What Would You Do In This Scenario?

[je25ff]

I would have thrown my poop and vomit at them. It is the best defense after all...right?!

You can tell them you have an STD.

 

[Terminator03]

how do you even know the two guys on the other end are bad guys and not being unfairly targeted by police? jeez

Well, in most cases you would be right. I wouldn't get involved because I would never want to shoot an innocent person just because the police happen to be chasing him. That could in fact be a case of mistaken identity, or the guy may have just been in the wrong place at the wrong time causing him to be a suspect. If anyone thinks they may be screwed for taking a shot at a KNOWN murderer/fugitive here in MA, just imagine what would happen to you if it is later determined that you sniped an innocent/mistaken identity suspect! This is why you are always best to myofb unless they bring to fight to you, or in this case into your home.

 

[SpaceCritter]

Yes obviously there will be firefights, etc but not many join the service wanting to get into them and if they do, that sentiment ends real quick the first time they are even near one, never mind in one. So my conclusion, if you WANT to shoot people, take yourself to a damn insane asylum because thats where you belong. Nothing glorious or fun about it. Its war sometimes its necessary, sometimes its not, sometimes its right, sometimes its wrong. Just like if you get shot, you wont say "ah, give it to me again", if you have to kill somebody for any reason (combat, home invasion) you wont be saying "I wanna do that again".

Yup. "Paging Dave Grossman... Call for Lt. Col. Dave Grossman..."

 

[Terminator03]

Gotta respectfully disagree here, I know you are trying to make a point but enlisting in any US Military Branch will saddle you with much, much stricter rules of engagement these days carrying much, much more severe consequences for "getting it wrong" then being with a police department. Id say in some cases, its almost on par with being a civilian in MA with the trouble you can get in but maybe I'm a bit extreme (would not be the first time). Yes obviously there will be firefights, etc but not many join the service wanting to get into them and if they do, that sentiment ends real quick the first time they are even near one, never mind in one. So my conclusion, if you WANT to shoot people, take yourself to a damn insane asylum because thats where you belong. Nothing glorious or fun about it. Its war sometimes its necessary, sometimes its not, sometimes its right, sometimes its wrong. Just like if you get shot, you wont say "ah, give it to me again", if you have to kill somebody for any reason (combat, home invasion) you wont be saying "I wanna do that again".



I'm not going to presume to know on any authority because its disrespectful to the officer who was very injured and his fellow officers. So, who knows. That said, entirely plausable and nobody should be making any conclusions on where lead was flying from/to and who slung it. I'm sure it will come out in the wash with time but suspect we will hear all about the evidence if it points to the brothers and NOTHING about it if it points to friendly fire.

I will say based on firsthand reports from a SWAT guy in my town who was there at the boat scene and in the neighborhood the night before, LEOs were quite trigger happy and engaged at the drop of a hat. The public and the LEO community are justifying it by pointing out the gravity of the situation, that 2 of their fellow LEOs just got shot, one fatally, etc. I give all the care in the world to their situation, it makes me sick anytime somebody faithfully doing their job is killed in cold blood. In the case of the MIT Officer, he was not doing a damn thing to anybody, just shot in cold blood. T officer, pursuing known ass holes who were a major threat. They were not out shooting dogs at the time, they were not out raiding the homes of law abiding gun owners, etc. I think at that point in time, they gave a shit about protecting the community and were doing it despite known risks. Simple as that.

The above out of the way, it gives nobody permission to fire wildly from all directions like some photo evidence Ive seen suggests as well as firsthand accounts civ and LEO. In combat, military guys probably know of somebody somewhat close to them killed or maimed about once per week or even more often. Often it comes in groups. If they acted on raw emotion or used it to justify over-engaging, they'd be out of the job or in jail, jail being the more likely outcome. Here, the cops, who are far less trained in worrying about innocent bystanders and seem to give less of an F, get praised as heroes and given a pass for anything that they might have done stupid because of the emotions of the night. Sorry, does not fly. You wont see it in the mainstream media but Ive heard from at least 1 cop who was in the perimeter that rounds went into peoples homes multiple times. Look, the marathon bombings were absolutely horrible, 3 killed, 280+ hurt. Later events with MIT cop killed and T severely hurt, absolutely horrible! Not taking that away, its devastating to the person and their families/friends. But how much WORSE would it be if we locked down parts of the area in the name of safety and then effectively doubled or tripled the death toll because trigger happy LEOs cant get their acts together and know their targets or hold their damn fire. Don't see the threat in the boat? Good, now dont friggin shoot at it unless you do see it. What the hell was the HELO and bearcat for? Cant out run the HELO and he was not showing appetite for moving. They have far less sympathy on the boat scenario too as its been determined susp was NOT armed in boat. That means what ever shots were fired came from another trigger happy a**h*** in the crowd looking to make a name for himself. Thats what drew the first big volly from the rest of em. CO of the mess (or some brass) finally came up on the radio and had to tell them to stop the shit and retreat. They were specifically told to move out if they were not SWAT and I think even some specific SWAT team. That is pretty good evidence that the major fire came from whatever yahoos who were given a long gun for the first time could run there first. My SWAT friend called many of his colleagues on scene, SWAT or not, "media hounds" who tried to be first at every BS panic situation they were running to throughout the day.

All kinds of respect for cops and what many are willing to do but the fact is they have never been self policing and youngest up through damn commissioners and colonels of SP were not in the least bit interested in putting any checks on their own gung ho behavior through the day. At least nobody else, civ, cop or mil died or was hurt. Miracle.

Excellent post!

 

[FPrice]

I think that I would refrain from jumping into the middle (figuratively) of a firefight without an invitation.

UNLESS they were firing at me. Then I would consider the incoming rounds to be an invitation.

 

[Eddie_Valiant]

I think that I would refrain from jumping into the middle (figuratively) of a firefight without an invitation.
UNLESS they were firing at me. Then I would consider the incoming rounds to be an invitation.

Of all the responses to this hypothetical situation, yours is the most direct and correct. It's extremely unlikely any of us will ever find ourselves in a situation like this, but as firearm owners, it's worthy of consideration.

 

[zyx123]

The issues always start with positive ID. Do you have positive ID of your target, and do other friendlies in the area have positive ID on you? My bet in this situation that the answer to both questions would have been "no" and that engaging the target would have been the wrong decision for any of several reasons.

 

[kimmie1911]

You don't always know that the bad guy is really the bad guy. I was standing outside of the gun club one day talking to someone and I heard yelling. I look and see what appears to be some low life type guy chasing another not so low life looking guy. He tackles him and they fall to the ground stuggling. I had NO intention of intervening other than to take out my cell phone (not my gun) and call 911. A few seconds later, a few more low lifes show up and join into the fray. I mean, really scum of the earth looking guys. I'm feeling pretty bad for the guy being chased and pummeled into the ground, but not that bad. When everyone finally gets up, the poor guy who was getting chased is in handcuffs and the other low lifes all have police badges hanging from around their necks. And yes, I was really stupid to stand there and watch this, but it happened so fast and I think I was in shock at what I was seeing. All I could say was 'oh wow'.

 

[FPrice]

Of all the responses to this hypothetical situation, yours is the most direct and correct. It's extremely unlikely any of us will ever find ourselves in a situation like this, but as firearm owners, it's worthy of consideration.

Thanks. However while I think I had the right idea, both zyx123 and kimmie1911 provided the necessary reasons why.

 

[FreeWillie]

Most of us don't receive fire/no fire training, but these pictures of the firefight in Watertown on Thursday April 18 / Friday April 19 intrigued me.

The pics were take by a guy on what appears to be the second floor and he's clearly got a shot at the perps. Had that been me, I know I would have had my Ruger 9mm in hand.

What would you have done in this circumstance? I'd really like to hear from experienced and novice shooters, and any LEOs.

View attachment 64476

Not my property. Call the cops and let them deal with it.

My property.... I see people running for cover.

 

[shamrockjr]

I see the immediate issue that you have no way of notifying other friendly shooters in the area that you are in fact 'friendly'. All it takes is for someone to see muzzle flash from the window or the sounds of shots coming from a new area, and they then think there's a possible hostile shooter on the 2nd floor. They can't tell where you're aiming, just that shots are now coming from a new vantage point.

Another +1. Exactly what I was going to write, except not so eloquently.

 

[FreeWillie]

one Molotov on the rocks?

Molotov = 46 parts polystyrene, 33 parts gasoline, 21 parts benzene.

Polystyrene is easily made by melting Styrofoam with Acetone. Toluene works just as well as Benzene. Also known as Napalm, developed at MIT with a Dupont grant. Ain't chemistry wonderful!

 

[cbrxx]

When seconds count, the police are minutes away. Defend yourself if it comes to that, otherwise, their backup was on the way.

 

[Picton]

It's beyond me why anyone would think that leaning out a window with a gun and shooting at the suspect would be a good idea here. Why would anyone think that adding more bullets to a situation where LEOs are firing at anything that moves is a wise move?

Whoever took that picture was a fool for being so close to his window, IMO.

 

[Livefreeormass]

I wouldn't have done anything. I don't trust the cops to be shooting at the right guys, and I wouldn't want to be the one that gets them off the hook for killing innocent people by doing their wet work for them.

+1. Know 100% who and why you want to shoot. No way I shoot at someone in the dark.

 

[Livefreeormass]

I would have taken as many pics as possible of the scene outside my window (without getting perforated in the process), and posted those pics on NES immediately.

Yep, get you best camera ready on days like those and start shooting it in sport mode. Video recording with another camera. Cover yourself! Sell the images and clips on eBay.

 

[FreeWillie]

Sell the images and clips on eBay.

MAGAZINES! MAGAZINES! How many times do I have to tell you they are MAGAZINES not CLIPS!

 

[SpaceCritter]

MAGAZINES! MAGAZINES! How many times do I have to tell you they are MAGAZINES not CLIPS!

Sell the images to Playboy?

 

[falcon123]

You would pull out your Ruger 9mm and kill them, or attempt to anyway?? Riiiight.

Then when the Feds & cops saw gunfire coming from your house or window, they would then riddle you with bullet holes and kill you, and everyone in your family. Congratulations, you're dead.

No fear of that. They couldn't kill one guy in a boat after firing thousands of rounds from almost point blank range.

 

[gunslinger2a]

I really think all NESers need to be ready for this kind of scenario, we need an experienced group buy person (like MIke or Neil), to get us a deal on those ominous FED looking black wind breakers with the Velcro pull-down signs,.. Maybe "NES DON'T SHOOT!" On the front, and maybe "OMG CEASE FIRE!!" On the back

In for one! Lol


Sent from my iPhone using Yakalot

 

[falcon123]

You can tell them you have an STD.

dont forget the ball point pen.