Fitchurg -- Police: City man had dozens of guns

[Rockrivr1]

I've have a couple of what I would consider "dummy" grenades in my house. The pins have been pulled dozens of time and there is nothing "explosive" about them. This has me wondering though if I should just get rid of them as they don't have any real value and it would seem they could be a detriment to me if somehow LE came to my house. Stupid I know, but why take the chance.

 

[drgrant]

The question then becomes, what standing did the family have to give permission to search? A motions hearing could or would decide this.
It could be that a family member filed for a Section 35 or Doctor filed a Section 12.

Jon-

This has been a curiosity item for me, too... I always wondered,
who has the "authority" to waive someone elses 4th amendment
rights?

EX: say the police get called to one's house for some reason, but
the owners are gone, and the door is open. There is a housekeeper
there.... and the housekeeper says "come in I don't care" does she
have the authority to waive the owners' 4th amendment rights?
Or would such a search be unlawful without probable cause or a warrant? (or
without waiting for the owners to come back to give consent).

What are the Section 12/35 things you're talking about- is that
some kind of an order (like a RO) to get the police to act on
someone based on a mental disability?

-Mike

 

[Arcticelf]

I seem to recall a case from a year or so ago, ruling that if one spouse allows the police in to search, but the other objects the search is invalid, both must consent to the search. US Supreme Court, as I recall.

AE

 

[icyclefar]

I've have a couple of what I would consider "dummy" grenades in my house. The pins have been pulled dozens of time and there is nothing "explosive" about them. This has me wondering though if I should just get rid of them as they don't have any real value and it would seem they could be a detriment to me if somehow LE came to my house. Stupid I know, but why take the chance.

Send them over ......... I'll put them in the boy's dresser drawer, along with the rest of his collection. Perhaps if I get enough of them they will qualify as a "Weapon of Mass Deception"

 

[tele_mark]

There's a comments section link at the bottom of the article. So far, there's only one lost anti posting -- something about how these guns pose a danger because they could be stolen by a drug dealer breaking into the house. Think I'll post something to the effect that all cars should be banned because they can be stolen and used in the commission of a crime....

Just try and follow this twisted logic:

It is kinda bizarre that ANYONE would think that owning .50 caliber ammunition, many guns and a Hand Grenade is supposed to be a legal thing.

For anyone who has been around the Armed Forces, such weaponry is known as Anti-Personnel Weapons. In short it is not for John Q. Hunter to trod through the woods to kill Bambi.

These things kill people. Also in a city like Fitchburg where guns are rampant, constantly in the wrong hands, and with all the shootings over the past 2 years in the city (Something that the folks in Massachusetts, and the German from Corning, New York wouldn't know about, nor would they know where Fitchburg is!) it is the last thing needed in Central Massachusetts.

All you need is one drug dealer to break into that apartment, and you have a drug dealer with a hand grenade, and ammunition that could peirce the armor of a person, vehicle etc.

.50 caliber ammunition brought many a Luftwaffe Pilot an early death (something that our HerrBGone from Corning, NY should know about..), and such could cause many problems.

Also, having lived in Maine almost as long as I have lived in Fitchburg, I have read newspaper reports of minors being killed with guns in their homes.

But what is more troubling that anyone would rationalize the need to have/own a Hand Grenade.

The Fitchburg Police should be credited for this, as such weapons need not be a part of the City of Fitchburg.

 

[JonJ]

Jon-

This has been a curiosity item for me, too... I always wondered,
who has the "authority" to waive someone elses 4th amendment
rights?

EX: say the police get called to one's house for some reason, but
the owners are gone, and the door is open. There is a housekeeper
there.... and the housekeeper says "come in I don't care" does she
have the authority to waive the owners' 4th amendment rights?
Or would such a search be unlawful without probable cause or a warrant? (or
without waiting for the owners to come back to give consent).

Absent some exigency, I'd say the housekeeper cannot grant consent.
The third party must have joint access and control such as cohabiting family members.
The article doesn't say but maybe whoever consented to the search lived with him.

What are the Section 12/35 things you're talking about- is that
some kind of an order (like a RO) to get the police to act on
someone based on a mental disability?-Mike

Neither are ROs in the sense as we discuss them here. The Section 12 is committal issued by a physician, qualified psychologist or qualified psychiatric nurse mental health clinical specialist. A police officer also has the power to apply in an emergency if the above mentioned specialists are not available.
Chapter 123: Section 12. Emergency restraint of dangerous persons; application for hospitalization; examination
The Section 35 also known as a Warrant of Apprehension is issued by a Judge. The person is "arrested" and brought directly to the Court. An evaluation is done and the Judge commits or releases the person. Family members are usually the persons who apply for the Section 35. Based on what they include in the application, the Judge issues or denies the order/warrant.
Chapter 123: Section 35. Commitment of alcoholics or substance abusers

 

[Kar98 Sniper]

I've have a couple of what I would consider "dummy" grenades in my house. The pins have been pulled dozens of time and there is nothing "explosive" about them. This has me wondering though if I should just get rid of them as they don't have any real value and it would seem they could be a detriment to me if somehow LE came to my house. Stupid I know, but why take the chance.

I was thinking the same exact thing.

 

[Tiktock]

Man, if they ever saw my basement the headline would read "criminal was manufacturing edged weapons and components for nearly 1000 blades were discovered in to form of bars of steel and blocks of wood. The wood was burned but steel could not be reduced to scrap any further, so it was buried to prevent others from taking it and forging swords over their barbeque pit."

 

[Pilgrim]

Originally Posted by Rockrivr1 View Post
I've have a couple of what I would consider "dummy" grenades in my house. The pins have been pulled dozens of time and there is nothing "explosive" about them. This has me wondering though if I should just get rid of them as they don't have any real value and it would seem they could be a detriment to me if somehow LE came to my house. Stupid I know, but why take the chance.

I was thinking the same exact thing.

Oh come on guys, they are perfectly legal to own and can be bought in many places both in and out of state.

 

[MrChan072]

This is retarded. Something tells me the story was twisted around to screw this guy. If so then it's nice to see it doesn't take much to have everything tipped upside down when you lawfully own firearms.

 

[Lugnut]

There's a comments section link at the bottom of the article. So far, there's only one lost anti posting -- something about how these guns pose a danger because they could be stolen by a drug dealer breaking into the house. Think I'll post something to the effect that all cars should be banned because they can be stolen and used in the commission of a crime....

Just try and follow this twisted logic:

Yeah... it's OUR fault if someone steals our stuff... WTF is wrong with peoples' logic?

Oh... and about the "these things kill people"... well they sure as shit can... just like a .22 or anyother device... like a car or steak knife.

I'm not saying this guy didn't have something coming.. NONE of us know ALL the facts yet... but these comments enrage me!

 

[Kar98 Sniper]

 

[Mattitude]

I've have a couple of what I would consider "dummy" grenades in my house. The pins have been pulled dozens of time and there is nothing "explosive" about them. This has me wondering though if I should just get rid of them as they don't have any real value and it would seem they could be a detriment to me if somehow LE came to my house. Stupid I know, but why take the chance.

If they are not already, paint them NATO blue. That is the US standard color for an inert item. Any LE or anyone with military experience will recoginze it.

 

[jamz]

so....what did he do wrong?

Nothing at all, in a free country.

 

[JAMMIN]

He also was in possesion of a stapler, but thank god it wasn't loaded. Also, his son's Tickle Me Elmo made a member of the Swat team shit his pants when it was touched and it actually tickled, Officer Igetverynervous is recovering fine and will be back to work after 3 weeks paid vacation.

 

[Snapshot]

Oh come on guys, they are perfectly legal to own and can be bought in many places both in and out of state.

I don't think that's the point. The point is that all it took was this cops opinion that it could still be dangerous to justify taking and destroying some of his stuff.

In this state it's not about what is legal, it's about what they can get away with doing to you.


We should ALL be writing our reps to make sure this is handled properly.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I wonder how they would deal with one of those stores that has the grenade mounted to an oak plaque with a numbered tag attached to the pin with a sight "Complaint department - take a number".

 

[Lugnut]

Sooo.... does anyone have more details on why they did this search yet?

 

[USMC109]

This is absurd!!! Obviously I don't know ALL the details and no offense to anyone but i am glad I don't live in Mass. and never will! CT. is bad enough!They really torture you guys with gun laws...isn't there something that can be done???Besides moving?

 

[tele_mark]

<SNIP>
isn't there something that can be done???Besides moving?

 

[USMC109]

I'm in!!!

 

[In_God_We_Trust]

I guess this novelty would go over BIG with LE in this State

 

[TomH]

I think he needs a very good lawyer so he can start suing everyone involved in this. Unless theres something we don't know about (very possible imo)

The stuff about the .50 cal ammo is just sickening, since it's not illegal in any sense.

 

[dwarven1]

Isn't there something that can be done???Besides moving?

Rope. Tree. Politician.

Some assembly required.

 

[TheIglu]

So.....my grandfather who lives in Fitchburg who collects firearms and lots of WW2 memorabilia will be screwed if someone calls in saying he's in a bad mood one day?

They would probably label my house a "compound" with a "fortified basement" and "stockpile of survival supplies" if they ever search it. That and the 3k rounds will probably piss them off too.

I am ashamed to call the 'burg my birthplace. Let them make it a "gun free" city like that anti posted. I'll warn them twice to get off my property when they come running out to the sticks seeking shelter WTSHTF.

 

[drgrant]

JonJ, thanks for the info.

I've been asking around locally and I haven't gotten a clarification
from anyone on what transpired, (that led up to the "incident") so
it's anyones guess at this point.

I'm getting a feeling that this isn't all that it's cracked up to be,
though. Maybe a spouse or someone else that lives there is
undergoing a spat with him or something... who knows.

More and more this feels like "welcome to MA, please bend over and
check your rights at the door at the same time. "

-Mike