• If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

Comm2A, SAF, GOAL and FPC file against Baker admin on shop closures

The above post leads into my question about the legal/appeals process on this. Maybe some of you legal eagles know the answer.

If, hypothetically, Woodlock rules in favor of 2a on Thursday, what is Maura’s next move and how long could we realistically expect to be able to have FFLs in operation before there’s another closure/appeal?

This isn't Woodlock's first rodeo, and I suspect his rulings, like Benitez's magazine ruling in California, may be well calibrated to maximize impact and minimize the likelihood of being overturned on appeal.

He may end up issuing a TRO/preliminary injunction Thursday or Friday, after taking the proposed form of order under advisement. When he issues the injunction, it may be effective immediately, in which case gun stores could open up right away, assuming preparations have been made.

Maura's road from there is to request a stay from Woodlock. He does not have to rule on the request immediately, and like Benitez with his magazine ruling in CA, he may strategically sit on it for a few days or a week. Then, gun stores being open becomes the new status quo.

Once he rules on the stay, Maura can request interlocutory relief from the First Circus. That's a crapshoot, so I won't try to play Nostradamus on that one.

That's a great response and I hope the opposition isn't reading our site to get such good legal opinion!

However, she still could not use that answer to explain the off-on-off nature of stores on the essential list yes?

A reasonable response there would be that the governor is managing through a global pandemic, and the and his staff are doing their best to navigate through a rapidly changing situation to save as many lives as possible. Changes and updates to policies are going to, and should, happen frequently as they quickly navigate through murky waters and receive new federal guidance that has to be quickly customized to the unique needs of Massachusetts. Mistakes and oversights happen, and when they do they are corrected as quickly as possible, and that's what happened in this case.

(Again, I don't agree with the above, but that's what a good lawyer would say.)
 
Well, at least it looks like Baker will likely be opening up golf courses, because they're certainly more essential than anything gun related. :rolleyes:
That's a relief. We'll know for sure very soon.



Frank
 
Well now I see that the governor is reopening florists for mother's day, we should be all set. If getting flowers for a holiday invented by a gift card company is important enough to justify opening, I have to believe the pesky second amendment would be also.

Men like flowers too.

Bob

7558484-B-1-D17-4-AC7-9-D47-5-ACCE8421519.png
 
this was in the first round of relief provided by the MGCC. They've since removed it from their page as the money dried up. Mass Growth Capital Corp. - Empowering Small Business
a Google search found the application in PDF.. https://www.empoweringsmallbusiness.org/sites/default/files/docs/2020-03/Application - MGCC Small Business Relief Loan .pdf


Ineligible businesses include, but not limited to, companies involved in real estate investment, multi-level marketing, adult entertainment, or firearms.

Companies with past due tax liabilities or tax liens or currently in bankruptcy (Corporate or Personal) are not eligible.
 
Not only that, despite MA and some other states closing LGS, the FBI stated that background checks nationwide and firearm sales soared 70% above sales from April 2019.

 
Not only that, despite MA and some other states closing LGS, the FBI stated that background checks nationwide and firearm sales soared 70% above sales from April 2019.

Damn. :mad: And we are being left out. :mad:

Fortunately, I see a very substantial shopping trip in my future... just as soon as Dimples the Tyrant and Faker Baker... or a Federal judge... allows us our Constitutional rights back. :mad:
 
Ineligible businesses include, but not limited to, companies involved in real estate investment, multi-level marketing, adult entertainment, or firearms.

Companies with past due tax liabilities or tax liens or currently in bankruptcy (Corporate or Personal) are not eligible.
Hmmm, pick the one business that does not fit into the ones mentioned above.
 
Since firearm sales are thru the roof during the pandemic and MA. shops have been prevented from capitalizing on the sales increases I would think that would be a huge court case for revenue lost.

it should be pretty easy case too. Every gun store has stats how much they make. Every day that they are closed they are loosing money. Unlike other examples, there is a substantial and definitive monetary value lost. The big problem is that "public servants" are rather hard to get responsible for anything.
 
Maura's ("Contested") Proposed Form of Order: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.mad.220544/gov.uscourts.mad.220544.77.0.pdf

The highlights are:
  1. It starts with lots of whining
  2. Gun stores can open by appointment only, no more than four transactions per hour, no extended hours beyond what they were open for before.
  3. Ranges can open at 40% capacity, no extended hours
  4. Ten prescriptive social distancing requirements
  5. Two days' notice before it takes effect.
I'm not sure if PACER accepts video clips, but if they do, I would suggest this as Comm2a's response:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnmIoF_2Q4Y
 
So the defendants posted a proposed order.

Maura's ("Contested") Proposed Form of Order: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.mad.220544/gov.uscourts.mad.220544.77.0.pdf

The highlights are:
  1. It starts with lots of whining
  2. Gun stores can open by appointment only, no more than four transactions per hour, no extended hours beyond what they were open for before.
  3. Ranges can open at 40% capacity, no extended hours
  4. Ten prescriptive social distancing requirements
  5. Two days' notice before it takes effect.
I'm not sure if PACER accepts video clips, but if they do, I would suggest this as Comm2a's response:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnmIoF_2Q4Y


Don't forget the contemporaneous explanation about the 3/23 decision to call gun stores non essential. Affidavit – #78 in MCCARTHY v. BAKER (D. Mass., 1:20-cv-10701) – CourtListener.com

"Here are video clips from 3/27 and 4/1 of the governor stating firearms stores are non essential after the flip flopping took place, clearly this shows consistency after the flip, hence justifying the flop" (My own paraphrased quote)
 
No more than 40% of the members at one time.

LOL.

For private ranges open to the public, no more than 40% of the population in an 8 mile radius.
Easy for some ranges - 40% capacity of a 50 position range is 20 positions in use.

The urinal allocation algorithm works nicely for this:

 
Easy for some ranges - 40% capacity of a 50 position range is 20 positions in use.

The urinal allocation algorithm works nicely for this:

Based on Maura's proposed order, you could probably fill all of the positions on the range, along with a few guests with each member: "40 percent of the maximum permitted occupancy level, as documented in their occupancy permits on record with the municipal records holder"

God, our state is run by idiots.
 
The state’s proposed order is like fixing their mistake by making another one.

I predict the business hours stuff is going to raise some judicial attention. Unless it is consistent in the affidavits posted regarding other essential services (that all other business have the business hours restriction) it would seem that imposing 4 sales per hour and then imposing no modified business hours would be problematic.
 
Maura's ("Contested") Proposed Form of Order: https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.mad.220544/gov.uscourts.mad.220544.77.0.pdf

The highlights are:
  1. It starts with lots of whining
  2. Gun stores can open by appointment only, no more than four transactions per hour, no extended hours beyond what they were open for before.
  3. Ranges can open at 40% capacity, no extended hours
  4. Ten prescriptive social distancing requirements
  5. Two days' notice before it takes effect.
I'm not sure if PACER accepts video clips, but if they do, I would suggest this as Comm2a's response:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnmIoF_2Q4Y


I have a counter proposal , but a dick pic will most likely get me a ban.
 
(Again, I don't agree with the above, but that's what a good lawyer would say.)

Are you a lawyer? Your updates and insight have kept me well informed on a case very few normal citizens are aware of. I keep reading and hitting the like button because I feel like I’m out of my league and have very little to offer in the way of commentary. I’ve only got 1 business law class under my belt and this certainly wasn’t in it!
I appreciate the candor.
 
Back
Top Bottom