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CA microstamping law takes effect immediately
- Thread starter mav
- Start date
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the more I think about this the stupider it gets. how will the stamping effect reloaders? If they collect brass from a range, will the casing have multiple stamps from multiple firings?
Damn you california.... you're a beautiful state with insane laws.
Damn you california.... you're a beautiful state with insane laws.
Firing pins strike primers, not the casings.
Lets not suggest anyone change a firing pin ... Is everyone on these task forces completely retarded?
Sorry if I offended anyone as I usually don't use "retarded" in a derratory context. I am struggling to find a more appropirate word that accurately depicts what is going on here!!!!!
Sorry if I offended anyone as I usually don't use "retarded" in a derratory context. I am struggling to find a more appropirate word that accurately depicts what is going on here!!!!!
The law does not mention firing pins, explicitly. Just some marking on the ejected casing. Yes, firing pins would make the most sense, it all depends on how the manufacturers plan on implementing this law (if at all)
Better would be to put a new stamp on the pin, like "FU"
What penalties for removal of the marking mechanism after sale?
mav
NES Member
Interesting, I picked this up from the calguns post:
a semiautomatic pistol must be equipped with microstamping technology-i.e., a microscopic array of characters that identify the make, model, and serial number of the pistol, etched or otherwise imprinted in two or more places on the interior surface or internal working parts of the pistol, and that are transferred by imprinting on each cartridge case when the firearm is fired.
To me, this sounds like the stamping would not be on the primer, but on the cartridge case itself in at least two locations... that doesn't sound like a firing pin imprint.
I imagine brass catchers will become the new hotness if this takes off.
a semiautomatic pistol must be equipped with microstamping technology-i.e., a microscopic array of characters that identify the make, model, and serial number of the pistol, etched or otherwise imprinted in two or more places on the interior surface or internal working parts of the pistol, and that are transferred by imprinting on each cartridge case when the firearm is fired.
To me, this sounds like the stamping would not be on the primer, but on the cartridge case itself in at least two locations... that doesn't sound like a firing pin imprint.
I imagine brass catchers will become the new hotness if this takes off.
Here is an easy way to bypass this: buy a new complete slide for the gun. It is completely unregulated as the ATF considers the lower frame to be the "gun."
So even if microstamping were done all a criminal has to do is use a different slide for the crime being committed and replace that slide while he is not actively committing crimes. If they find him, and he has the other slide that has not been used in a crime on the gun, they can't tie him to the crime and he goes free. Actually, I think this makes it easier for a criminal to get away with a crime. If he is a PP, the most they could get him on is being a PP in possession of a firearm which as we all know means he will walk.
So even if microstamping were done all a criminal has to do is use a different slide for the crime being committed and replace that slide while he is not actively committing crimes. If they find him, and he has the other slide that has not been used in a crime on the gun, they can't tie him to the crime and he goes free. Actually, I think this makes it easier for a criminal to get away with a crime. If he is a PP, the most they could get him on is being a PP in possession of a firearm which as we all know means he will walk.
mav
NES Member
Not much different than swapping barrels in handguns so LEO can't get a ballistics match to a crime scene.
So , for this to work , a gangbanger/criminal/maniac/etc goes into a gun shop and legally buys a new firearm, or get it through a straw purchase from a legal buyer at the FFL.
Then if he commits an illegal shooting the police can look up the number on the brass , drive to his house and question him about his whereabouts on the day of the crime.
Sounds great.
Except if he steals the gun , or puts a new pin in it , or files it , or uses a revolver , or polices his brass , or shoots from inside a car . or intends to do the typical mass murder suicide by cop routine , or doesn't buy a new gun but gets an older one , or gets a gun from out of state , or doesn't care if his name is attached to the brass for any one of a million reasons. or simply has a good alibi and says " I'm not arguing about the number connected to my name. It doesn't prove I was there. "
Otherwise , I just think it may be a hugely expensive waste of resources. Has the stupid "fired brass casing with every new gun " thing we run here in Ma. ever solved a single crime ever ?
Then if he commits an illegal shooting the police can look up the number on the brass , drive to his house and question him about his whereabouts on the day of the crime.
Sounds great.
Except if he steals the gun , or puts a new pin in it , or files it , or uses a revolver , or polices his brass , or shoots from inside a car . or intends to do the typical mass murder suicide by cop routine , or doesn't buy a new gun but gets an older one , or gets a gun from out of state , or doesn't care if his name is attached to the brass for any one of a million reasons. or simply has a good alibi and says " I'm not arguing about the number connected to my name. It doesn't prove I was there. "
Otherwise , I just think it may be a hugely expensive waste of resources. Has the stupid "fired brass casing with every new gun " thing we run here in Ma. ever solved a single crime ever ?
chris_1001
NES Member
Not that someone couldn't get around it if they really wanted too by simply replacing the firing pin or taking some emery paper to the slide, ore replacing the barrel. All of which are probably easily ordered online.
yanici
NES Member
So.... let's amend the law to add that anyone that has a gun has to have matching numbers on frame, barrel, firing pin, and slide or go to jail for 50 years. If gun is repaired with nonmatching parts you must maintain paperwork that documents the change by a licensed dealer. Licensed dealer must destroy old, defective parts. Paperwork must accompany gun if sold.
Yeah, people in CA need to be warned to either not buy new guns or pick up 100% of their brass... The potential for abuse of this is enormous. It essentially allows bad guys to go shop for a drop-gun at ranges once there are a decent number of stamping guns out there. Just dig through the brass buckets to find a serialized case(s), then reload...
Ridiculous... This law, more directly than many, puts the public at risk via this mechanism of identity theft.
Ridiculous... This law, more directly than many, puts the public at risk via this mechanism of identity theft.
So get a revolver that can shoot a common SA round like a 45ACP, then find some leftover brass at the range that has a micro stamp in the same caliber,
go and commit a crime and leave the collected casings behind. Now wait for the fun to begin.
I see nothing but good things for california
go and commit a crime and leave the collected casings behind. Now wait for the fun to begin.
I see nothing but good things for california
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I don't see how brass could be micro-stamped unless there is some kind of new technology. This leaves the primer. But that can't be it either. What about Glock firing pin "smears"? What does make sense is that they are "shooting" for de-facto gun control through attrition. I myself have seen guns that were older than ten years, so even that smug liberal wet-dream won't work either. Maybe it'll be like gun locks. Whenj you buy a firearm, you are, at state's cost, required to buy a striking implement and a punch. After firing each shot, you'd be required to imprint the case. Percentage wise, I can now give Mr. Miculek a run for his money
All technical analysis of this tech has shown it to be broken.
They smear, they wear very quickly and they WILL lead to mis-identification because of this.
That's even before you get to intentional manipulation of their content via a trivial sanding of the pin, taking spent/stamped cases from range and reloading, replacing the firing pin, etc...
Are any manufacturers going to make guns to comply? If the ones that do make micro stamped guns get boycotted by the shooters from the other 49 states then there's going to be a WTF moment from manufacturers. California sales vs the rest of the country sales? If the manufacturers refuse to comply and refuse to honor warranties on guns modified by others to prevent someone from tinkering with their product to add the technology then maybe it could be stopped. What is also needed is the same technology required on retail guns be required on cop guns. Make the states pay extra and comply with their own "safety" requirements.
If you pick up and plant brass at a shooting make sure you don't leave fingerprints.
If you pick up and plant brass at a shooting make sure you don't leave fingerprints.
ToddDubya
NES Member
So will firing pins have to be shipped to FFLs now? Is there a $30 transfer fee for a firing pin?
I wonder how they'll work the penalty for a firing pin that doesn't leave a legible imprint. It'll probably be an annual inspection for a reasonable $29 per firearm.
I wonder how they'll work the penalty for a firing pin that doesn't leave a legible imprint. It'll probably be an annual inspection for a reasonable $29 per firearm.
ToddDubya
NES Member
Can't they just install more cameras and fly more drones? Traditional police work is so 20th century.
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Sorry to hear about your penis, bro. An image of mine wouldn't fit on a primer. Not even a magnum.
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Sorry to hear about your penis, bro. An image of mine wouldn't fit on a primer. Not even a magnum.
The law says the stamp has to be in two places and has to be imprinted on "each cartridge case". How in the world is a stamp going to get on the case? Technically, the primer isn't the case, so even a firing pin stamp doesn't satisfy the law. Even if it did, that's only one stamp, there has to be another one. Etching in the chamber? I'm sure that won't get smeared at all...
Microstamping just do not work. The technology is not there and most likely will never be.
I have ideas for how it could work, but I'd rather not give any ideas. This shit won't prevent crimes. A stolen gun will just be linked to the lawful owner, not the criminal dirtbag who stole it.
I have ideas for how it could work, but I'd rather not give any ideas. This shit won't prevent crimes. A stolen gun will just be linked to the lawful owner, not the criminal dirtbag who stole it.
