Fooped,
Read this thread from the top, go to the SKS websites, etc. A wealth of info on cleaning them up.
Read this thread from the top, go to the SKS websites, etc. A wealth of info on cleaning them up.
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My Yugo SKS Has Arrived
- Thread starter tele_mark
- Start date
Fooped
Resident HK Guru
Milsurps,
How much would you charge (if you have the time) to clean the gun for me. After having done quite a bit more research on various cleaning methods, I've realized that I simply don't have the time/patience/desire to make this happen, and no matter what the situation is, when I get frustrated during a project like this, I start damaging stuff by rushing or being unsure of how a certain component or group disassembles/reassembles. I know me very well and I'll end up missing something and the gun won't fire properly, or I'll end end breaking something, and not bothering with the gun after all. I honestly would just rather pay an experienced individual to do the work, and end up with a nice gun that's safe and shoots well. The funny thing is, I paid extra for this gun because it was already "clean", but the person that sold it to me never said anything about the firing pin "slam-fire" thing. Being relatively new to the hobby, I'm used to my other guns that are basically "load and shoot", and never realized that there could be such a preperation process just to get a gun ready for the range. It all makes sense to me after I read it, I just don't think I can pull it off. Taking apart and cleaning my Glock is one thing, but this is another... Not trying to sing the "poor me" song, I've just been down this road in the past... Would you have interest?
How much would you charge (if you have the time) to clean the gun for me. After having done quite a bit more research on various cleaning methods, I've realized that I simply don't have the time/patience/desire to make this happen, and no matter what the situation is, when I get frustrated during a project like this, I start damaging stuff by rushing or being unsure of how a certain component or group disassembles/reassembles. I know me very well and I'll end up missing something and the gun won't fire properly, or I'll end end breaking something, and not bothering with the gun after all. I honestly would just rather pay an experienced individual to do the work, and end up with a nice gun that's safe and shoots well. The funny thing is, I paid extra for this gun because it was already "clean", but the person that sold it to me never said anything about the firing pin "slam-fire" thing. Being relatively new to the hobby, I'm used to my other guns that are basically "load and shoot", and never realized that there could be such a preperation process just to get a gun ready for the range. It all makes sense to me after I read it, I just don't think I can pull it off. Taking apart and cleaning my Glock is one thing, but this is another... Not trying to sing the "poor me" song, I've just been down this road in the past... Would you have interest?
I'd like to help you out and would do it for free because I love working on rifles and enjoy helping folks here, but have to say no for the simple fact that if the rifle should malfunction in any way be it ammo, a bad part, etc. I would actually be liable for any misshaps/injury you might receive. I'm not a certified and insured gunsmith, just someone who loves and knows these old rifles.
If you can strip down a Glock and clean it, the SKS is within your skills. It just sounds like a lot of work because I go into detail to tell people here about certain things i've seen be dirty on these rifles. You should do like Len said and read the link at surplusrifle.com on SKS disasembly. If it seems overwhelming, do one thing per night like say take apart and clean the bolt tonight, clean out the gas tube tomorrow night, etc. etc.
The site owner (Jamie) goes into great detail and explains everything with step by step pictures. Its where I learned everything I know about milsurp weapons as far as take down and re-assembly.
The best part about cleaning and stripping down your own rifle is that you yourself know how it works and can trouble shoot some problems you could encounter during a range trip. Plus it gives you a sense of satisfaction knowing you did the job yourself and can do it again if need be, it makes it more YOUR rifle.
I have a Hakim still sitting in my safe with the tag on it. Its been there for a month now and hasn't been shot because I haven't taken the time to strip it down, check the parts, and make sure everything is clean and working properly. I know squat about the rifle, but have looked at a few disasembly pages on sites and now feel I can confidently check it out and do it right. The SKS was the same way at one time for me since it was my first semi auto rifle. I used to be like you and even asked Carl when I bought it years ago about having their on site guy clean it up for me, but i'm glad I did it myself. Thats one thing about collecting and shooting military surplus rifles, you need to understand them and know how they work inside and out including proper cleaning because years ago when these were designed they weren't fool proof and were meant for killing, not plinking cans at 50 yards like a Ruger 10/22.
If you can strip down a Glock and clean it, the SKS is within your skills. It just sounds like a lot of work because I go into detail to tell people here about certain things i've seen be dirty on these rifles. You should do like Len said and read the link at surplusrifle.com on SKS disasembly. If it seems overwhelming, do one thing per night like say take apart and clean the bolt tonight, clean out the gas tube tomorrow night, etc. etc.
The site owner (Jamie) goes into great detail and explains everything with step by step pictures. Its where I learned everything I know about milsurp weapons as far as take down and re-assembly.
The best part about cleaning and stripping down your own rifle is that you yourself know how it works and can trouble shoot some problems you could encounter during a range trip. Plus it gives you a sense of satisfaction knowing you did the job yourself and can do it again if need be, it makes it more YOUR rifle.
I have a Hakim still sitting in my safe with the tag on it. Its been there for a month now and hasn't been shot because I haven't taken the time to strip it down, check the parts, and make sure everything is clean and working properly. I know squat about the rifle, but have looked at a few disasembly pages on sites and now feel I can confidently check it out and do it right. The SKS was the same way at one time for me since it was my first semi auto rifle. I used to be like you and even asked Carl when I bought it years ago about having their on site guy clean it up for me, but i'm glad I did it myself. Thats one thing about collecting and shooting military surplus rifles, you need to understand them and know how they work inside and out including proper cleaning because years ago when these were designed they weren't fool proof and were meant for killing, not plinking cans at 50 yards like a Ruger 10/22.
Fooped
Resident HK Guru
Milsurps,
Thanks for taking the time to answer my request. Much as what you say makes sense, I just don't have the time or desire to mess around with the rifle, so it either gets cleaned professionally, sits in my safe or gets sold. I just know that I won't take the time needed to learn the finer points of the rifle, to clean and spec it properly. I can entirely appreciate the fact that you don't want to get involved due to the potential liabilities, but do you know any professional gunsmiths that could legally do what I need done? Once again, not trying to look good advice horse in the mouth, but I just don't want to get involved in this particular project.
Thanks for taking the time to answer my request. Much as what you say makes sense, I just don't have the time or desire to mess around with the rifle, so it either gets cleaned professionally, sits in my safe or gets sold. I just know that I won't take the time needed to learn the finer points of the rifle, to clean and spec it properly. I can entirely appreciate the fact that you don't want to get involved due to the potential liabilities, but do you know any professional gunsmiths that could legally do what I need done? Once again, not trying to look good advice horse in the mouth, but I just don't want to get involved in this particular project.
This thing is easy Fooped! This is my first center fire rifle,my first gas operated,and my first c&r. It was designed so that some scared shitless farmboy from the Ukraine with the IQ of a bowl of borsch could break it down and maintain it in the field under stress. I spent all of 10 minutes scanning the surplus rifle web page to get the sequence right and broke it down with little difficulty. When I put it back together, I didn't have any spare parts left over.
If you are dead set on having someone else do it, try asking Carl at Four Seasons. He was the one who told me about a gut they have there that degreases and checks out milsurp rifles. You probably won't have as long of a wait as you would if you took it to a smith's shop too.
Fooped
Resident HK Guru
Thanks for all the advice! I don't have a problem taking the rifle apart and reassembling it (I've done that ten times already), it's the messy job of cleaning it that I don't want to fool around with, and then making sure that it's running properly. On a side note what did you you use to remove the top handgrip from it's metal ring? I tried for over an hour to get that pin out, and ultimately destroyed the entire ring assembly trying to get it out. it never came out and I ended up having to bend that metal collar to get the wood piece out. I was taking it out to put in the T-6 tapco stock, until I realized that they are not Mass compliant, and put the factory stock back on. I of course, still cannot get the pin out to put the factory top hand grip back on, and thus the plastic top grip is still in place. I never would have bought one of these guns if I knew what a pain they were. I suppose it stands to reason given how old they are, but the wealth of mis-information I was given at the gun show where I bought it ended up costing me a significant amount of time and money (I have an 80 T-6 Tapco stock I can't use, and a 30 round mag that apparently is not Federally legal without playing the "10 or less" game.) This all adds to my not being interested in fooling around with the gun any further. Most of this info I got from various SKS boards, including Survivor, which seems to be right on. Milsurp and Co., how do you weigh in on the stock/mag issue, as well as how to get that accursed top grip pin out?
Got out to North Leominster today to try out the SKS. I brought some Norinco ammo I bought today at State Line which chrono'd around 2400fps. The rifle performed beautifully. I loaded singles and shot the first few with the gas off, then in semi auto to verify operation before loading up with a stripper. 30 rounds total, perfect operation.
Here's the pictures of the targets. Be gentle -- this is the first time in my life I fired a centerfire rifle, and something like 1987 since I last shot a rimfire rifle.
20 rounds from 50 yards:
10 rounds from 100 yards. I was happy to get anything on the paper. I only had a cheap pair of binoculars, so I had no idea what I was doing:
Here's the pictures of the targets. Be gentle -- this is the first time in my life I fired a centerfire rifle, and something like 1987 since I last shot a rimfire rifle.
20 rounds from 50 yards:
10 rounds from 100 yards. I was happy to get anything on the paper. I only had a cheap pair of binoculars, so I had no idea what I was doing:
BillK said:Ex Member, I got sick of hearing when I was gonna start to shoot skeet. (jk)![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
But you can meet me at the gate and I can be the guest....lol
Yeah, that seems to be the thing to do down there. But, the good part is, more often than not, I own the entire pistol and rifle ranges. Everyone else is up front shooting pidgeons out of the air.
Fooped said:
I've only used one stock and i'm glad I chose it over all the others, and thats a Choate stock. They're miles above the competition in quality.
As for the %#@*&! pin, I know what you mean.
![[sad]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/004.gif "Sad [sad]")
Those pins are often tapered and ground at the thinner end making removal the most toughest thing to do. After several attempts with a punch and hammer, I wound up drilling the face of the pin off and using the one included with the Choate upper hand guard and peening that one over from the other end. Most folks wind up buying an aftermarket handguard already done, and now I know why. Surplusrifle.com mentioned that and I thought to myself... how hard can it be to remove the pin???
As for after market high cap magazines, I wouldn't even bother. I heard most feed like crap and don't fit right withought stock modifications, etc. If you want a rifle you can modify and not have to worry about cleaning, grab a Romanian AK47. Its more $$$ than an SKS but the gadgets and parts you can add are numerous plus its already high cap and you don't have to worry about cleaning them, pretty much ever.
Fooped
Resident HK Guru
Milsurps,
I very much appreciate all your time and knowledge, and seeing that super cool stock renews my interest in the gun! Can it be installed legally without playing the "10 or less" game? If so, how do I prove it's legality? Everything I've read gives me the notion that ANY mod to the gun voids it's C+R status, thusly making it a "non-importable gun". If I can legally install that stock, and replace the top grip with a built grip, please direct me to where I can buy both parts! Whoooohooo! Half the reason why I bought the T-6 stock is because the factory stock is so short (my face is about an inch away from the rear sight BEFORE the recoil!). Does the top grip come with the ring assembly already pinned on? Also, can you legally install one of those bolt covers with the weaver rail on it for a scope, or would you recommend a top grip sight mount because of the way the brass ejects?
You and the other nice folks that answered my "new-guy" questions have really helped! Hope to you see you all at the shoot on the 20th!
I very much appreciate all your time and knowledge, and seeing that super cool stock renews my interest in the gun! Can it be installed legally without playing the "10 or less" game? If so, how do I prove it's legality? Everything I've read gives me the notion that ANY mod to the gun voids it's C+R status, thusly making it a "non-importable gun". If I can legally install that stock, and replace the top grip with a built grip, please direct me to where I can buy both parts! Whoooohooo! Half the reason why I bought the T-6 stock is because the factory stock is so short (my face is about an inch away from the rear sight BEFORE the recoil!). Does the top grip come with the ring assembly already pinned on? Also, can you legally install one of those bolt covers with the weaver rail on it for a scope, or would you recommend a top grip sight mount because of the way the brass ejects?
You and the other nice folks that answered my "new-guy" questions have really helped! Hope to you see you all at the shoot on the 20th!
I'm not sure about the legality issue when it comes to C&R guns and new accessories. Someone in the gun laws forum will be able to chime in on that. I got this Chinese one pictured before my C&R and already had plans on the stock, plus nothing is permanent, it can all be switched back at any time.
People buy C&R eligible barreled actions all the time so I don't see what diference it makes on the rifle itself when it comes to what kind of stock it has.
The top handguard has to have the pin removed and a new one that came with the stock installed. But like I mentioned, you can get replacement handguards with gas tube assembly already done, just make sure they'll fit your particular rifle because some SKS models have diferent lengths when it comes to gas tubes. Best thing about that stock is the length of pull is customizable with rubber inserts, and a removable cheek piece increases, or decreases depending on if you use it, your cheek weld when you use the rifle.
Do a search on the net for Choate SKS stocks and a few dealers will come up. There are diferent colors and styles.
I think mine came from Combat Stocks.
Edit note: I shoud mention that the rifle I chose to add that stock to is a Chinese Norinco SKS that is not C&R eligible. I picked it up for $160 at a gun show a while back because the bayonet lug was ground off. This is a rifle i'm planning on mounting a side rail drill and tap scope mount on and chose it for its accuracy out of all my SKS rifles. I know there was some discussion here a while back about modifying C&R rifles/pistols and some concern over laws.
IMO, and this is just going by what should be common sense (but we all know about the ATF and common sense![[rolleyes]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/042.gif "Roll Eyes [rolleyes]")
) any alterations done to a C&R firearm that you purchase, as long as they don't involve adding restricted items like bayonet lugs, supressors, threaded barrels, etc. should be ok as long as thy keep that firearm legal within Massachusetts laws.
I really wish I was studious enough to look up such laws and say if my ideology was correct because i've seen this topic of altering C&R guns come up a few times, but i'm not. I'm still like Luke Skywalker in the bogs with Yoda on my back teaching me the ways of the Jedi Knight (in this case Massachusetts gun owner) but i'm learning, and this is the best place to do so.![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
People buy C&R eligible barreled actions all the time so I don't see what diference it makes on the rifle itself when it comes to what kind of stock it has.
The top handguard has to have the pin removed and a new one that came with the stock installed. But like I mentioned, you can get replacement handguards with gas tube assembly already done, just make sure they'll fit your particular rifle because some SKS models have diferent lengths when it comes to gas tubes. Best thing about that stock is the length of pull is customizable with rubber inserts, and a removable cheek piece increases, or decreases depending on if you use it, your cheek weld when you use the rifle.
Do a search on the net for Choate SKS stocks and a few dealers will come up. There are diferent colors and styles.
I think mine came from Combat Stocks.
Edit note: I shoud mention that the rifle I chose to add that stock to is a Chinese Norinco SKS that is not C&R eligible. I picked it up for $160 at a gun show a while back because the bayonet lug was ground off. This is a rifle i'm planning on mounting a side rail drill and tap scope mount on and chose it for its accuracy out of all my SKS rifles. I know there was some discussion here a while back about modifying C&R rifles/pistols and some concern over laws.
IMO, and this is just going by what should be common sense (but we all know about the ATF and common sense
) any alterations done to a C&R firearm that you purchase, as long as they don't involve adding restricted items like bayonet lugs, supressors, threaded barrels, etc. should be ok as long as thy keep that firearm legal within Massachusetts laws. I really wish I was studious enough to look up such laws and say if my ideology was correct because i've seen this topic of altering C&R guns come up a few times, but i'm not. I'm still like Luke Skywalker in the bogs with Yoda on my back teaching me the ways of the Jedi Knight (in this case Massachusetts gun owner) but i'm learning, and this is the best place to do so.
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Fooped
Resident HK Guru
It is done!![[grin]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/041.gif "Grin [grin]")
After your supportive words finally sank in, myself and a good buddy of mine (also an NES member), bought a pantload of brake cleaner, rags, buckets etc., and went to town! The gun looks fantastic, and everything seems to move freely with no binding. We took your advice, and did a full disassembly all the way down to the bolt/firing pin group, and I polished the firing pin with a steel wool as well. As long as the rain holds out tomorrow, my SKS will be at the range ready to go!
Thanks again for all of your help, and hope to see you at the shoot!
Greg
After your supportive words finally sank in, myself and a good buddy of mine (also an NES member), bought a pantload of brake cleaner, rags, buckets etc., and went to town! The gun looks fantastic, and everything seems to move freely with no binding. We took your advice, and did a full disassembly all the way down to the bolt/firing pin group, and I polished the firing pin with a steel wool as well. As long as the rain holds out tomorrow, my SKS will be at the range ready to go!Thanks again for all of your help, and hope to see you at the shoot!
Greg
Glad to hear you dove right in and cleaned it right. You won't have to perform such a tedious cleaning again until after you've put a thousand or so rounds through the rifle. But at least now you have a full understanding of how the rifle and its moving parts work.
The only problems i've ever had with an SKS rifle was not cleaning the gunk out of the bolt and having 3 rounds go full auto on me, and fiddling with the gas shut off on a YUGO SKS. Even then they are both quick and easy fixes because everything needed to work on the rifle including the bolt, is in the butt stock in the cleaning and tool kit. As far as fiddling with the gas valve... I noticed many times if I didn't have it open when firing that first shot, I had to unload the rifle, close the bolt, and click the valve a few times to free it up. That was probably due to cosmolene inside the button spring that I never cleaned out and it gummed up the release. I never cleaned it out because I didn't know how it came apart until I read the gas valve replacement article on surplusrifle. But still, a minor inconvenience for a rifle thats so cheap and fun to shoot.
Just always remember before you fire to make sure the valve is kicked over so the grenade launching site can't be raised, thats the open position. And use military amunition like Russian made Wolf, Golden Tiger, or any other foreign stuff. Modern USA comercial ammo like Winchester, Remington is intended for bolt action rifles in this caliber and has a primer thats softer than military grade primers. Had a few rounds of American Eagle 7.62x39 go full auto in a Chinese SKS one day, now the rest of that box sits in the bottom of my ammo crate until I find someone with a bolt action that can use it.
I won't be attending the shoot, but let me know how the gun shoots for you.
The only problems i've ever had with an SKS rifle was not cleaning the gunk out of the bolt and having 3 rounds go full auto on me, and fiddling with the gas shut off on a YUGO SKS. Even then they are both quick and easy fixes because everything needed to work on the rifle including the bolt, is in the butt stock in the cleaning and tool kit. As far as fiddling with the gas valve... I noticed many times if I didn't have it open when firing that first shot, I had to unload the rifle, close the bolt, and click the valve a few times to free it up. That was probably due to cosmolene inside the button spring that I never cleaned out and it gummed up the release. I never cleaned it out because I didn't know how it came apart until I read the gas valve replacement article on surplusrifle. But still, a minor inconvenience for a rifle thats so cheap and fun to shoot.
Just always remember before you fire to make sure the valve is kicked over so the grenade launching site can't be raised, thats the open position. And use military amunition like Russian made Wolf, Golden Tiger, or any other foreign stuff. Modern USA comercial ammo like Winchester, Remington is intended for bolt action rifles in this caliber and has a primer thats softer than military grade primers. Had a few rounds of American Eagle 7.62x39 go full auto in a Chinese SKS one day, now the rest of that box sits in the bottom of my ammo crate until I find someone with a bolt action that can use it.
I won't be attending the shoot, but let me know how the gun shoots for you.
Enjoy the Yugo Greg! It's a Fine shooter.
I use WD40 myself for Milsurps. The wood is wrapped in paper towels & goes in a black trash bag for sun baking. It leeches out the cosmo nicely.
Murphy's soap after that.
I use WD40 myself for Milsurps. The wood is wrapped in paper towels & goes in a black trash bag for sun baking. It leeches out the cosmo nicely.
Murphy's soap after that.
I brought the SKS to the range Tuesday and fired off 40 rounds to test out the new Murrray's spring loaded firing pin, and everything was fine.
Question on zeroing the SKS -- I shot 20 rounds at a B-24 target at 100 yards from bench rest, and was pretty pleased that all 20 hit paper. However, all were grouped in a vertical line to the right of the 10 ring, so I'm guessing I need to do a windage adjustment. I'm going to send off for an SKS sight adjustment tool, but what distance do I use to zero the sights? I've looked a bit, and some say 25 yards, others 100 yards. One person says to avoid 50 yards.
Question on zeroing the SKS -- I shot 20 rounds at a B-24 target at 100 yards from bench rest, and was pretty pleased that all 20 hit paper. However, all were grouped in a vertical line to the right of the 10 ring, so I'm guessing I need to do a windage adjustment. I'm going to send off for an SKS sight adjustment tool, but what distance do I use to zero the sights? I've looked a bit, and some say 25 yards, others 100 yards. One person says to avoid 50 yards.
tele_mark said:
I'd say it depends on what distance you plan on shooting it at the most. I have some guns that are dead on at 50 yards but I can't group at all with em at 100. When it comes to my SKS rifles, I have them all set where I can hit consistently at 100 yards, then when I shoot at 50 the groups just tighten up better.
Remember, cheap battle rifle, not target. Sure there are some SKS rifles out there that can shoot great and very accurate at 100 yards and beyond but for the most part if you can keep all 10 shots in a 12" target, thats good enough and more than adequate for what the rifle was intended to do. Now if you want to squeeze out a little more accuarcy, trigger jobs like the ones Kivaari does ( http://www.kivaari.com/ ) and maybe a better stock is in order. Myself, I enjoy the 10 shot "good enough" sometimes "damn good" groups mine deliver.
![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
Hi Milsurp -- so you set your SKS's for 100 yards? I thinks mine's close, but I'm enough of a beginner at this that I can't tell how much of these results is operator error. Here's the target from 100 yards -- I'm assuming that because all 20 shot grouped to the right horizontally, that my sight picture must be on and the rifle needs a bit of a windage tweak. It's hard to tell -- to me, the site picture on a target at 100 yards is unbelievably puny. The one low show in the 7 ring I think was the one shot I decided to take free hand using the sling, I wrote that shot off because the site picture was oscillating so badly, and was surprised to find all 20 holes in the target. Also -- those 3 shots in the tight group -- is that the actual accuracy of the rifle, where I happened to shoot 3 with perfect sight alignment, or dumb luck? Oh, this was one magazine of Norinco, and one magazine of Brown Bear ammo.
I guess what I'm wondering, do you have to zero the rifle at the longest distance you plan to shoot it, or can you do it at a shorter distance, like 25 yards, where you can get some precision to concentrate on aligning the sights versus just hitting the target.
I guess what I'm wondering, do you have to zero the rifle at the longest distance you plan to shoot it, or can you do it at a shorter distance, like 25 yards, where you can get some precision to concentrate on aligning the sights versus just hitting the target.
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If it were me i'd start at 50 yards and see where and how I shoot, then move on to 100 yards and compare the two targets. I shoot 10 rounds, check them off with a magic marker, then shoot 10 more if i'm shooting diferent ammo so I know which one performed better. The sight adjuster tools are easy to use and pretty cheap. Order from a company that ships fast like Midway and try and get your hands on some Golden Tiger Russian ammo. Definitely tops in my SKS rifles.
As for the target... i'd say a sight adjustment is in order, but if you plan on shooting at shorter distances most of the time, wait and see how you do there first. The 3 shots could be from two diferent ammo types so its hard to tell if its a tight 3 round group.
As for the target... i'd say a sight adjustment is in order, but if you plan on shooting at shorter distances most of the time, wait and see how you do there first. The 3 shots could be from two diferent ammo types so its hard to tell if its a tight 3 round group.
