Obama EO against gunsmiths

[esamjj]

Little by little piece by piece then the whole pie before the citizens know they have been duped. From now on ever crime will be reported as committed by an assault weapon.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

.

 

[richc]

How can a gunsmith manufacture something that, well, has already been manufactured???

 

[MAJoe]

If all you're looking to do is use a basement tool to fit a part that you then slide into a groove? Like using a mill file to fit a tritium sight in a dovetail?

No. Those kinds of things don't make you a "manufacturer" nor a "gunsmith."

I just wouldn't go around advertising those services for sale, of course.

That makes sense, thanks!

 

[browncoat]

How can a gunsmith manufacture something that, well, has already been manufactured???

How can putting a pistol buffer to your shoulder be manufacturing?

 

[glide]

A local engraver who dabbled firearms engraving just got a visit from the ATF and said to pony up for the license...or else. Or else what I don't know but they opted to just not deal with firearms anymore. Mission accomplished I suppose.

 

[bigblue]

Pony up for what license?

 

[mac1911]

Funny this is the secound Time I have heard ITAR... 1st time was a wile back when I was looking for Armalites Tech notes on their web site. I called to see where they went and they said ITAR regulations says they can not post information about their products... like maintenance and diagnose of common function problems.

boys and girls things are getting crazy... well looks like a lot of "gunsmiths" are going to add a ITAR/Manufacturing fee to our bills.

 

[not new guy]

This is starting to feel like a coordinated attack on 2A. Any other news trickling in from the other blue states on the national gun forums?

 

[tkepk181]

Does this mean that anyone who purchases a caliber exchange kit for any firearm and installs it is now a 'manufacturer'?? Or am I simply thinking to far into this?

 

[CaseHardened]

My gunsmith just called to let me know about the July 22nd EO from Obot, basically saying if you do anything more than simple replacement of parts you are a manufacturer and need to register as such along with a $2,250 fee. This would include threading barrels cutting dovetails

Basically anything involved, drilling shaping cutting...


https://www.nraila.org/articles/201...tration-releases-latest-executive-gun-control

Magic Marker on the Sights ?

Sorry, gotta go.

There's a Black Van parked outside, and I need to answer the DoorBell.

 

[Picton]

Does this mean that anyone who purchases a caliber exchange kit for any firearm and installs it is now a 'manufacturer'?? Or am I simply thinking to far into this?

DADT.

 

[Asaltweapon]

Anyone want to buy a Lathe.[sad2]

Dean

Package deal with a Bridgeport?

 

[scott-o]

We are all just lowly serfs in need of much guidance, Thanks Healey/Obama.

 

[Varmint]

Unbelievable. EOs are for the Executive branch of government only. The limitless ****ing arrogance of Democrats.

Wow, is Trump doing that well?

 

[just jim]

This is a tax to drive your gunsmith out of business. The feds will come through his business and look at what he does then declare it under ITAR. If he is lucky they won't charge him all the years of back taxes he didn't know he owed. Kinda like Mass and their 18 year old laws being updated, seeing a trend yet?

 

[Ben Cartwright SASS]

Here is a letter regarding this EO

from Keith Morgan, president of one of The West Virginia firearms rights organizations:

Here is the quote:

"I apologize in advance for a rare deviation from our "WV only" policy, as we feel it is imperative that we highlight a national issue. We must pass some critical information to WV gun owners, gunsmiths, and manufacturers.

President Obama has over-reached in a way that can, and if left to stand, will have a severe chilling effect on the exercise of our Second Amendment rights. And at present, based on our interpretation of a Department of State guidance letter http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?f=001JA6bx...eCNFMkc_I-SA==, many of us may be considered felons as this is typed.

Thus we must make you aware of this condition.

ITAR (International Traffic in Arms Regulations) strictly regulates the export of technology that can be used for military purposes. It is broad ranging and covers many things from encryption technology, through weapons systems and training of foreign nationals. The penalty for violating ITAR regulations is severe. It includes a one million dollar fine, and 20 years in prison.

Our interpretation of the guidance letter dated 7/22 (you can click above to read the actual document) is that anyone who drills and taps a scope mount, polishes a trigger, or modifies a firearm in any way that requires tools and improves the firearm's function or accuracy, could be prosecuted as a violation of ITAR.

Further, the definition of "automated" reloading is sufficiently vague that we believe individuals may be prosecuted for the use of a progressive reloader.

Also, it is critical to note that intent to export is not a factor in ITAR. Whether you intend to export an item out of the country or not, is completely irrelevant.

Put short, this guidance letter is an abomination and a massive executive over-reach.

The WVCDL is in touch with our national delegation, and we are doing what we can to help deal with this problem. At present, we have no action items for our membership. But please stay tuned, as that is subject to change. Regardless, the main purpose of this message is a notification of this change to gun owners, and especially gunsmiths within our membership and in West Virginia at large."

Again I apologize if you folks are already aware of this new directive from the federal government. But I wonder if there can be any connection? Both this directive and your AG's actions are overreach of the most blatant kind, and both will have a chilling effect on the free exercise of our constitutional rights, and both come at a critical time in the election cycle, at a time when we may or may not be vulnerable.

If you feel that this post is inappropriate for any reason, please let me know and I will remove it or delete the contents.

Edit: I have started a thread on this subject here: ITAR (International Traffic in Arms Regulations) Reinterpreted??? I have no wish to hijack the current thread, just wished to alert you folks to the situation.

 

[bullseye]

Is this part of his job creation plan, I I can only imagine how many this is going to put out of work. man I wish he would just FOAD.

Dean

Well, John Hinckley is available.

 

[mg42doc]

President Obama has over-reached in a way that can, and if left to stand, will have a severe chilling effect on the exercise of our Second Amendment rights. And at present, based on our interpretation of a Department of State guidance letter http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?f=001JA6bx...eCNFMkc_I-SA==, many of us may be considered felons as this is typed.

good golly this sounds familiar.,

 

[JDL]

This doesn't in any way stop you from gun-smiting your own guns, you can do anything to them even build your own guns as far as the Feds. are concerned. If you work on or charge or even work on someones gun and do not charge you need an FFL and to be safe you need an 07 FFL. This even includes refinishing or engraving even if all you are doing is painting or blueing gun parts. What is considered manufacturing is up to interpretation by the ATF this was always the gray area with this now it seems to be more defined.

 

[mibro]

This is starting to feel like a coordinated attack on 2A. Any other news trickling in from the other blue states on the national gun forums?

Yeah, they're desperate. This is all a coordinated Hail Mary Play by the outgoing 0bama Administration. They're hoping Killary will be elected but in case she isn't they're wreaking as much havoc as they can on the way out.

This is why Corporations have a security guy take your keys, watch you pack your sh!t in a box and then march you out the door. Unfortunately there is no-one to watch 0bama so he is deleting as much of the enterprise software as he can before the American people catch on.

 

[browncoat]

R majorities in house and Senate. They should be at least trying to do something about itar

 

[mibro]

R majorities in house and Senate. They should be at least trying to do something about itar

Under current leadership the Repubs are totally cucked. This is not your father's Republican Party.

 

[kevin9]

A local engraver who dabbled firearms engraving just got a visit from the ATF and said to pony up for the license...or else. Or else what I don't know but they opted to just not deal with firearms anymore. Mission accomplished I suppose.

This is not recent. The ATF ruled back in 2009 that engraving requires a dealer license, but not a manufacturer license.

Consistently the recent State Department letter on ITAR and gunsmithing indicates that engraving is not manufacturing and does not require ITAR registration:

1. Registration not Required – Not Manufacturing: ...
f) Cosmetic additions and alterations (including engraving) that do not improve the accuracy, caliber, or other aspects of firearm operation beyond its original capabilities;

 

[esamjj]

Any updates on this issue. I would think to entire US gunsmith community would be outraged.

 

[warwickben]

This effects small machine shops that don't have a FFl and have no idea about this .

If you brought a barrel to a machine shop to turn it down , they wouldn't need a FFl. Now they would need to pay itar .

 

[rivet_42]

The last time we saw this nonsense was during the Clinton administration when they put a lot of the "kitchen table FFLs" out of business. The guys who did a bit of gunsmithing at home for a few extra bucks. It pretty much limited FFL-01 licenses to people who were engaged in buying, selling, modifying, and repairing firearms as a principal means of earning their livelihood, and excluded people who were making a few extra bucks off of a hobby.

 

[not new guy]

The last time we saw this nonsense was during the Clinton administration when they put a lot of the "kitchen table FFLs" out of business. The guys who did a bit of gunsmithing at home for a few extra bucks. It pretty much limited FFL-01 licenses to people who were engaged in buying, selling, modifying, and repairing firearms as a principal means of earning their livelihood, and excluded people who were making a few extra bucks off of a hobby.

A move that we're still stuck with a couple of decades later.

 

[firestorm]

R majorities in house and Senate. They should be at least trying to do something about itar

That might be just the thing they are trying to force. If they force the congress or senate to do something, they can then use their control of media and spin it as out of control republicans trying to make it easier for terrorists to get their hands on military technology.

 

[browncoat]

That might be just the thing they are trying to force. If they force the congress or senate to do something, they can then use their control of media and spin it as out of control republicans trying to make it easier for terrorists to get their hands on military technology.

Terrorist groups are literally handed munitions by state actors. Anybody who thinks ITAR changes that needs to cut down on the koolaid

Having said that, you may be right