What the Great Ammunition Shortage Says About Inflation

[Reptile]

Concentration is increasing prices and keeping them high. The ammunition duopoly and the "Great Ammunition Shortage" is just one example.​

Covid has done a lot of things to our society. But talk to anyone who enjoys hunting, and they’ll tell you one of result is the ‘Great Ammunition Shortage of 2021.’ "5.56 ammunition for an AR-15 used to be about 33 cents a round," said Mark Oliva, director of public affairs for the National Shooting Sports Foundation. "Now you're looking at closer to almost a dollar a round. So it is much more expensive and it is much more difficult to find ammunition."

One of the more interesting questions in the discussion over inflation is the relationship between concentration and pricing changes. Most economists believe that supply shocks are increasing profits, but that this increase will serve as an inducement to more productive capacity. "Capitalism is on our side,” said economist Alan Blinder in the Wall Street Journal. “Shortages raise prices, but high prices create opportunities for profit, which attract capitalists to alleviate the shortages." If Blinder were correct, then one would expect lots of new productive capacity and new entrants into this market.

Ammunition is a highly concentrated industry. There are many ammo brands, like CCI, Federal, Remington, Winchester, and Speer, but they are all controlled by two firms - Vista Outdoor and the Olin Corporation. As Elle Ekman wrote in the American Prospect, Vista and Olin rolled up the industry through mergers, as well as taking advantage of the privatization of government facilities making ammunition and government contracts.

During the pandemic, a lot of people decided they wanted to buy and use guns, either for hunting or personal protection. The 12 million new gun owners, plus existing activity, meant that the industry experienced the same demand shock that lots of outdoor activity segments saw. The result has been a shortage of ammunition, and higher prices.

Like a lot of industries, there are cost pressures in ammunition; the price of raw materials, like brass, have gone up. Additionally, the State Department has blocked imports from Russia, adding to the pricing pressure. But the cost story is really a sideshow; the pricing increase is going almost entirely to profit. For Vista, margins skyrocketed in 2020, and continued to increase in 2021. As the CFO of Vista, Sudhanshu Shekhar Priyadarshi, told investors in November, margins rose to a record 27% in Q2 of 2021, on top of an already extraordinary 2020.

According to Blinder, and most economists, competitors should enter the market and invest in new factories, or existing firms should expand existing capacity to seize market share, eventually leading to reduced prices. But the industry hasn’t experienced such competitive dynamics. Profits, said Priyadarshi, have gone to share repurchases and paying down debt.

There are several reasons for this, but the main ones are consolidation and high barriers to entry in the industry. Ammunition is difficult to produce, as it requires careful manufacturing processes to safely handle explosive materials. Vista recently bought its competitor Remington out of bankruptcy, lowering the number of firms in the industry that could even build a factory and distribute ammunition effectively. And the limits on capacity were explicit. The head of ammunition for Vista, Jason R. Vanderbrink, explained that the “most important” reason for the Remington acquisition was “added capacity to Vista without increasing the overall market capacity."

This isn’t purely a story of informal cartel engaged in profit-seeking, but also risk-management. Like a lot of commodity businesses, the ammunition industry is cyclical, with shortages and price hikes when demand increases, followed by collapses as capacity increases and demand stays level or declines. Industry executives know this, and are intent on that not happening again. Here’s Christopher T. Metz, the CEO of Vista, talking about their purchase of Remington, a competitor in the industry.

Continues...

What the Great Ammunition Shortage Says About Inflation

Concentration is increasing prices and keeping them high. The ammunition duopoly and the "Great Ammunition Shortage" is just one example.

mattstoller.substack.com

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

Unlike last time we also don’t have a Walmart supply chain and distribution to chase prices down in a hurry.

Ammunition, like cars and houses, I wonder if we will ever see the prices we once did.

 

[drgrant]

Unlike last time we also don’t have a Walmart supply chain and distribution to chase prices down in a hurry.

Ammunition, like cars and houses, I wonder if we will ever see the prices we once did.

Lol. Walmart has little to do with it, although they did provide a valuable price reference of what the source cost of ammo was, and price tamping during instability peaks but the market doesn't behave like that anymore, it's legitimately hammered by demand.

Ammo is never going back to 2019 prices absent some kind of weird economic perfect storm- eg, a recession so hard it makes people stop buying....

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

Lol. Walmart has little to do with it, although they did provide a valuable price reference of what the source cost of ammo was, and price tamping during instability peaks but the market doesn't behave like that anymore, it's legitimately hammered by demand.

Walmart was 15-20% of the total commercial ammo market with distribution management that far exceeded what any crappy firearms distributor could ever imagine. Bull shit Walmart had little to do with it.

Currently the market is pounded by demand, although I would argue to a lesser degree than after Sandy Hook.(I don’t have proof of that, only how fast large supplies returned based on my experience) Ammo supplies have been “back” for a good while during COVID, its just expensive. Without a major player like Walmart setting the price floor and able to stock the shelves we are left with dealers buying from shitty gun distributors (the games they play are ridiculous) or online retailers stuck with shipping costs that have sky rocketed.

I don’t think prices are going back either (on ammo, cars, or houses) as in the case of ammo it was the perfect storm of massive inventory build up and the collapse of major distributors and even consumer interest post Obama

 

[enbloc]

What the Great Ammunition Shortage Says About Inflation​

I don't think it was so great...

 

[67ray]

Ammunition, like cars and houses, I wonder if we will ever see the prices we once did.

We won't see nor should we. This isn't a product that can experience tremendous innovation and thus savings because it is simple with few components. Raw materials will not go down, and there is not much room in design to make manufacturing savings. We have seen steel cased bring the price down but consumers do not consider it equivalent, and plastic/plastic coated projectiles for competition but also not universally interchangeable. Ammo is a commodity product and it's price moves in response to factors much like other commodities.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

We won't see nor should we. This isn't a product that can experience tremendous innovation and thus savings because it is simple with few components. Raw materials will not go down, and there is not much room in design to make manufacturing savings. We have seen steel cased bring the price down but consumers do not consider it equivalent, and plastic/plastic coated projectiles for competition but also not universally interchangeable. Ammo is a commodity product and it's price moves in response to factors much like other commodities.

While I don’t disagree, plenty of people said it wouldn’t go back down after Sandy Hook and couldn’t have been more wrong.

I’m also not sure I entirely agree with your assessment of commercial ammunition. Commercial ammunition is a luxury item comprised of individual commodities. Compounding that complexity is that it is also tied to military and police department production. While there may not be “innovation” the fact that ammunition production is tied to government contracts and civil and political unrest around the world makes the influencing factors on pricing of ammo far more complex I think.

 

[drgrant]

Walmart was 15-20% of the total commercial ammo market with distribution management that far exceeded what any crappy firearms distributor could ever imagine. Bull shit Walmart had little to do with it.

Walmart surely had a big edge effect though when the market had bounced off the bottom and was restoring itself, it limited the window in which some shops and retailers could rape the shit out of people, sure. Hell I was a big proponent of this theory on NES.

As far as dictating prices though, that's laughable when the demand is off the chart. Walmart was in the same empty shelf land everyone
else is. The fact that Walmart had lower prices was irrelevant when the shelves were largely empty.

Currently the market is pounded by demand, although I would argue to a lesser degree than after Sandy Hook.(I don’t have proof of that, only how fast large supplies returned based on my experience) Ammo supplies have been “back” for a good while during COVID, its just expensive.

IMHO it's just appearances not reality. When SH hit the recovery was long because the market was still heavily wounded trying to recvoer from both Obamascares, so it was already suffering pretty bad before the event. When SH lit off, prices had never stabilized ever since Obama got in, they bounced around a bunch but never truly hit bottom. This situation grossly exaggerated the effects of SH- when SH happened the market was
shit to begin with- which made the effects of SH grossly exaggerated in appearance.

ECR (eg, election, covid, riots) on the other hand..... in pure, raw terms... Sandy Hook doesn't hold a candle to it. Not even in the same universe. The start conditions were different, which is why you saw what you saw in proportional terms. When ECR hit in Mar 2020, the channel was FLUSH with product in a way that hadn't been seen before 2008, and there was way more of it than back then too. The trump slump literally stacked the channel with a year or more of product in it that hadn't been barely touched. Bear in mind aslo the industry had come way up since 08 to better meet demands. More manufacturing capability. More brands. More imported ammo. More of everything. Industry was in a better position to meet demands placed on it.

ECR, even just the bulk of it from Mar 2020 until Mar 2021, makes Sandy Hook like an irrelevant mouse fart., in terms of volume of sales of guns, ammo, and acessories. I guess you missed the part where all the records vs time were broken. SH doesnt even come close. Actually I would
bet right now that you'd probably have to add up both Obamascares plus SH to be able to even tickle ECRs bunghole in terms of volume.

Without a major player like Walmart setting the price floor and able to stock the shelves

Again, Walmart only really mattered on the fringes. You throw enough demand in there, they don't matter so much.

Let me put it this way- Even if Walmart hadn't cucked out, buying 1000 rounds of 9mm at Walmart would still be over $300 right now, assuming you could even buy that much of it at once. more than likely you'd be rationed to 3 boxes and still paying like $18 a box for it. Lower than avg retail sure, but not by leaps and bounds. And the shelves would usually be empty.

Also the market forces worked. For example during the peak of this ECR shit street price for 1000 rounds of 9mm was like $600. After the mouth breathing hyperventilating shit eating nippleheads wearing 5 masks got done armflapping, that was the end of that. The rest of the market said "HOW ABOUT NO, we done. " Not to mention lots of dealers flat out refused to pay like over $400 at wholesale for a case of 9. they literally just said no. A lot of distributors didnt even try, because the dealers just told them to go f*** themselves, especially the ones who had been around the block a few times since Obama. The rape under duress act with distribution finally wore thin.

It also helped that dealers had more outs. Like for example, the $1500 shit grade panic AR isn't a thing anymore. Because its way too easy for a dealer to tell a distributor to f*** off when the dealer can buy from 10 times the number of AR producers vs 2008.

we are left with dealers buying from shitty gun distributors (the games they play are ridiculous) or online retailers stuck with shipping costs that have sky rocketed.

Yes, they still suck, but in case you hadn't noticed- the trump slump punched a bunch of mid level distributors right in the rectum. Ellet Bros, gone, Jerrys, gone. Horton's, gone.... probably another 3 or 4 I can't remember offhand. All killed by the slump and various dealers jettisoning them because of whatever past sins they had committed.

I don’t think prices are going back either (on ammo, cars, or houses) as in the case of ammo it was the perfect storm of massive inventory build up and the collapse of major distributors and even consumer interest post Obama

Ammo will drop, I just don't think the skinflint nippleheads that expect it to go back to $165/K for 9 are going to be very pleased. That ain't happening, hell the sustained demand alone will prevent that. If you were able to get the real FOB factory dock price I bet it's much higher than that right now... probably well over 200 bucks/k.

 

[G4Y4HK]

Not to worry. For the poors, I recommend practicing with airsoft. You can still get match grade 0.2G BBs for around a pack of 5000 for $8-15. Get your range time on

 

[67ray]

While I don’t disagree, plenty of people said it wouldn’t go back down after Sandy Hook and couldn’t have been more wrong.

I’m also not sure I entirely agree with your assessment of commercial ammunition. Commercial ammunition is a luxury item comprised of individual commodities. Compounding that complexity is that it is also tied to military and police department production. While there may not be “innovation” the fact that ammunition production is tied to government contracts and civil and political unrest around the world makes the influencing factors on pricing of ammo far more complex I think.

Yes and I still believe we won't "see the prices we once did." Commodities go up and down with demand spikes, but the floor is the materials & manufacturing cost. We won't see the $4.95 box of S&B 9mm that was available all day long in 2002, because the raw materials have gone up since then. Maybe we will see the $14.95 box or the $11.95 even some day but first the demand has to go away allowing the inventories to build up. Sandy Hook, 2020, etc. are demand spikes and I agree they are not long term effects on the market.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

We won't see the $4.95 box of S&B 9mm that was available all day long in 2002, because the raw materials have gone up since then. Maybe we will see the $14.95 box or the $11.95 even some day but first the demand has to go away allowing the inventories to build up. Sandy Hook, 2020, etc. are demand spikes and I agree they are not long term effects on the market.

I’m a gun owner because of the ice storm in central Mass in 2008. In my early 20’s stuck without power in a cold house with my wife and twin boys that weren’t even 2 years old yet listening to house get broken into made an impression… I have no experience with pricing prior to that.

That being said Federal is already down to under $18 a box, so I could see a possibility of $15 a box in the next 6 to 12 months for an overseas production Ammo brand.

 

[Qwikdraw45]

Don't forget the shipping increases, either. I've seen some reasonable prices online (distributor or auction), but the shipping costs destroy the deal.

 

[rscalzo]

While I don’t disagree, plenty of people said it wouldn’t go back down after Sandy Hook and couldn’t have been more wrong.

I’m also not sure I entirely agree with your assessment of commercial ammunition. Commercial ammunition is a luxury item comprised of individual commodities. Compounding that complexity is that it is also tied to military and police department production. While there may not be “innovation” the fact that ammunition production is tied to government contracts and civil and political unrest around the world makes the influencing factors on pricing of ammo far more complex I think.

Sandy Hook was a political issue. Today the issue is increased costs. Go try to buy a roll of copper wire and tell me if the price is what it was two years ago? Labor costs and shipping the same?
The prices will vary but anyone looking for the 2018 pricing has a very long wait.

 

[drgrant]

Yes and I still believe we won't "see the prices we once did." Commodities go up and down with demand spikes, but the floor is the materials & manufacturing cost. We won't see the $4.95 box of S&B 9mm that was available all day long in 2002, because the raw materials have gone up since then. Maybe we will see the $14.95 box or the $11.95 even some day but first the demand has to go away allowing the inventories to build up. Sandy Hook, 2020, etc. are demand spikes and I agree they are not long term effects on the market.

ECR added like 5 million new gun owners. Even if only 20% stay and buy on the reg, thats a huge impact to the market in terms of ongoing demand vs the very "bursty" activities of years past. Eventually it will taper a bit but put it this way.... unlike the last few panics this has more staying power on the base end. These people aren't existing owners armflapping, its a whole new customer base.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

……

I have no idea where to go with this mess of a rant. Much of it goes to the contrary of what I have seen first hand with intimate knowledge of more than one large shop over the past 10 years and other parts seem to have nothing to do with anything that’s being said in any way.

I know very well why the shops and distributors went under. Poor management and leveraging in the direction of a political outcome that didn’t happen were part of it.

Both COVID and Obama added a ton of gun owners. That creates a huge spike in demand that subsides relatively quickly. I suspect that’s because most new owners firearms sit in a dresser or in a closet never to be seen again.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

Sandy Hook was a political issue. Today the issue is increased costs. Go try to buy a roll of copper wire and tell me if the price is what it was two years ago? Labor costs and shipping the same?
The prices will vary but anyone looking for the 2018 pricing has a very long wait.

Sandy Hook was a supply issue just as today, it just happened to be localized to the firearms industry unlike today.

No doubt, COVID is far more complex and farther reaching than Sandy Hook

 

[240Geezer]

Walmart surely had a big edge effect though when the market had bounced off the bottom and was restoring itself, it limited the window in which some shops and retailers could rape the shit out of people, sure. Hell I was a big proponent of this theory on NES.

As far as dictating prices though, that's laughable when the demand is off the chart. Walmart was in the same empty shelf land everyone
else is. The fact that Walmart had lower prices was irrelevant when the shelves were largely empty.



IMHO it's just appearances not reality. When SH hit the recovery was long because the market was still heavily wounded trying to recvoer from both Obamascares, so it was already suffering pretty bad before the event. When SH lit off, prices had never stabilized ever since Obama got in, they bounced around a bunch but never truly hit bottom. This situation grossly exaggerated the effects of SH- when SH happened the market was
shit to begin with- which made the effects of SH grossly exaggerated in appearance.

ECR (eg, election, covid, riots) on the other hand..... in pure, raw terms... Sandy Hook doesn't hold a candle to it. Not even in the same universe. The start conditions were different, which is why you saw what you saw in proportional terms. When ECR hit in Mar 2020, the channel was FLUSH with product in a way that hadn't been seen before 2008, and there was way more of it than back then too. The trump slump literally stacked the channel with a year or more of product in it that hadn't been barely touched. Bear in mind aslo the industry had come way up since 08 to better meet demands. More manufacturing capability. More brands. More imported ammo. More of everything. Industry was in a better position to meet demands placed on it.

ECR, even just the bulk of it from Mar 2020 until Mar 2021, makes Sandy Hook like an irrelevant mouse fart., in terms of volume of sales of guns, ammo, and acessories. I guess you missed the part where all the records vs time were broken. SH doesnt even come close. Actually I would
bet right now that you'd probably have to add up both Obamascares plus SH to be able to even tickle ECRs bunghole in terms of volume.



Again, Walmart only really mattered on the fringes. You throw enough demand in there, they don't matter so much.

Let me put it this way- Even if Walmart hadn't cucked out, buying 1000 rounds of 9mm at Walmart would still be over $300 right now, assuming you could even buy that much of it at once. more than likely you'd be rationed to 3 boxes and still paying like $18 a box for it. Lower than avg retail sure, but not by leaps and bounds. And the shelves would usually be empty.

Also the market forces worked. For example during the peak of this ECR shit street price for 1000 rounds of 9mm was like $600. After the mouth breathing hyperventilating shit eating nippleheads wearing 5 masks got done armflapping, that was the end of that. The rest of the market said "HOW ABOUT NO, we done. " Not to mention lots of dealers flat out refused to pay like over $400 at wholesale for a case of 9. they literally just said no. A lot of distributors didnt even try, because the dealers just told them to go f*** themselves, especially the ones who had been around the block a few times since Obama. The rape under duress act with distribution finally wore thin.

It also helped that dealers had more outs. Like for example, the $1500 shit grade panic AR isn't a thing anymore. Because its way too easy for a dealer to tell a distributor to f*** off when the dealer can buy from 10 times the number of AR producers vs 2008.



Yes, they still suck, but in case you hadn't noticed- the trump slump punched a bunch of mid level distributors right in the rectum. Ellet Bros, gone, Jerrys, gone. Horton's, gone.... probably another 3 or 4 I can't remember offhand. All killed by the slump and various dealers jettisoning them because of whatever past sins they had committed.



Ammo will drop, I just don't think the skinflint nippleheads that expect it to go back to $165/K for 9 are going to be very pleased. That ain't happening, hell the sustained demand alone will prevent that. If you were able to get the real FOB factory dock price I bet it's much higher than that right now... probably well over 200 bucks/k.

No my skin flint nipplehead ass expects it to be less. Ultimately.
Until the next manufactured "crisis" anyways.

 

[Individualist]

Many valid arguments on both sides of the coin. Ultimately the answer will be somewhere in the middle. Prices will decrease, they already have from the high, but will likely not reach the lows of where they were a few years ago under Trump.

ECR most definitely was more of a perfect storm than other limited events. However, a significant political shift can again turn prices to the downside fairly quickly.

Conservatives taking back the WH, Congress or States is essential and will decrease demand. Getting rid of Fauxi, mandates, making therapeutics available, not sucking China’s dick and dismantling the Cornhole lie will stifle plague fears. Supporting LE, criminal law and actually prosecuting rioters will decrease demand.

Many of the new gun owners over the past couple of years don’t like guns. I know a few, who are likely very typical, that bought a gun “just in case” (because riots), but otherwise don’t want to have anything to do with it. They won’t continue to impact ammo or firearm demand significantly over time.

Manufacturers now taking advantage of current higher prices and demand can again end up in over supply if things shift quickly enough.

However, inflation of materials, wages, shipping, and cost of sales in general will and always have had an inclining impact over time, even as short-term monetary policy changes and prices cycle up and down.

Prices will get better, prices will get worse again and again, but they still rise slightly over time. That’s just how things work. The key is to go against the reactionary hoards and overstock your SHTF supplies when times and prices are good.

 

[Garys]

COVID itself had about nothing to do with shortages of guns and ammunition. It was the politically motivated riots after George Floyd killed himself that caused them. Once the Democrats stole the 2020 election the process of tamping down the riots began. Demand has begun to ease and supply has increased. The price will start to soften somewhat in the coming months. A bit, but inflation will prevent prices from returning to 2019 levels.

Sandy Hook was a supply issue just as today, it just happened to be localized to the firearms industry unlike today.

No doubt, COVID is far more complex and farther reaching than Sandy Hook

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

COVID itself had about nothing to do with shortages of guns and ammunition. It was the politically motivated riots after George Floyd killed himself that caused them. Once the Democrats stole the 2020 election the process of tamping down the riots began. Demand has begun to ease and supply has increased. The price will start to soften somewhat in the coming months. A bit, but inflation will prevent prices from returning to 2019 levels.

The side effects of COVID (raw materials, price increases, labor shortages, shipping issues) have and will have farther reaching implications on both supply and pricing than George Floyd.

In the case of my example I am actually using COVID generically to describe the entirety of the situation. I don’t believe the riots in 2020 to be why prices are currently still high and supplies still so thin. I may be underestimating how the one / two punch of lockdowns and then GF riots may have worsened the blow.

I also don’t believe this to be a guns shortage, as regular or high inventory of firearms themselves has been a thing since mid 2021. Prices are higher than ever, and segments of the market are thin if you are looking for a specific item. Those items don’t seem to low in volume because of demand, more that production has been limited based on materials price or labor shift or shortage (I’m thinking Ruger single action revolvers as an example - given their volume, labor costs, materials costs, it makes sense to not produce them right now)

 

[cathouse01]

The question that no one in the industry can really answer is what will be the stable level of ammo consumption going forward. Much of the ammo still being purchased is not being consumed but is either just sitting in the draw of one of the new gun owners (that vast majority of which I would contend will never actually use a full box of ammo) or is being hoarded on the shelves of the traditional enthusiast. As I’ve said before, the difference with ammo as a consumable is its almost unlimited shelf life (see M1 Garand Megathread to see what 50 year old M1 Garand ammo looks like). Until the level of actual consumption can be ascertained, I can’t see anyone investing in new factories, since the long term, non-panic market for ammunition is actually dependent on rounds being consumed not rounds being bought. So the manufacturers will respond by just right running current factories flat out and raising prices, since the market is not clear enough to invest in new factories.

There is also the factor of inflation. Looking at prices from 1950 vs. 2020 (before “ECR") you can see them going up in current dollars, but actually going down in inflated dollars (from Widener’s Shooting, Hunting and Gun blog).

Ammo Prices: 1950 VS 2020​

Here are comparisons for the most popular types of ammunition:

Ammo Type	Cost in 1950	Cost in 2020	1950 Price Adjusted for Inflation
12-Gauge Shells (per 25)	$2.60	$6.99	$27.75
.30-06 180gr (per 20)	$3.22	$14.85	$34.50
.22LR 36gr (per 500)	$6.50	$24.00	$69.50
9mm 115-124gr (per 50)	$4.09	$11.45	$43.65
.38 Special 158gr (per 50)	$2.98	$14.85	$31.80
.45 ACP Ammo 230 gr (per 50)	$4.40	$18.85	$46.95

The one difference I see that will have a major impact on ammo prices is the increasing demand for coper. The move to electric vehicles has resulted in a significant increase in the demand for coper and corresponding upward pressure on the price. I don’t see this changing in the near future. This can be somewhat addressed by the move to steal and aluminum cased ammo, but good old brass ammo prices will never be the same.

 

[groundscrapers]

you had unprecedented demand combined with supply chain issues both foreign and domestic. This wasn't a result of inflation.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

you had unprecedented demand combined with supply chain issues both foreign and domestic. This wasn't a result of inflation.

I completely agree with that. What happens from here (regarding pricing) will likely be more heavily influenced by inflation compound by labor issues

 

[drgrant]

COVID itself had about nothing to do with shortages of guns and ammunition. It was the politically motivated riots after George Floyd killed himself that caused them.

Not true at all, there was definitely a covid component to gun sales. Covid-fear-sales were full retard long before the rioting puffed up. The first wave of gun and ammo shortages in 2020 was basically welded to covid as far as im concerned.

 

[Garys]

Wrong.

Not true at all, there was definitely a covid component to gun sales. Covid-fear-sales were full retard long before the rioting puffed up. The first wave of gun and ammo shortages in 2020 was basically welded to covid as far as im concerned.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

Ammo Prices: 1950 VS 2020
Here are comparisons for the most popular types of ammunition:

Ammo Type	Cost in 1950	Cost in 2020	1950 Price Adjusted for Inflation
12-Gauge Shells (per 25)	$2.60	$6.99	$27.75
.30-06 180gr (per 20)	$3.22	$14.85	$34.50
.22LR 36gr (per 500)	$6.50	$24.00	$69.50
9mm 115-124gr (per 50)	$4.09	$11.45	$43.65
.38 Special 158gr (per 50)	$2.98	$14.85	$31.80
.45 ACP Ammo 230 gr (per 50)	$4.40	$18.85	$46.95

Its interesting you mention this; I've read old handloading manuals from the 40s and shooting a few hundred rifle rounds a year was considered a luxury reserved for competition shooters. Now, combine those ammo prices with wages from back then. People earned less and things cost more.

Generally speaking, most competition shooters weren't buying pallets of ammo back in 1950.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

Wrong

Brilliant response, but the fact is the guns and ammo were gone long before he was dead. The GF riots certainly made the whole deeper, but were really in fact secondary or even tertiary factors

 

[drgrant]

Wrong.

Not sure if serious. When the lockdowns started George Floyd was COMPLETELY f***ing irrelevant. And the shelves were bare. Floyd wasn't even killed until rhe end of May. Not sure how to explain that any better. There were already serious product shortages by then. The riots later caused another wave on top of the covid one. I know because i was on the front lines selling the shit during all this.

 

[Rate_of_Twist]

Not true at all, there was definitely a covid component to gun sales. Covid-fear-sales were full retard long before the rioting puffed up. The first wave of gun and ammo shortages in 2020 was basically welded to covid as far as im concerned.

100% on this. GF certainly made things worse, but wasn’t the cause. I’m not even sure GF and the riots were even relevant for the duration of 2020, let alone 2021

I would say GF had a far greater impact on things like concealed carry firearms and defensive shotguns

 

[drgrant]

100% on this. GF certainly made things worse, but wasn’t the cause.

I would say GF had a far greater impact on things like concealed carry firearms and defensive shotguns

I noticed an uptick in the people desiring shotguns for sure. People were already FR for pump shotguns but they went 150% once the riots started. Carry guns were strong throughout.