Mauser P-08 Luger: byf 42 "Black Widow" (shooter)

USMA-82 · Mar 1, 2011

The title says it all. This is a gun I put on layaway at KTP and finally paid off. It is mostly matching (last two digits of the 4-digit serial number are stamped on most parts), but has a replacement barrel, and has been re-blued. I also suspect the rear of the toggle which has a more purple hue than the rest of the components. The gun came with a reproduction holster and two aftermarket mags, and is considered a "shooter" rather than a collectible.

One trip so far to the range has been very promising - good groups on our 50-ft indoor range. I will be experimenting with different ammo and magazine combo's to see what she'll do. Even after 70 years, still a marvel of engineering.

Enjoy!

daltrey99 · Mar 1, 2011

She's a good looking shooter. I have fun shooting the Luger shooters that I have. Enjoy it.

JuergenG · Mar 2, 2011

Nice early 1942 shooter! Would you have a detailed pic of the underside of the barrel ?

USMA-82 · Mar 2, 2011

JuergenG said:
Nice early 1942 shooter! Would you have a detailed pic of the underside of the barrel ?

That's the thing, Juergen - the underside is absolutely empty. No sign of numbers being buffed away at all. That's why I'm thinking it's a replacement. Were they ever NOT stamped?

40 caliber · Mar 2, 2011

Purists may call it a "shooter" but I would love to have that one for my collection!!
We can't all spend $2K+ to add a pistol in the collection!

Very nice!

JuergenG · Mar 2, 2011

USMA-82 said:
That's the thing, Juergen - the underside is absolutely empty. No sign of numbers being buffed away at all. That's why I'm thinking it's a replacement. Were they ever NOT stamped?

Nope. In the last blocks of byf 1942 they didn't stamp the actual diameter any longer, but still the serial.
Even the VoPo Lugers' barrels are stamped, so yours is very likely a later replacement.
Who cares, as long as she is a mixmaster anyway and shoots great ?

TTA89 · Mar 2, 2011

I shot my 41 BYF Luger for the 1st time on Sunday. They are awesome!

JuergenG · Mar 2, 2011

There's quite a bunch of Luger addicts here [smile]

SKS Ray · Mar 2, 2011

Great finish on that gun still.

Karl · Mar 3, 2011

JuergenG said:
There's quite a bunch of Luger addicts here

+1 There's something about showing up at the range with a Luger.... My "shooter" is a 1939 S/42 RC that's all matching except for the side plate and the magazine.

Maninblue1861 · Mar 3, 2011

to be a true black widow, needs the black plastic grips.

USMA-82 · Mar 3, 2011

Maninblue1861 said:
to be a true black widow, needs the black plastic grips.

It does, actually. The pictures make them look a little brown, but they're black.

Maninblue1861 · Mar 3, 2011

but they are wood grips. blackwidow term came from the black bakelight grips used on the 41-42 byf lugers, along with the black base fxo marked magazines like this one.

USMA-82 · Mar 3, 2011

Mine appear to be black plastic. Definitely not wood - and likely repro's.

I see what you mean by the picture, though. There is a border that is missing on mine.

Maninblue1861 · Mar 3, 2011

Theres an acurate set of repro black widow grips on ebay from time to time for 20 bucks. the originals, last pair I saw for sale, went for over $250. The proper black based fxo waa135 mags even go for $200+. I gave up collecting them, as they became way too pricey in the last 10 years. Any byf lugers a good one.

Matt

45collector · Mar 7, 2011

Maninblue1861 said:
but they are wood grips. blackwidow term came from the black bakelight grips used on the 41-42 byf lugers, along with the black base fxo marked magazines like this one.

Niiiiiice. I want.

I have a repro set of black plastic grips for my '41 byf, but I prefer the original woods. Mine has plenty of blue wear, but all parts match and its mechanically sound. I do shoot it once in a while but its one of the most historically signifigant guns in my collection so I consider it a "shooter/collector".

6hold · Mar 10, 2011

~ Digging out the old German artifact . . .

USMA-82 said:
One trip so far to the range has been very promising - good groups on our 50-ft indoor range. I will be experimenting with different ammo and magazine combo's to see what she'll do. Even after 70 years, still a marvel of engineering.

USMA-82, that’s a fine looking Luger, thanks for sharing the photos and info. You and a few others out here have put me to thinking. I bought a Luger a few decades ago when no one wanted to buy it because it didn’t have “all matching numbers”. I didn’t care I just wanted a Luger of my own and as long as it operated well I went for it. I paid the handsome sum of $150 for it after trying it out and have been proud as a peacock to have it in my possession ever since.

I only fired it once more in the last thirty years or so because of the fear of breaking a part that I wouldn’t be able to replace. What the hell good is it doing me sitting locked away when I should be enjoying it every so often? I think most any part for the Luger can be had nowadays, if not they could be made I believe (never checked!)

With your post about your new acquisition it kind of gave me a boot in the butt to get my cherished German artifact out and enjoy it.

> > > > > (Just funnin with ya folks, that’s not my Luger!)

JuergenG · Mar 10, 2011

OK, now we want to see your $ 150 Luger and drool over it.

Maninblue1861 · Mar 10, 2011

ugh that pic makes me want to shed a tear. what a waste of a good black widow.....

6hold · Mar 11, 2011

~ Greetings to Bundesrepublik Deutschland . . .

JuergenG said:
OK, now we want to see your $ 150 Luger and drool over it.

JuergenG, I hardly believe you'll do any drooling over my Luger, after seeing some of the jewels you have shown on here. I'd be happy if you'd muster up a hearty yawn after seeing my run of the mill shooter!

I'll take some photos today and hope to have them up before the end of the day for you and all to give a gander. It might be Saturday before I get them up seeing that I'm known to work at glacial speed. I would appreciate your expertise on a few things about the Luger and also a holster and helmet that i have garnered through the years. Do you have knowledge on the Luger holsters or German helmets? I thought that they may have been reproductions but the more I investigate the more I think they have a good chance of being original . . . at least I can hope!

6hold · Mar 11, 2011

~ Link to article . . .

Maninblue1861 said:
ugh that pic makes me want to shed a tear. what a waste of a good black widow.....

Maninblue1861, I feel your pain . . . you can read the short article about that particular Luger at the link below:

######################################

German Luger dug up in city center building site by English man:
Pistol dates from 1943.

Written by Tactical-Life.com.

http://www.tactical-life.com/online...ish-man-pistol-dates-from-1943/?right=related

Maninblue1861 · Mar 11, 2011

I dont think its 43 dated. Far as i know last lugers came off the assembly was in 42, followed by p38 from 43-45.

I know of a stash of 50 mint lugers all consecutive numbered byf 42 that were smuggled home by a logistics officer in wwii that reside in MT. far as i know they are the closest to the end production block of guns ive seen. Still trying to get my Self on the will for them

JuergenG · Mar 11, 2011

The last official production of P.08's was in late summer/early fall of 1942.
The P.38 had been intruduced into service already in 1940, with Mauser joining
the production in 1942.

Hard to believe there is a stash of 50 consecutive numbered byf 42 P.08's out there.
Civilian Mauser Banner 42's maybe, but byf 42? I'd believe it when I see and
handle each and every one of them. The highest serial reported up to date is
3800n IIRC.

@6hold
I'm far from being an expert but may be able to say a word or two about Luger pistols.
Same applies to my knowledge of holsters, but I don't know zilch about helmets.

daltrey99 · Mar 11, 2011

The French actually built post war Lugers between 1945 and 1947 in the Mauser factory.

JuergenG · Mar 11, 2011

Right, and they carry French markings *.
Made by the French or by Mauser workers under French supervision ? I'd think the latter.

45collector · Mar 15, 2011

Maninblue1861 said:
I know of a stash of 50 mint lugers all consecutive numbered byf 42 that were smuggled home by a logistics officer in wwii that reside in MT. far as i know they are the closest to the end production block of guns ive seen. Still trying to get my Self on the will for them

Pictures or it never happened!

Maninblue1861 · Mar 15, 2011

lol ill work on the next trip to see the extended family out there in MT. i remember seeing them close to 22 years ago.

45collector · Mar 18, 2011

If I saw, in person, a nice big happy family of 50 mint consecutive numbered WWII P08's, my friggin' head would explode.

Maninblue1861 · Mar 18, 2011

LOL back then I was 12, and didnt know much or care much about them, but I vividly remember seeing them (if I remember the box had 60 4 rows of 15 with the top row missing, gave some away to friends ect), and being told the story by my late grandfathers brother who lived next door (4 miles down the road). I havent talked to anyone out there in a few years, im hoping the guy is still kicking around, and even more so that crate with its contents are still intact.Number was approx 50 +/- a few.

Kurtz · Mar 18, 2011

That's a beauty!

Mauser P-08 Luger: byf 42 "Black Widow" (shooter)

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