How many rounds is enough?

[bigblue]

I don't think 10k rounds of combined centerfire ammo is unreasonable between 9mm, .45, 5.56, & 7.62 varieties. 50k combined is a ceiling not a stock level.

 

[headednorth]

I've posted it numerous times.

Websites that people like to quote here rarely, if ever get updated. The current correct info can be found here, the changes were effective 1/1/15.
https://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/threads/271760-MA-Ammo-Components-Storage-CMR-2015

That's why I posted that sticky thread to give you folks the right info. Most here never search the forum for anything and then keep posting old or bad info.

Do the individual towns have any ability to tweak the numbers if they wish? For example, you need a permit for >16lbs of powder up to 48lbs, after which you need a license. Could the town say they dont want more than 20lbs period?

 

[Supermoto]

I stock ammo, but by some standards people are throwing up here i guess i would be a joke. Im not by any means saying i wouldn't love to have 50,000 rounds of 5.56 stored in my basement, but dont put storing ammo above consistent training on your priorities list. Too many of the "I keep 50,000 rounds of ammo in my basement for shtf" types, would take about half of that ammo to hit a IPSC target at 50 yards.

IMHO in the standard "SHTF" prepper-porn unrealistic scenario, the guy who shot 50,000 rounds a year training prior to "SHTF" is going to be much, much, better off than the guy who hoarded 50,000 rounds in his basement "just in case the SHTF", as a matter of fact I'm willing to bet the guy who shot 50,000 a year, but always kept say, 1,000-10,000 in reserve for juuuust in case TEOTWAWKI, or more realistically, there was another ammo shortage, will quite easily live quite comfortably off the other guy's ammo if he needed to.

Barter/trade/arming your own army aside, what fantasy situation do you find yourself firing 50,000 rounds of ammo, or even 1,000 rounds of ammo, in one direction without some coming in the opposite direction? put down the prepper novels and be realistic. Unless you are constantly training, you are just hoarding stuff the the faster guy.

Yep. Plus if you leave your place, you better be in good enough shape to make it past the local McDs

 

[drgrant]

I stock ammo, but by some standards people are throwing up here i guess i would be a joke. Im not by any means saying i wouldn't love to have 50,000 rounds of 5.56 stored in my basement, but dont put storing ammo above consistent training on your priorities list. Too many of the "I keep 50,000 rounds of ammo in my basement for shtf" types, would take about half of that ammo to hit a IPSC target at 50 yards.

IMHO in the standard "SHTF" prepper-porn unrealistic scenario, the guy who shot 50,000 rounds a year training prior to "SHTF" is going to be much, much, better off than the guy who hoarded 50,000 rounds in his basement "just in case the SHTF", as a matter of fact I'm willing to bet the guy who shot 50,000 a year, but always kept say, 1,000-10,000 in reserve for juuuust in case TEOTWAWKI, or more realistically, there was another ammo shortage, will quite easily live quite comfortably off the other guy's ammo if he needed to.

Barter/trade/arming your own army aside, what fantasy situation do you find yourself firing 50,000 rounds of ammo, or even 1,000 rounds of ammo, in one direction without some coming in the opposite direction? put down the prepper novels and be realistic. Unless you are consistently training, you are just hoarding stuff the the faster guy.

Sound advice, but let's face facts... if they can hoard 50K worth of ammo they can probably afford to train pretty hard, too. So they should buy 50K and shoot a good portion of it every year. Having a good stockpile never hurts, because it can be rolled pretty fast. Particularly if there are market pressures, we've only seen that movie about like 6 times now since the 80s, and its always the same deal.... those who have ammo, and those that don't.

With most people (particularly around here) we have these guys waxing about deciding between two guns they probably shouldn't buy, and can't make up their mind about how to waste their money... when they should just be buying another case of ammo or two for an important fighting gun they have, instead of buying a gun they probably don't need. (it doesn't help that half of these threads are something like "what do I choose, shit or poop?"

-Mike

 

[Len-2A Training]

Do the individual towns have any ability to tweak the numbers if they wish? For example, you need a permit for >16lbs of powder up to 48lbs, after which you need a license. Could the town say they dont want more than 20lbs period?

Yes, the CMR are maximum numbers for a single family residence. Local Fire Chief can impose lesser numbers.

Yeah Len you need to take a deep breath because your sticky matches what I posted.

10,000 rounds center fire without permit
50,000 rounds centerfire with permit.

I don't understand your consternation that this is "old info".

You attach the chart, but obviously didn't read the rest of my thread there and I was addressing a bunch of posts not just a single one with no longer valid info.

- 100K with permit is no longer true. That works in our favor, it's now 130K.
- It is <10000 for no permit, not 10000. Small change that legally pushes many more to permit level.
- Qtys are per category, RF, CF and Shotgun each have their own maximums with or without permit.
- Storage requirements have changed for permit holders
- From my experience and discussions with a number of my former and current Fire Chiefs, most don't bother getting permits, so the higher quantities are legally irrelevant for most of you.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

With most people (particularly around here) we have these guys waxing about deciding between two guns they probably shouldn't buy, and can't make up their mind about how to waste their money... when they should just be buying another case of ammo or two for an important fighting gun they have, instead of buying a gun they probably don't need. (it doesn't help that half of these threads are something like "what do I choose, shit or poop?"

-Mike

This, so hard.

 

[bigblue]

Say you have half a dozen calibers, which I don't think is unreasonable, would it be unreasonable to have 5k rounds for each?

Len I said those were limits. Are you really arguing over a single round?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Say you have half a dozen calibers, which I don't think is unreasonable, would it be unreasonable to have 5k rounds for each?

I don't think any of it is unreasonable, some people collect porcelain cats. I do think having 5k of something you don't shoot that often taking up space and collecting dust is silly. I had 2 cases of 7.62x39 in the basement, I traded them for 5.56 because that is what I actually shoot, train with, and would use if I ever needed to.

 

[jibbr71]

Sound advice, but let's face facts... if they can hoard 50K worth of ammo they can probably afford to train pretty hard, too. So they should buy 50K and shoot a good portion of it every year. Having a good stockpile never hurts, because it can be rolled pretty fast. Particularly if there are market pressures, we've only seen that movie about like 6 times now since the 80s, and its always the same deal.... those who have ammo, and those that don't.

With most people (particularly around here) we have these guys waxing about deciding between two guns they probably shouldn't buy, and can't make up their mind about how to waste their money... when they should just be buying another case of ammo or two for an important fighting gun they have, instead of buying a gun they probably don't need. (it doesn't help that half of these threads are something like "what do I choose, shit or poop?"

-Mike

Those guys exist, but are probably outnumbered by the dude who has 10k or more stacked in the basement and couldn't make a mag change in his pistol(with one of his 2 spares) to save his life or know how to shoot from cover/concealement.

And he called the shit poop.

 

[bigblue]

I don't think any of it is unreasonable, some people collect porcelain cats. I think having 5k of something you don't shoot that often taking up space and collecting dust is silly. I had 2 cases of 7.62x39 in the basement, I traded them for 5.56 because that is what I actually shoot, train with, and would use if I ever needed to.

Touché but if you run through 500+ rounds in a range day I don't think having 5k on average is a waste. More 9mm and 5.56, less x39 because like you said: Stock what you shoot.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

Touché but if you run through 500+ rounds in a range day I don't think having 5k on average is a waste. More 9mm and 5.56, less x39 because like you said: Stock what you shoot.

Yeah, that's what I am saying.

 

[white feather]

Yeah Len you need to take a deep breath because your sticky matches what I posted.

10,000 rounds center fire without permit
50,000 rounds centerfire with permit.

I don't understand your consternation that this is "old info".

This exactly matches what I posted about quantities with a permit too...

 

[Al-Jim19]

Stock as much as you can afford, not necessarily because of a potential zombie apocalypse, but because there will come a day when you can't just run down to Walmart and buy your alotted 3 boxes o bullets. Moreover, you won't be able to get them at current prices.

 

[enbloc]

Very good points all of you and thank you for the multitude of responses.

I did just order 3000 rounds of green tip 5.56, and I don't even own an AR yet...call it a good start

russdenney, WHO are you?

 

[Love Machine]

Just FYI, here's what a CIA agent was caught with in Pakistan. Consider that this is how much you can carry and plan accordingly. I know of some people who have 30k stashes and I question if they'll ever actually be used or even useful in an emergency situation.

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2011/08/what-does-cia-agent-carry.html

 

[Da_lucche]

How many handgun rounds do you think you can fire off when SHTF, before you catch one yourself? Probably not 3000. Probably not even 300. My SHTF gun is a BCM AR, get a rifle or shotgun for SHTF.

Better reason son to stock up on ammo is so you can still practice when the next Prez tries to ban stuff. I'm buying up 5.56 while prices are relatively normal.

This is my thought as well. For SHTF, if you're worrying about your sidearm over a longarm, you're doing it wrong.

I stock up on as much rifle ammo as I can and I keep half as much on hand for my handguns

 

[Bob P]

Yeah Len you need to take a deep breath because your sticky matches what I posted.

10,000 rounds center fire without permit
50,000 rounds centerfire with permit.

I don't understand your consternation that this is "old info".

This exactly matches what I posted about quantities with a permit too...

I think the technicality he's concerned with is its is less than 10k with a permit not 10k. 9,999.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

lets cut to the chase here: the people who talk the most about "shtf stashes" and the like are the least likely to pull the trigger in opposition to corruption. These "shtf stash" discussions are an exercise in stupidity. Flame away as you see fit, but you know as well as I do.....

 

[Len-2A Training]

Just FYI, here's what a CIA agent was caught with in Pakistan. Consider that this is how much you can carry and plan accordingly. I know of some people who have 30k stashes and I question if they'll ever actually be used or even useful in an emergency situation.

I know that many here talk/think of "bugging out" but my many years working for companies that forced me to drive on I-95/I-495/Rte. 128 to get to/from work have convinced me that if we are gridlocked during rush hour every day of the week, in an impending crises there is NO HOPE WHATSOEVER of being able to move anywhere. Now if you live off in the woods somewhere this doesn't apply, but in the suburbs up to 30 miles from a major city it certainly is a major problem.

Unless you have a helicopter, know how to pilot it and have your own landing strip, you are screwed once you leave your home.

I also never expect "roving bands" of anything in the 'burbs well outside of the slum-cities. A couple of hoods might try a home invasion, but a handgun will be adequate for the job. Your stash of everything (meds, ammo, guns, food, water, etc.) are at hand when you need them.

I'm not planning any escape routes. I'll defend in place whether it is a weather issue or other crisis. YMMV

I think the technicality he's concerned with is its is less than 10k with a permit not 10k. 9,999.

Yes, and the reason that it is significant (legally speaking) is that ammo is bought in qtys ending in "0" not "9". Same for primers, etc.

However most here would never apply for any permit as they don't trust/fear their FD. My prior Fire Chief told me I was one of five people in my town with a powder/ammo permit. My current Chief tells me that I am the only one. And I know that there are a lot more than 5 people in this town who are serious shooters and most reload.

Now the irony is that most base their distrust/fear on dealing with nosy police chiefs/licensing officers/officers that stopped them for some reason. In case of an emergency, firefighters run into burning buildings or twisted metal cars to try to RESCUE people, whereas police rush in to arrest people!! Back in the early 1970s when I lived in CT there was a house fire in a 6-unit apartment building just behind our apartment building. We were out there watching the fire even before the fire department arrived (Groton City, so paid FT firefighters). As the apartment where it started was still ablaze, a Groton City PO came over to me and asked me if I knew where the two women were that lived in that apartment as he wanted to arrest them for "malicious mischief" (causing the fire?)! My honest answer to him was NO, but I was aghast that he'd be looking to make arrests before they even put out the flames. This was before Christmas, so likely Christmas ornaments/electrical stuff was the cause, certainly nothing intentional. CT has some very strange laws, but this story is told to tell you the difference between our dealings with fire departments and police departments.

I'd trust the FD 1000 times any day over the PD anywhere!!

 

[Lip]

What ammo? Why I just have one box of it.

 

[Broc]

Yeah Len you need to take a deep breath because your sticky matches what I posted.

10,000 rounds center fire without permit
50,000 rounds centerfire with permit.

I don't understand your consternation that this is "old info".

I didn't see this.

The ones that say a license is required, is my LTC enough?

Also, black powder...less than or equal to 5lbs I need a permit, more than 5lbs I don't need a permit but I need a license. Does my LTC count as a license, or is there a black powder license?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

lets cut to the chase here: the people who talk the most about "shift stashes" and the like are the least likely to pull the trigger in opposition to corruption. These "shift stash" discussions are an exercise in stupidity. Flame away as you see fit, but you know as well as I do.....

Particularly the ones that are concerned about the law that restricts the amount of ammo one person may keep.

 

[ColdDayInHell]

Particularly the ones that are concerned about the law that restricts the amount of ammo one person may keep.

10,001 centerfire rounds.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I didn't see this.

The ones that say a license is required, is my LTC enough?

Also, black powder...less than or equal to 5lbs I need a permit, more than 5lbs I don't need a permit but I need a license. Does my LTC count as a license, or is there a black powder license?

LTC doesn't count. Read my sticky referenced above. You have to go in front of your board of selectmen/aldermen/city council to get the "license" and the hearing is PUBLIC and almost always broadcast by local cable company with video archived on their website for the world to see. Total violation of the privacy of info law! (C. 66 S. 10(d))

 

[JayMcB]

LOL no AR yet. I will be leaving MA in the next 6 months, and I am waiting to buy a real AR when I get to a free state!

Don't wait to move. The AR is a modular platform, and you can change in whatever you want for it later. I'd rather have a MAssified AR and not need it, than need a MAssified AR and not have it. Even buy a M&P sport beater. Have SOMETHING. This is an easy example from the classifieds (not mine) of a decent AR to tide you back over. http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/threads/290864-PSA-AR15

LTC doesn't count. Read my sticky referenced above. You have to go in front of your board of selectmen/aldermen/city council to get the "license" and the hearing is PUBLIC and almost always broadcast by local cable company with video archived on their website for the world to see. Total violation of the privacy of info law! (C. 66 S. 10(d))

THIS. Get the permit, tell thr FD you mess around with some reloading, and stay under the permit limits.

 

[Len-2A Training]

THIS. Get the permit, tell thr FD you mess around with some reloading, and stay under the permit limits.

Most everyone here is used to begging for permission and having to explain WHY they want a permit (LTC).

The ammo/powder permit is totally different, you do not need to justify your request. Just tell them you want it and for the limits in the CMR and you should be good to go. I never ever had to explain how much of what I possessed. Other than wrt the primer limit (1K back then, now 999) is so ridiculously low (I reloaded shotgun and handgun-2 sizes of handgun primers) that for many years I never exceeded the ammo limits or powder limits for requiring a permit.

 

[FreeWillie]

This much

 

[jron]

If you're in MA, limit it to 10,000 rounds (not rimfire).

Because Massachusetts.

you can get a permit for more. limits shimits

 

[JayMcB]

20 bricks of 22 puts you over the permitless 10k. I guess we shoot too much, because absent resupply, my kids could go through that plinking in 2-3 months.

 

[swampy]

Say you have half a dozen calibers, which I don't think is unreasonable, would it be unreasonable to have 5k rounds for each?

Len I said those were limits. Are you really arguing over a single round?

Twist it the other way. If you don't have guns in all the overly popular calibers you should get one because if the SHTF you're gonna find someone dead with a stockpile of good ammo that you don't have a gun for and then you'll wish you did have that AK or Moisin or M1. That's how I justify never having enough guns...LOL