National Concealed Carry Reciprocity Bill Drawn Up for Next Congress

I'll add another, different negative to Rob's point.

A universal license standard where Congress sets the minimum. If we give the feds the power to regulate what minimum must be met for reciprocity outright, the antis will use it to destroy viable reciprocity the moment they get into power. We need to haul the federal government away from being the nanny. The minimum will too soon be 400 hours of training, $500 fee per year, fingerprints and (who knows?) DNA registration or whatever "Gun REAL-ID" will require, annual qualification with each firearm you want to use and a $200 fee per firearm registered on testing.

Better to have them pass a law making it a civil rights offense for states and their agents to violate - with regard to carry - the Privileges and Immunities Clause (Article IV, Section 2, Clause 1 - "The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States." Historically held to prevent a state from discriminating against people from out of state with regard to basic rights - a basic right is what the right to carry stands just one Supreme Court case away from being recognized as; it is the next big case, almost certainly (Neither McD nor Heller quite went all the way there).). Wait for it, guys. We aren't going to get a better law out of Congress than the 2nd Amendment itself under Supreme Court precedent regarding carry is going to provide. Even if the Court still permits very controlled licensing like MI, MA, and NY, states without any kind of reciprocity or general non-res permit like NY will still have the issue be subject to the P&I clause, and will (a very fast trip to fed court later) be ordered to open up reciprocity or an actual avenue to non-res permits that isn't more burdensome than their own residents have. Same with IL, and so on. The slow route results in lasting change. The fast route will eventually guarantee a standard that is as hard on gun owners as they can get in short order.

And after that, we can expect to see cases addressing the very restrictions Rob talks about - as constitutional matters.
 
I'll add another, different negative to Rob's point.
I still prefer to see national reciprocity, since I would rather carry in most places in NY rather than none.

Back to my point - look at the Michigan law. In the old days, it was "may issue" (generally connected people), and had few restrictions or limitations. When Michigan passed a "shall issue" CCW law, it came with a laundry list of "permit not valid zones" that absolutely dwarfs those of MA.
And after that, we can expect to see cases addressing the very restrictions Rob talks about - as constitutional matters.
SCOTUS has already provided states with a root password regarding restrictions - just call a local a "sensitive place".
 
I still prefer to see national reciprocity, since I would rather carry in most places in NY rather than none.

Back to my point - look at the Michigan law. In the old days, it was "may issue" (generally connected people), and had few restrictions or limitations. When Michigan passed a "shall issue" CCW law, it came with a laundry list of "permit not valid zones" that absolutely dwarfs those of MA.
We will have carry recognized as a right within 5 years and a P&I case within a year or two after that. That's the outside numbers.

I'd rather impatience not subject the rest of us to some Dem-sponsored 2021 amendment making MA-style licensing a requirement for reciprocity as a "thank you" for national reciprocity today when we can get there in a few more years for the long haul.
 
We will have carry recognized as a right within 5 years and a P&I case within a year or two after that. That's the outside numbers.

I'd rather impatience not subject the rest of us to some Dem-sponsored 2021 amendment making MA-style licensing a requirement for reciprocity as a "thank you" for national reciprocity today when we can get there in a few more years for the long haul.

I hope so.

I am reminded of Cheryl Jacques comments regarding gay rights - "I'll take a win on this any way I can get it".
 
I hope so.

I am reminded of Cheryl Jacques comments regarding gay rights - "I'll take a win on this any way I can get it".

Thats pretty much how I feel on this, pushing this forward gains us ground, and none of the proposals create any sort of national license or even federal control of the standards, just forcing them to recognize other states licenses. The other side can, when they are in power, possibly repeal it. But that repeal will take a lot more political capital than just leaving things as is. Plus, hopefully by that time we will have it enshrined as a right under the second amendment and it will quickly become a nonissue.
 
I still prefer to see national reciprocity, since I would rather carry in most places in NY rather than none.

I still think even if passed NY, NJ, etc, would poison pill the piss out of the capabilities unless the federal law forces a standard of capabilities, but something would still likely be better than nothing... might at least stop motorists from getting rustled with guns in their car, that kind of BS, etc.

If we get federal reciprocity, we can expect an increase in states moving to regulate and limit the extent of that carry to protect the important people from the unimportant ones.

Yeah, but I think this will only happen in the like half dozen shithole stronghold states. MA could be saved from this problem though due to political imcompetence, lol.

-Mike
 
Fellow gun owner just brought up interesting question in a chat.. We were discussing the news report that Paul Ryan was doing his best to squash the reciprocity bill....Friend says "No problem. Then Trump will just executive order it, the same way effin Obama executive ordered effin everything and..." (etc etc).
I replied that I wasn't sure The President could do that (forced reciprocity) cuz "states rights" etc, but then we both decided "Let's ask the NES advisory committee their opinion on this"....
Could Trump EO nationwide reciprocity??
 
Not in any way that would stick, and even if he tried (Doubtful) the courts would be in session waiting for any of the anti AG's (CA, HI) to serve something up for the 9th circus to kill.
 
Not in any way that would stick, and even if he tried (Doubtful) the courts would be in session waiting for any of the anti AG's (CA, HI) to serve something up for the 9th circus to kill.

Also, the next Liberal POTUS could easily undo it and there goes national reciprocity. I can't believe I'm saying it, but a law is likely the best way.
 
Can't some judge in Texas just declare reciprocity the law of the land since looney 9th circuit judges have no problem making nationwide rulings in blatant disregard of established limits of judicial jurisdiction? Make the #resistance in the judiciary see two can play the game, so cut the shit.
 
So whats the status of this? Last I heard it was stalled, which doesn't look good to me. Think it's dead in the water?
 
This is all I could find for info that is about 3 weeks old:

Introduced by U.S. Rep. Richard Hudson, R-NC, on the first day of session in the new House, the bill now enjoys the support of Hudson and 199 co-sponsors from 42 states. The bill is largely Republican, with three Democrats crossing the aisle, and is currently one of the top 10 most-viewed bills in Congress.

“Your driver’s license works in every state, so why doesn’t your concealed carry permit?” says a backgrounder on the bill circulated by Hudson’s office. “Just like your privilege to drive, your Second Amendment right does not disappear when you cross state lines. However, conflicting state codes have created a confusing patchwork of reciprocity agreements for concealed carry permit holders.”

Hudson’s bill would amend federal law to allow those eligible to possess a firearm to have a concealed handgun in any state that allows individuals to carry a pistol or revolver. Those who do so would have to carry a valid permit with them as well as a photo ID. The bill also applies to nonresident permit holders.

A companion measure, U.S. Sen. John Cornyn’s S.446, has 37 co-sponsors, all Republican.



http://www.guns.com/2017/06/22/nati...ocity-bill-picks-up-200th-supporter-in-house/
 
IANAL but my understanding of executive order sister that they can only modify the existing law and whether to adhere to the letter of the law or ignore part or all of said law. Laws and regulations are the job of the legislators in our case the Senate and house of Representatives.
 
Anything that is pro gun that the Pres signs is a double win by staying solid on his campaign promises and watching dems head's explode .
 
The Second Amendment is not a states rights issue or a federal rights issue. The Second Amendment is the right of the people.

That sounds great but Maura Healey and whole bunch of left wing extremists don't agree with you. Sometimes these whack jobs have to dragged into court kicking and screaming.
 
Is it possible to prosecute politicians and their appointees as traitors if their actions are against the constitution?

I would think so ...they do swear to protect and defend. This again politicians and most .gov seem pretty good at making sure it's very tough to to punish them for not doing their job.
 
Unless there is direct punishment for all those that disreguard the carry Bill what's to stop states from just ignoring it like so many other laws,regs,bills.
 
Unless there is direct punishment for all those that disreguard the carry Bill what's to stop states from just ignoring it like so many other laws,regs,bills.

Kind of like MA and others with our Marijuana laws..

Drugs are illegal because those in law enforcement make a living off enforcing such laws.
Like officers, the DA's, the judges and the prison workers...

Just think of how much money we spend to try to slow down the availability of them?

If that money was put into early education and programs in the cities. They would actually help prevent people from becoming users. Which are the real problem!
 
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Unless there is direct punishment for all those that disreguard the carry Bill what's to stop states from just ignoring it like so many other laws,regs,bills.

Kind of like MA and others with our Marijuana laws..

Drugs are illegal because those in law enforcement make a living off enforcing such laws.
Like officers, the DA's, the judges and the prison workers...

Just think of how much money we spend to try to slow down the availability of them?

If that money was put into early education and programs in the cities. They would actually help prevent people from becoming users. Which are the real problem!

Fantastic Post! 100% agree!
 
I have a beef with LEOSA. It creates a class of citizens that is better than the rest of us.

I know many cops, and most are not "gun guys", meaning they do the minimum to qualify, but do much less than most on this forum. So they should be allowed to carry, but not us?

However, I agree with your comment about amending the act to include the rest of us.


Yes as I agree with what you just said , and why is it just ok for LEO' s in Ma. To be able to purchase both hand guns and rifles for there personal use that we can not buy ?
 
Unless there is direct punishment for all those that disreguard the carry Bill what's to stop states from just ignoring it like so many other laws,regs,bills.
They will ignore it in the field, but even the marsupial courts of NY and NJ will be hard pressed to convict someone for a legal activity. Expect harassment like "We will detain you and file a report until the ADA verifies your permit was in good standing when we picked you up, and by the way, you are welcome to pay your lawyer for a few more hours if you want to try to get your gun back".

That sucks, but is nothing like hearing "I got you a great deal - plead guilty to third degree attempted possession of a weapon, be a federal PP for life, and we'll call things even on the retainer of $20K you paid me to make this go away".
 
They will ignore it in the field, but even the marsupial courts of NY and NJ will be hard pressed to convict someone for a legal activity. Expect harassment like "We will detain you and file a report until the ADA verifies your permit was in good standing when we picked you up, and by the way, you are welcome to pay your lawyer for a few more hours if you want to try to get your gun back".

That sucks, but is nothing like hearing "I got you a great deal - plead guilty to third degree attempted possession of a weapon, be a federal PP for life, and we'll call things even on the retainer of $20K you paid me to make this go away".

The effect will be the same though, deterrence of a lawful activity.
 
That sucks, but is nothing like hearing "I got you a great deal - plead guilty to third degree attempted possession of a weapon, be a federal PP for life, and we'll call things even on the retainer of $20K you paid me to make this go away".

Ands thats usually followed but "but if you wanna press it and go to court, that'll be another 20k because i already told the DA id get you to take the deal and i dont want to look stupid unless im paid more for it"

When you hear somthing like this with your life on the line its enough to make you physical ill
 
Ands thats usually followed but "but if you wanna press it and go to court, that'll be another 20k because i already told the DA id get you to take the deal and i dont want to look stupid unless im paid more for it"
You forgot "and the court will punish you severely for not taking the deal if you lose. Remember, OJ would have been out years ago if he took the deal he was offered."
 
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