FFL Refuses Transfer Because Address on LTC not matching DL address

[Mountain_Dad]

Thanks guys. I will out him as soon as my pistol is out of his possession.

And for those that are curious... it's a P365 (MA compliant, unfortunately).

 

[Marty McFly]

Well even if it’s not the same shop, the fact that you already have an idea of a different shop that’s bad enough to be a potential culprit for this should be enough to warrant outing them as well IMHO. Neither of these two shops should be frequented

True. I don't frequent the one I was thinking of (not many people do). I've mentioned that one before. I'll wait to see how this guy makes out. I'm not looking to out a shop and be right and cause an issue for this guy somehow.

I will say
Behind enemy lines
Ods guns
Fts guns
Bachant armament
Are all in my area and fantastic shops with really good owner ffls
I've also had dealings with probably a dozen others or more from around the state. There are plenty of great shops.

 

[Grendizer138]

Thanks guys. I will out him as soon as my pistol is out of his possession.

And for those that are curious... it's a P365 (MA compliant, unfortunately).

My man, make the trip to the Mill, and get a real 365 without made-up laws.

 

[kalash]

My LTC and DL have my old address on them. The DL has my new address hand written on the back, which is how the state wants it done. No such provision for LTC though. I haven't had any issues buying or transferring guns but I also got to knowledgeable FFLs. Your FFL sounds like a total douche.

 

[Realtor MA]

I wonder if a call to batfe would at least get him to realize he's wrong?
And if someone can explain to me why there would be a federal law on the books regulating the use of a state issued license that would be cool. Lol

 

[Len-2A Training]

I think we should start sending the FFL copies of the actual law and requirements, over and over again.

Who is going to read it to the moron . . . nice and very slowly so that he might comprehend a few of the smaller words??

I wonder if a call to batfe would at least get him to realize he's wrong?
And if someone can explain to me why there would be a federal law on the books regulating the use of a state issued license that would be cool. Lol

This is what I would have done. With the right contact at BATFE, which I have, he either might have educated the moron or made him squirm a lot! Nobody likes the Feds crawling up their butt! However, that can be useful in some limited circumstances.

 

[dgrafton]

Hi All,

Seeking some insight and advice. I have a MA LTC-A. Last year I moved to a new house within the same town and I submitted the change of address forms as required. I have verified since that my new address is correct for my LTC on the MERCS portal. Everything is up to par on my end, except the address listed on my LTC card is my old address and now is different from my Driver's License address. This is normal and I know that the LTC card address won't be updated until I renew my LTC later next year.

Last week I purchased a new pistol on GunBroker and had it mailed to a local FFL near me. I went to do the transfer at his store and he outright refused to do it stating that per Federal Law the address on my LTC needs to match the address on my DL. He further stated that it doesn't matter that the address associated with my LTC (which you can verify via MERCS) matches my DL address. I then tried to explain to him that I believe he is wrong and that the Federal form 4473 only requires my DL and that there is no requirement that the address on my LTC card match anything. He still refused, but told me that he is willing to do the transfer if I show him the certified mail receipt from when I did the change of address last year. Unfortunately I don't have that receipt anymore (probably lost in the move). So, his advice was to resubmit the change of address form (a year later), get a new certified mail receipt and show him that one.

So, what do I do? I have since spoken to other FFLs in my area and they have told me that his refusal and his advice to resend a change of address is completely WRONG. I have been told that only my DL is required for the Federal form 4473 and my LTC is verified online through MERCS and there is absolutely no requirement to show any certified mail receipt.

I have since researched the laws and find no requirement to hold onto the certified mail receipt in order to do a FFL transfer.

He also refuses to ship the pistol to another FFL in my area. He will only ship it back to where it came from. So, my plan right now is just to have him ship it back and then have the original dealer ship it to the other FFL.

One last thing, in case it helps for context. The FFL that refuses to do the transfer and seems to be making up his own rules is a small, mom & pop hardware store. The FFL that has given me advice is a much larger shop with a gun store and range that deals with transfers often.

Curious what you all think.

I’d call the atf and report that he’s refusing to release your property to another ffl.

 

[dgrafton]

Ah, just finished reading the post and others beat me to it.

 

[drgrant]

Thanks guys. I will out him as soon as my pistol is out of his possession.

And for those that are curious... it's a P365 (MA compliant, unfortunately).

So you went thru all that to get a garbage sku you could have picked up at cgw or some other retail schlub place? Lol

 

[Jenska22]

Waiting patiently for this update

what he said

 

[drgrant]

I’d call the atf and report that he’s refusing to release your property to another ffl.

That's not a great idea honestly the path of least resistance is to have him send the gun back and then get it out to somebody friendly and then put the guy on blast. Putting a dealer on blast while they have your property is not exactly a great path to take.

 

[drgrant]

I wonder if a call to batfe would at least get him to realize he's wrong?
And if someone can explain to me why there would be a federal law on the books regulating the use of a state issued license that would be cool. Lol

In my opinion it could make things worse rather than just choosing the path of least resistance so he can unf*** his existence here otherwise this guy might be full on nut bag anybody who goes to that length making up fake shit iobviously short a few screws.

 

[dgrafton]

In my opinion it could make things worse rather than just choosing the path of least resistance so he can unf*** his existence here otherwise this guy might be full on nut bag anybody who goes to that length making up fake shit iobviously short a few screws.

Yeah, but if this guy is that f-ed, better to have the atf fight your battle

 

[Marty McFly]

So you weren't thru all that to get a garbage sku you could have picked up at cgw or some other retail schlub place? Lol

It was $15 off at buds maybe?

 

[Picton]

Yeah, but if this guy is that f-ed, better to have the atf fight your battle

He's not all that f-ed.

He's got a path to get his gat out of the hands of this weirdo. He should do that in the most expedient way possible, unless it's a huge expense or something.

 

[Grendizer138]

So you weren't thru all that to get a garbage sku you could have picked up at cgw or some other retail schlub place? Lol

Good point. Bookmarked for next time someone says they ordered online because it was some nominal amount cheaper

 

[drgrant]

Yeah, but if this guy is that f-ed, better to have the atf fight your battle

That's called "how to have your gun stuck somewhere" vs losing shipping $ and getting off cheap.

 

[drgrant]

Good point. Bookmarked for next time someone says they ordered online because it was some nominal amount cheaper

Admittedly some of the shops down that way are pretty rapey, so there's that.

 

[appraiser]

Yeah, but if this guy is that f-ed, better to have the atf fight your battle

never bring the ATF into your life

 

[Marty McFly]

Admittedly some of the shops down that way are pretty rapey, so there's that.

Not if you have a good relationship with them. Some of these guys know some of the mill guys and it's a relationship that is worth fostering.
There are 2 rapey ones though and holier than thou

 

[knucklehead]

This FFL sounds like a complete f*** tard.

 

[cstockwell]

If you PM me shop details I will call them and see if I can go pick it up for you. You may have to travel off cape a little bit to come pick it up (not far) but there will be no charge or transfer fee etc.

 

[Marty McFly]

If you PM me shop details I will call them and see if I can go pick it up for you. You may have to travel off cape a little bit to come pick it up (not far) but there will be no charge or transfer fee etc.

This is why you made my list of great ffls

 

[Seedreaper]

I'm not one to go running to the police, but maybe explaining the Local Leo's, in particular the one who handles LTC'S. They might be able to help politely inform him of the regulations, and coming from an authority on the matter the ffl might be willing to listen.
Just my 2 cents, sucks you ran into problems.

 

[johngalt2]

Maybe you can suggest nicely that you two get a consult on his interpretation of the law - you know, before you got to the trouble and expense of reversing the sale. @CrackPot, seems like, might be willing to take a call and discuss it.

Most boomers will just shake their heads stubbornly, with their wet nose hair bristling angrily. But it is worth a try to see if he can be reasoned with.

 

[johngalt2]

Good point. Bookmarked for next time someone says they ordered online because it was some nominal amount cheaper

Oh, come on. This didn't happen because it was an online sale. It happened because the OP picked an idiot FFL.
Had he picked a decent FFL, the purchase would have just been fine (like a million others).

 

[Fixxah]

You're dealing with a dickhead, not laws. You met your end of the deal, notifying the po and Boston that you moved. You're in compliance with the law.

Tell him if he won't transfer it to a real FFL, you'll tell on him. That's won't accomplish anything, but it'll tick him off REAL good, being talked down to like a churlish kid. Trust me.

I assume you also changed the address on your auto reg? Do they still have the stupid labels you're supposed to write the new address on or were they supposed to send you a new DL?

Like telling a tranny "Calm down sir" when they demand proper pronouns?

 

[Picton]

I'm not one to go running to the police, but maybe explaining the Local Leo's, in particular the one who handles LTC'S. They might be able to help politely inform him of the regulations, and coming from an authority on the matter the ffl might be willing to listen.
Just my 2 cents, sucks you ran into problems.

Keep the cops far away from anything to do with this. Talk about the blind leading the blind...

 

[Grendizer138]

Oh, come on. This didn't happen because it was an online sale. It happened because the OP picked an idiot FFL.
Had he picked a decent FFL, the purchase would have just been fine (like a million others).

Had he picked a decent FFL they would have had a free-state P365 available for sale.

When you buy online there’s some level of added risk that is almost never worth incurring for readily available firearms.

 

[Grendizer138]

Keep the cops far away from anything to do with this. Talk about the blind leading the blind...

Plus ratting out a bad FFL is still being a rat.