All This 1911 Talk...

[BearArms]

Has really made me want one. Is there anything I should know before I make my choice? I seem to like them all. I also heard once that Para is not considerd to be a real 1911. Is that true?
PS. Trying to keep it under $900

Thanks...

 

[chris_1001]

Welcome to the cult of the 1911... I currently have two.

I bought a Para 1911LTC, it SUCKED!!!! I did get the store to take it back. The think would not feed or eject... I then bought a SW 1911PD and love it!

So, stay away from Para and look at the Smiths for a few more $$

As for a REAL 1911, the smiths have an external extractor, so they are not 100% a true 1911.

I might be selling my 1911PD as I need some cash for some other stuff... PM me if you are interested it has less than 200 rounds through it.

 

[M1911]

Skip Paras. Dodgy quality control.

 

[Kid Presentable]

use to have a s&w 1911Sc, thing was flawless...only ended up selling it to fund another project, definitely kicking myself for that one

 

[atilla]

only buy a para if you need a very expensive paperweight and a reason to hate yourself.

there's nothing wrong with a smith 1911, either. if you want to shoot they are great guns and you can always worry about purism and a "true" 1911 later on down the road.

 

[Lone Wolf McQuade]

I have a S & W no issues at all. I shoot it more than my Ruger P345.

Paid $829 for a new one in the Spring of 2008, plus sales tax. They have gone up since then
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...d=10001&productId=14719&langId=-1&isFirearm=Y

 

[dagwag77]

Heard good things about SA 1911s, and I've shot a Rock Island 1911 and enjoyed it. I think those are the 2 cheaper but solid 1911s out there... although there are some good deals to be found with the SW1911s which are fantastic.

 

[Ma$$hole]

I played with a S&W 1911. It was $800 brand new. Grey finish black grips. Single stack. .45 ACP. I contracted a chubby holding that thing. It'd be a nice little piece to carry in a shoulder rig. Personally I'd love to find a new 1911 in 9mm or with a 9mm conversion kit. I'm a bit aways from that right now. Hunting season is coming up and it's time for a new semi auto shottie.

 

[one-eyed Jack]

I would go for a Colt, but that's just me after shooting one for 30 years. Jack.

 

[pdm]

I'll go against the grain and say that my Para 1911 LTC hasn't failed me yet. That doesn't mean they're all awesome, but some people have had crap luck with S&W too.

 

[45collector]

Find a nice series 70 Colt and you'll be in love instantly.

I've had 2 Paras and hated them both. S&W's are nice. I'm still waiting to find a nice stainless Springfield Armory milspec for the right price in this state. Will probably be waiting a while, but worth it.

 

[BearArms]

How about the SA and Kimbers? I had a SA XD45 and loved it.

 

[BearArms]

Find a nice series 70 Colt and you'll be in love instantly.

I've had 2 Paras and hated them both. S&W's are nice. I'm still waiting to find a nice stainless Springfield Armory milspec for the right price in this state. Will probably be waiting a while, but worth it.

Why do the Para's suck? Is it the way they shoot or how they feel?

 

[M1911]

How about the SA and Kimbers?

You can't get either new in MA, but I see you are in RI.

I have three Series I Kimbers that I've had good luck with. I'm not a fan of the new Kimber IIs, however. I don't trust their Swartz-style firing pin safety, nor their external extractor. Kimber has gone through at least three different designs for the extractor trying to get it to work.

Check Springfields carefully to make sure that you don't get one of the low-end models with a two-piece barrel. I have one and it wouldn't group worth a damn until I had the barrel replaced. You can easily see the joint in the front of the barrel hood on two-piece barrels. I'm not sure if Springfield still uses two-piece barrels in their low-end guns, but they used to.

 

[M1911]

Why do the Para's suck? Is it the way they shoot or how they feel?

I have an early P14-45. This is a full-size, double-stack gun. I bought it new. I've had a lot of failures to feed, typically towards the end of a magazine. Yes, all the magazines are factory mags, came new with the gun or direct from Para. Yes, I've replaced followers and springs.

After a few thousand rounds, the hammer started following the slide down. I had to have a gunsmith replace the hammer and sear as a result.

The slide stop notch is getting peened. It will either have to be repaired or I'll have to replace the slide.

I'm not the only one to have experienced crappy quality from ParaOrdnance. Do a search here.

 

[EC1]

When looking at 1911's, how would people rate the following brands (1-6)?

Colt
Kimber
Springfield Armory
Rock Island Arsenal
Smith & Wesson
Remington Rand

 

[45collector]

When looking at 1911's, how would people rate the following brands (1-6)?

Colt
Kimber
Springfield Armory
Rock Island Arsenal
Smith & Wesson
Remington Rand

If you're including Remington Rand into your poll, you need to also include:

Ithaca

Union Switch & Signal

Singer


Colt will always be at the top of the list for me. (only pre- 80's series though)

 

[EC1]

When looking at 1911's, how would people rate the following brands (1-6)?

Colt
Kimber
Springfield Armory
Rock Island Arsenal
Smith & Wesson
Remington Rand

If you're including Remington Rand into your poll, you need to also include:

Ithaca

Union Switch & Signal

Singer


Colt will always be at the top of the list for me. (only pre- 80's series though)

I only included the ones that I've seen in the past few months and that I had the opportunity to buy, and though Colt would be my first choice the fact it was a series 80 and its condition/price turned me off.

 

[M1911]

When looking at 1911's, how would people rate the following brands (1-6)?

Colt
Kimber
Springfield Armory
Rock Island Arsenal
Smith & Wesson
Remington Rand

Remington Rand would be a surplus WWII gun. It's quality would be in the same boat as all WWII surplus 1911s from all manufacturers -- dependent entirely upon the gun's current condition. Issue sights were hopeless (much too small). Grip safety allows hammer bite. Thumb safety is too small. But I'd hate to butcher a gun with such history to make it shootable. Lots of history, but it wouldn't be useful for me other than as a museum piece.

RIA is a cheap Philippine manufacturer. I wouldn't touch one with your 10' pole, let alone mine.

Kimber Series I? Good. Series II? No thanks. Too many quality problems. The Swartz-style firing pin safety isn't reliable enough. Kimber has gone through 3 different designs of their external extractor trying to make it reliable.

ParaOrdnance. Bad.

S&W? Fair. I'm not a fan of their firing pin safety or external extractor, but they seem to have fewer issues than Kimber IIs.

Springfield? Good frame. If it has a two-piece barrel, poor until you give up and spend a few hundred dollars replacing the barrel. If it has a one-piece barrel, good. Watch out for crappy barrel lockup as well.

Colt? Good frame. But I'll need to drop several hundred dollars at the gunsmith to replace the grip safety, thumb safety, and sights before it is usable. Been there, done that, wound up with a good gun. Very accurate barrel, too, on my example.

My opinions are based with my experience of a number of 1911s, including:

- 3 Kimber Series I
- Gunsite GSP-2000 (a lightly-modified Springfield Armory with a two-piece barrel)
- ParaOrdnance P14-45
- Colt Delta Elite
- Wilson Combat Service Grade

YMMV.

 

[M1911]

I only included the ones that I've seen in the past few months and that I had the opportunity to buy, and though Colt would be my first choice the fact it was a series 80 and its condition/price turned me off.

I'd take a Series 80 over any of the Swartz-style guns. Series 80 actions work reliably. They take a bit more work to make a good trigger, but a good gunsmith can do it. The trigger on my Series 80 Delta Elite is quite good.

 

[Mark from MA]

I've got a stock Rock Island Armory I bought for 400 bucks new. I've got well over 500 rounds thru without a hiccup.... Feeds hollow points great too.

 

[wmccurdy53]

I've got a Kimber Custom Target II, with the Swartz safety. I've put somewhere around 8-10,000 rounds downrange since Sept '08 without any issues with the Swartz. I don't understand other folks complaining about it.
The Swartz safety is a firing pin block mechanism that is deactivated by the grip safety, therefore does not affect trigger pull. It can be disabled by replacing the firing pin with a series 70.

 

[M1911]

I've got a Kimber Custom Target II, with the Swartz safety. I've put somewhere around 8-10,000 rounds downrange since Sept '08 without any issues with the Swartz. I don't understand other folks complaining about it.
The Swartz safety is a firing pin block mechanism that is deactivated by the grip safety, therefore does not affect trigger pull. It can be disabled by replacing the firing pin with a series 70.

The problem is that it is very sensitive to how it is fit. Many haven't been fit properly, resulting in FTB (failure to go bang). See the opinions of one well-known gunsmith:

http://www.10-8performance.com/id8.html

 

[Supermoto]

The problem is that it is very sensitive to how it is fit. Many haven't been fit properly, resulting in FTB (failure to go bang). See the opinions of one well-known gunsmith:

http://www.10-8performance.com/id8.html

Yep, I have seen that problem with a couple of SW

 

[romoman]

If you want to buy a new gun, I don't think you can go wrong with a Springfield Armory. I have a TRP and have over 3000 rounds through it without any problems. Plus, they have the best warranty in the business. And it is a Series 70 without any of the safety crap.

 

[Keystone]

I have heard a lot of really good things about RIA 1911s...accurate enough, reliable enough, and certainly the right money. Most poor reviews I've seen are from people who never owned or shot one (though, I have seen some from people who got lemons).

That said, I've never seen one in person, so I can't say for certain. If I lived outside of MA, I'd be getting one.

Springfield Armory has a pretty good reputation, my friend has an SA 1911 (GI or Mil-Spec...unsure), it's a nice shooter, though he bobbed the hammer to keep it from chewing his hand to pieces.

 

[Mike S]

Blue Northern has a nice used S&W 1911 for around 750-800 last week, if you live near there it's worth checking out for sure.

 

[drgrant]

Remington Rand would be a surplus WWII gun. It's quality would be in the same boat as all WWII surplus 1911s from all manufacturers -- dependent entirely upon the gun's current condition. Issue sights were hopeless (much too small). Grip safety allows hammer bite. Thumb safety is too small. But I'd hate to butcher a gun with such history to make it shootable. Lots of history, but it wouldn't be useful for me other than as a museum piece.

RIA is a cheap Philippine manufacturer. I wouldn't touch one with your 10' pole, let alone mine.

Kimber Series I? Good. Series II? No thanks. Too many quality problems. The Swartz-style firing pin safety isn't reliable enough. Kimber has gone through 3 different designs of their external extractor trying to make it reliable.

FWIW not every Kimber has a swartz safety in it. The 2004 anniv edition I have is basically a series 70 style gun. I believe they have a few others set up this way, as well. (Desert Warrior?)

-Mike

 

[Gonso]

I have a Para LTC it's been good for me.

 

[M1911]

FWIW not every Kimber has a swartz safety in it. The 2004 anniv edition I have is basically a series 70 style gun. I believe they have a few others set up this way, as well. (Desert Warrior?)

Yes, there are a few newer Kimbers without the Swartz style safety. But the vast majority of them have it.