shotgun guys when they do it?

I do. Not even a muzzle sweep. You have a closed breech, you get called out (politely, the first time...there's not a third time at my Club).

 

[kalash]

Do you call our the shotgun guys when they do it?

I do. Not even a muzzle sweep. You have a closed breech, you get called out (politely, the first time...there's not a third time at my Club).

Yup. The fudds seem far more concerned about me loading four on positions 1/2/6/7 than their double-barrel buddies sweeping everyone with a closed gun.

 

[bigblue]

Do you call our the shotgun guys when they do it?

I do. Not even a muzzle sweep. You have a closed breech, you get called out (politely, the first time...there's not a third time at my Club).

You would not believe the anger and indignity of some young whippersnapper daring to call out one of the elder "I've been shooting skeet here my whole life" dipshits. Maybe that's the ****ing problem: Get out of the house more.

And for the record, I'm not a kid, child, or anywhere close but I'm also not 70.

- - - Updated - - -

Heard on the skeet range: "I shot a revolver once twenty years ago. Didn't hit a thing so I went back to my shotgun."

 

[kalash]

Heard on the skeet range: "I shot a revolver once twenty years ago. Didn't hit a thing so I went back to my shotgun."

Reminds me of the fudd hunter ed instructor I had. We were in the basement of the clubhouse with people above us and he was talking about safety with revolvers. He asked the group if it was safe to point the gun up at the ceiling and we all agreed that it wasn't. He agreed and then said, and I quote, "well, we'll just pretend that it's a safe direction", pointed the gun up, and continued talking about "safety". Sadly, although that was the best (worst?) quote from that course, it was not the most unsafe behavior I saw from the instructors.

 

[sig shooter]

I keep my T/C renegade on halfcock when hunting, it effectively ties up the rifle until you are ready to rear back the hammer to full cock. This kid must be pretty stupid to think that was a good idea.

 

[sig shooter]

Sure is a lot of defensiveness towards the FUDD label in this thread, I wonder where that comes from?


Pop quiz: When you shoot skeet, how many cartridges do you load max at a time?

One.

 

[Sawicki1991]

I feel bad for the kid. I had an older inline ML that would drop the hammer if the butt was smacked. Used it for 1 season then ran it through a bandsaw. And i had an ND 2 years ago during ML season. Had gloves on and went to bring the hammer back down after the shot i wanted to take didnt happen and the hammer slipped from under my thumb and bang. Moral of the story is accidents happen. The kid made a mistake and nearly lost his life.

 

[whacko]

One.

Gonna be aweful hard to hit the doubles then lol

 

[kalash]

i had an ND...
...
Moral of the story is accidents happen.

Hmm...

 

[whacko]

I'm going out on a limb to suggest that using the butt of a loaded rifle as a sounding hammer is a bad idea no matter what style of rifle it is.

But yeah. I think there are drop safeties in modern muzzleloaders, aren't there? There are, however, some reeealy old muzzleloaders out in circulation. I'd be interested to know what it was.

Mine is hammer fired but has a transfer bar as well as half cock so the modern ones are much safer. Still......You won't see me point it at my chest and bang the buttstock on the ground lol

 

[falcon123]

He's an 18 year old kid. Sometimes kids do dumb things. Cut him some slack.

That being said, I find it shocking that he took a bullet from a muzzleloader to the chest at point blank range and lived.

This . I'm sure none of us have ever narrowly missed death doing stupid things.

 

[whacko]

This . I'm sure none of us have ever narrowly missed death doing stupid things.

Well....Problem I have with this statement is......I don't "cut slack" for stupidity. If I was that ****ing stupid to do something like that I would expect to get my balls busted for a looooooong time. No slack on that kind of idiocy. Never.

 

[bigblue]

This . I'm sure none of us have ever narrowly missed death doing stupid things.

How many of us have narrowly missed death because they pointed a loaded rifle at their chests and tried to break something open? There is stupid, then there is Darwin Award stupid. Doing stupid things with guns gets people killed.

This is up there with lighting fireworks off your head.

 

[MisterHappy]

Sure is a lot of defensiveness towards the FUDD label in this thread, I wonder where that comes from?


Pop quiz: When you shoot skeet, how many cartridges do you load max at a time?

From painting with too broad a brush. Like saying that everyone with an AR platform rifle is a Tacticool Mall-Ninja, or frustrated Balckwater Operator-wannabee.

Re the quiz: For regulation skeet, two, unless there's an understanding on the field. At my Club, one guy uses a tacticool (descriptive, not pejorative) shottie on the Skeet field - and loads 8. He gets them on report until he's done. fun, and safe.

It's not a matter of how many rounds you have loaded....it's where the damn thing is pointing! We have "poaching" events at my Trap field. Thee shooters will be loaded, action closed, at one time . No issues....all the guns are pointing the right way.

Re; the people that get slammed by Oldsters for calling out safety issues - if it happens repeatedly (i.e. after the second warning), go to your BoD and let them know that there's an issue. Obviously, polite does not work. But, please let me know who they are, so I can keep then out of my Club! When my kids were 7/8 they were scoring and running the Trap fields. I told them it was their job to enforce safety rules, and I'd back them. Kid or not, safety is everyone's responsibility. I've thrown Members under the bus for handling a rifle while the Red Light was on, on the rifle range. Why? because I reminded them, "NO...." and then, on the way home, my then ~12 y.o. told me he'd done the same (I hadn't known that). Called the President from the car on the way home.

Re Kalash's course - sorry you had idiots for instructors. Glad you were able to figure out that not all was well. Apparently, the subject of the story in the OP took the same class.


RE the story about shooting revolver, then going back to shotgun.....I'm better at Trap....but I keep shooting the handgun, too.

RE Sawicki's story....if there's no injury, and no damage, you have a story, not an incident.

 

[whacko]

From painting with too broad a brush. Like saying that everyone with an AR platform rifle is a Tacticool Mall-Ninja, or frustrated Balckwater Operator-wannabee.

Re the quiz: For regulation skeet, two, unless there's an understanding on the field. At my Club, one guy uses a tacticool (descriptive, not pejorative) shottie on the Skeet field - and loads 8. He gets them on report until he's done. fun, and safe.

It's not a matter of how many rounds you have loaded....it's where the damn thing is pointing! We have "poaching" events at my Trap field. Thee shooters will be loaded, action closed, at one time . No issues....all the guns are pointing the right way.

Re; the people that get slammed by Oldsters for calling out safety issues - if it happens repeatedly (i.e. after the second warning), go to your BoD and let them know that there's an issue. Obviously, polite does not work. But, please let me know who they are, so I can keep then out of my Club! When my kids were 7/8 they were scoring and running the Trap fields. I told them it was their job to enforce safety rules, and I'd back them. Kid or not, safety is everyone's responsibility. I've thrown Members under the bus for handling a rifle while the Red Light was on, on the rifle range. Why? because I reminded them, "NO...." and then, on the way home, my then ~12 y.o. told me he'd done the same (I hadn't known that). Called the President from the car on the way home.

Re Kalash's course - sorry you had idiots for instructors. Glad you were able to figure out that not all was well. Apparently, the subject of the story in the OP took the same class.


RE the story about shooting revolver, then going back to shotgun.....I'm better at Trap....but I keep shooting the handgun, too.

RE Sawicki's story....if there's no injury, and no damage, you have a story, not an incident.

My hunter Ed instructors were not fudds at all. One brought his colt manufactured AR to the class where all the orange guns come out for "safe handling and loading" instruction. He had the AR on the table and pointed to it and said "can i legally hunt deer with this rifle in NH"? One young woman said "no way that's a fully automatic assault rifle". He then proceeded into a side bar lesson on what that rifle actually was.....Why would she have assumed it was full auto......That you can legally hunt with it......and and how it is our right and DUTY to own one. They are not all fudds