Purchasing a firearm while on probation

S

steveyc272

Hello all,

I was arrested back in April for an OUI at which time I plead to sufficient facts and was given a continuance without a finding. As part of this, I was put under the supervision of the probation department until May 2009. There is nothing under my terms of probation in regards to owning or purchasing a firearm. Also, my LTC has not been revoked by the police department. In fact, I had to pick up some ammunition that I had in my trunk on the night of the arrest from the police department and when the police officer looked up my license it was still valid.

My question is if I will be able to purchase a firearm? I figured I would ask here first before I went to a gun shop. I really appreciate any help. Thank you.

Steve
 
I'd talk with a lawyer before doing that!

There are 3 good firearms attorneys on this forum. Jesse Cohen, Darius Arbabi and Keith Langer.
 
LenS said:
I'd talk with a lawyer before doing that!

There are 3 good firearms attorneys on this forum. Jesse Cohen, Darius Arbabi and Keith Langer.
Click to expand...

We need a new button at the bottom of the page, so the choices are "Post Quick Reply", "Go Advanced", and "Reply with standard lawyer referral" [laugh]
 
LenS said:
I'd talk with a lawyer before doing that!

There are 3 good firearms attorneys on this forum. Jesse Cohen, Darius Arbabi and Keith Langer.
Click to expand...

If they have their LTC and their chief isn't revoking it, why do they need a lawyer? Go and buy what you want.
 
I am not a lawyer BUT

I think you'll find that in MA any DWI conviction after 1994 knocks you out of the game.

Did you get convicted or did you CWOF? Although for RMV and insurance purposes a CWOF counts as a conviction IIRC, a CWOF might not automatically disqualify you.

There are several Lawyers on this board who specialize in firearms law. Lawyer up and ask them, because even if you are not disqualified now, chances are at your next renewal you will be.


DISQUALIFYING CRIMES
Crimes Against the Person

- Assault
- Assault & Battery
- Assault & Battery on Public Employee
- Assault & Battery on Ambulance Personnel
- Permitting Injury to a Child
- Gross Negligence by Common Carrier
- Assault & Battery/Property Damage to Intimidate
- Causing Injury in a Physical Exercise Program
- Resisting Arrest

Crimes Against Property

- Failure to Report Hotel Fire
- Larceny from Common Carrier/Business
- Larceny Under $250 from Elder/Disabled Person
- Shoplifting over $250
- Falsely Obtaining Commercial Computer Service
- Receipt of Deposit by Insolvent Bank
- Receiving Stolen Property Under $250
- False Statement to Motor Vehicle Insurer
- Obstruction of Medical Facility - Subsequent Offense
- Wanton Destruction Property over $250
- Destruction Church/School Property
- Destruction Jail Property

Motor Vehicle Offenses

- Operating After Suspension for DWI/Motor Vehicle Homicide
- DWI Alcohol
- Motor Vehicle Homicide while DWI or while Operating to Endanger
- DWI with Serious Bodily Injury
- DWI on a Vessel
- DWI on a Vessel with Serious Bodily Injury
- Homicide by Vessel while DWI or while Operating to Endanger
 
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Thank you for the responses. I was given a CWOF so in May 2009 the case will be dismissed. Thus, it will not disqualify me from having my LTC (per my lawyer at the time). Because I was not convicted of the crime, they do not have to revoke my license, although they could. I believe that talking to a lawyer now would be a smart decision, just to make sure that I would not be violating any law or terms of my probation. My real question however is if the background check conducted at the firearm store would not pass clean as my case is technically still pending and I am technically on probation. Perhaps my best option would be to talk to a lawyer and just go to a store and see if they will sell me a firearm. I should note that I have never been arrested before, have a college education, have a lucrative job, and am only looking to purchase a firearm for personal protection. Thanks again for the help.
 
Because I was not convicted of the crime, they do not have to revoke my license, although they could. I believe that talking to a lawyer now would be a smart decision, just to make sure that I would not be violating any law or terms of my probation.
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Dumb question probably, but how do you get probation without a conviction? Isn't probation something you get other than jail time?
 
I have 2 friends that were both arrested for OUI, and they both still have their LTC-A unrestricted. Neither were carrying at the time of arrest. Both got CWOF. Technically, they're both ok to buy guns and ammo at present. But as stated, we'll see what happens when renewal time comes.

If the chief or your town decides you're unsuitable, it's within his authority to deny your renewal.

Sucks, huh?
 
Pilgrim...When you receive a continuance without a finding, you are given certain conditions, including probation typically, that you need to adhere to for a certain amount of time. When the time is up and you have done everything the judge has asked your case is dismissed.

45collector...That is good news that they still have them. Luckily for me, I just got my LTC within the last year, so I still have a while before it is up. You would think after 5 years of being a responsible gun-owner the chief would not give me a hard time for renewal.

Regardless, I am eager to see if I pass the background check while on probation. I will let you know how it turns out. Thanks again for the replies.
 
steveyc272 said:
...
45collector...That is good news that they still have them. Luckily for me, I just got my LTC within the last year, so I still have a while before it is up. You would think after 5 years of being a responsible gun-owner the chief would not give me a hard time for renewal.

Regardless, I am eager to see if I pass the background check while on probation. I will let you know how it turns out. Thanks again for the replies.
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Just remember that your OUI will follow you around for the rest of your life.
When you go to renew, you must disclose the fact that you had to appear in court, whether it was CWOF or not. Do not try to hide ANYTHING from the PD when filling out the paperwork. I recently inquired to one of our NES lawyers about the possibility of having my renewal denied because of some trouble I was in when I was a teenager. I've been a responsible gun owner for 10+ years, with an LTC-A unrestricted, and haven't so much as spit on the sidewalk since my "youthful shananigans". But that doesn't mean squat if an anti-gun chief wanted to deny my renewal 2 years from now.
 
steveyc272 said:
You would think after 5 years of being a responsible gun-owner the chief would not give me a hard time for renewal.
Click to expand...


Best of luck there.I was denied upon renwal...I have had my license for 10 years...I had a recieving stolen property charge that was cwof...Years later...denied on renawal...I appealed and was denied again....which i was just notified about today.My case was actually cwof per recommendation of my cities licensing officer.

Not to hi-jack your thread.

Does anyone know what or if there is anything else i can do.
 
steveyc272 said:
...I was given a CWOF...
Click to expand...

This reminds me of the movie Elf.

"How did everything work out?" "Oh, it went well, they gave me a restraining order."

Off topic I know, and not legal advice by any means but...I make myself laugh sometimes.
 
Everyone thinks a CWOF is a get out of jail free pass, I assure you it is not.

If you are guilty and get offered a CWOF, well then take it, but to accept a CWOF if you are not guilty and have the resources to go to trial and pay for competent legal counsel, then you are nuts.

CWOFS are offered because the DA's are too lazy to take the case to trial and are hoping you'll see it as a free pass.

a lot of people who took the easy way out many years ago are now getting bit in the ass because of CWOF's. DWI is not something I encourage, but people who took CWOF's on questionable DWI charges years ago are now looking at jail time if they ever get arrested again on a DWI.

IANAL but never take a breathalyzer, never accept a CWOF if you are innocent.
 
I took a cwof because it was the easy way out....It was a case that i could have beat...I figured a cwof was not a conviction...man i regret it now.
 
Bomber78 said:
I took a cwof because it was the easy way out....It was a case that i could have beat...I figured a cwof was not a conviction...man i regret it now.
Click to expand...

A CWOF is not a conviction, the pontifications of certain chiefs to the contrary notwithstanding. It IS, however, grounds for a denial based upon "suitability."
 
it is not a conviction, but it is not a "not guilty" "innocent" or " not responsible" either

CWOF's do not vaporize. They stay on your record and when you are standing in front of the judge, and he looks over at the person representing the probation department and asks what your record is, the PO chimes up that there is a CWOF for ZXY on your record. Or in some cases 7 previous CWOF's.
They count against you just as much as a guilty IMHO, and that is based on much interaction with the Massachusetts court system.

NEVER EVER CWOF if you can avoid it
 
Scrivener said:
Perhaps that should read "if you can afford it."
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Affording it isn't the issue .I hired an attorney to handle my appeal for me...He showed up in court said his piece...Took my $2500 and told me I would get my denial in the mail[rofl]


It was almost commical...Now i just hope i can get someone else to point me in the right direction.
 
if you're license is still valid i don't see why it would be a problem. Don't be paranoid and go wasting money on a lawyer. Either you license if valid or it isn't. If it's not, they won't sell you a gun anyway. If it is, then you bought the gun legally. What's so hard about that?
 
45collector said:
If the chief or your town decides you're unsuitable, it's within his authority to deny your renewal.

Sucks, huh?
Click to expand...

No, it does not suck.

I personally don't want to see guns in the hands of anyone who lacks the good sense to avoid drinking and driving.

With all the information available on the internet about gun laws there's just no excuse at all for anyone screwing up and having their license status changed.

If someone is that thoughtless and has judgment that is that bad, then I say take away the LTC. Those people give all the rest of us law-abiding gun owners a bad name.
 
Pomeraniac said:
No, it does not suck.

I personally don't want to see guns in the hands of anyone who lacks the good sense to avoid drinking and driving.
Click to expand...

Which is why the penalty was increased in 1994 and has been an LTC disqualifier since 1998.

In short, a post-5/94 OUI conviction is NOT anything a chief has discretion over.

So, what's your next rationalization of having 351 different standards for issuing an LTC? [flame]
 
Pomeraniac said:
No, it does not suck.

I personally don't want to see guns in the hands of anyone who lacks the good sense to avoid drinking and driving.

With all the information available on the internet about gun laws there's just no excuse at all for anyone screwing up and having their license status changed.

If someone is that thoughtless and has judgment that is that bad, then I say take away the LTC. Those people give all the rest of us law-abiding gun owners a bad name.
Click to expand...

What other rights shall we take away from someone with a DUI? How about Free Speech, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, protection against self incrimination? Sheeeesh......Your just what the anti's love[sad2].

It's a "right".

I personally don't see why someone with your point of view should be allowed to speak in public.

Do you see my point?
 
The "If you can afford it" part is key. A guy that I work with was convicted of a DUI in college. That was 25 years ago. About five years ago he got stupid and was arrested for DUI again. Under current law the very old DUI had a significant impact on his case.

This is a sales guy that has to drive for a living. He ended up pleading out the case, losing his license for a while, and still has to blow in a tube to drive his car. Oh.. and he has to pay around $100 a month to have the thing calibrated. It is embarrassing as hell for him to explain, and he just can't take clients out in his car due to this.

The point of the story is it has cost him $40-50K for all he has gone through. This includes legal fees, fines, hiring a driver to make sales calls so he could continue to make a living, and trying to get the court to allow removal of his car interlock device. This does not include the embarrassment of explaining it to his wife, teenage kids and family. It has been a nightmare for him, and a very expensive nightmare. Yes, he was stupid and regrets every minute of it.

"Affording justice" for a DUI is just not within the means of most people these days.

I'm curious if Scrivener of other attorneys in this forum would estimate cost of a solid, competent defense against a DUI? I think we would find it shocking.
 
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Pomeraniac said:
Words on a message board can't kill, but automobiles and guns in the hands of irresponsible, drunken, criminal crybabies can.
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Agreed.

However, as already stated, such are already prohibited by statute.

Which brings us back to the recurring question;

So, what's your next rationalization of having 351 different standards for issuing an LTC?
Click to expand...
 
Pomeraniac said:
Words on a message board can't kill, but automobiles and guns in the hands of irresponsible, drunken, criminal crybabies can.
Click to expand...

I shall repeat the question. What other rights shall we take away from a person with a DUI?

Why would it be OK to give this person back his drivers license after a certain amount of punishment and withhold his right to keep and bear arms forever.

His crime was with a car, not a gun.

Perhaps everyone that has ever been under the influence of alcohol should lose their license to drive because they can kill, even though they didn't.
 
I did read on another site that a CWOF was not a conviction, but the Licensing Authority could use it as grounds for denial based on "suitable person" discretion. I am not a Lawyer, but I use them frequently, so do not take that as legal advise.

I love the blocking a medical facility one.. that is aimed squarely at the pro life crowd.. get 2 arrests for expressing your first amendment and 4th amendment rights and kiss a LTC goodbye.
 

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