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MA Resident with LTC owns weekend home in RI. Can I legally posses gun in RI?

Discussion in 'Rhode Island Laws' started by MPK61, Sep 7, 2009.

  1. MPK61

    MPK61

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    In this scenario, I'm a Mass resident and I own a weekend home in RI. I have an unrestricted LTC-A in MA. Can I legally transport a gun, say secured in a trunk, to my RI house and have it legally available to me for protection while on my property? I searched the forums, but all I've found is laws for transporting through RI. Nothing about owning property in the state as a non resident. Also do you think owning the RI property would make it easier to get a non resident CCW?

    Thanks.
     
  2. plumber

    plumber

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    What town?

    Without a RI permit, you may transport locked up in the trunk to your weekend home. We do not require a licence to buy or possess, only to physicaly carry.
     
  3. RKG

    RKG NES Member

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    Can you provide statutory cite for second sentence?
     
  4. plumber

    plumber

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    RIGL 11-47 must be read in its entirety to understand the whole firearms act. But per 11-47-9 that covers licenced activities. The only licenced activity is carrying a pistol in public. For witch you would need to be lcenced per 11-47-11 or 11-47-18.
    In this case what you are looking for is the absence of statute. I need no licence or permit to buy a firearm or ammo, nor to possess it on property I possess.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2009
  5. plumber

    plumber

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  6. RKG

    RKG NES Member

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    I am not licensed to practice law in Rhode Island, but on the face of 11-47-8, it would seem to preclude a person who lacks a RI-issued license from carrying an unloaded pistol in the trunk of a vehicle to a destination in RI. Which is why your sentence caught my eye.
     
  7. Rob Boudrie

    Rob Boudrie NES Member

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    RKG - Scrivener is licensed in RI. Since you attorneys always call each brother, you may wish to ask him at the next family reunion :)

    The answer all depends on what RI considers "carry" (and no, I do not know the answer). In MA, any transport involving movement, including locked in the trunk of the car is considered "carry". In much of the civilized world, having a handgun in the trunk of your car is "possession" or "transport", and "carry" means "carried on one's person". So, to answer the question, one must learn how RI defines "carry" and the expression "carry in the trunk" is oxymoronic in many non-MA juridsictions.
     
  8. plumber

    plumber

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    Sir, you just hit the nail on the head. Describing RI gun laws to a subject of the PRofMass can be fun because of all the restrictions y'all are used to. Same in reverse, I often scratch my head in awe when I read tha MA laws section and am glad I don't live there, also makes me want to stop bitching about RI. Back on topic, RI defines carry as to be on your person, or in a vehicle readily available to you ( not unloaded and not locked up)
     
  9. RI_John

    RI_John

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    If you do not have a CCW license in RI you're only allowed to have a handgun, unloaded, and locked up in your vehicle for a limited number of reasons.

    SECTION 11-47-8 provides one exception:
    Section SECTION 11-47-9 prescribes some more exceptions:

    SECTION 11-47-10 basically repeats much of section 11-47-9
     
  10. plumber

    plumber

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    Exactly, so in the case of the OP, he is within the law.
     
  11. RKG

    RKG NES Member

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    Maybe yes; maybe not. As I said, I am not licensed in the State of Rhode Island, but in most states, "place of business" does not mean "place of employment," and "residence" means the place where you reside, not your abode (and OP stipulated he was not a resident of RI). Nor did OP stipulate that when driving to the RI summer home, he was starting at his "place of business" (as opposed, for instance, to starting from his MA home). Absent some clarification from a RI court, I'd be hesitant in relying on the quoted statutes for the situation posed by the OP.
     
  12. plumber

    plumber

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    "No person shall, without a license or permit issued as provided in §§ 11-47-11, 11-47-12 and 11-47-18, carry a pistol or revolver in any vehicle or conveyance on or about his or her person whether visible or concealed, except in his or her dwelling house or place of business or on land possessed by him or her"

    I am not an attorney, I am just a 'firearms enthusiest' who just about memorized 11-47, and has disscused these statutes with attorneys at length.
    I do believe the words in bold are what we are looking for. On your person, in the trunk unloaded and secure is not on your person. Land possessed by him or her, does your vacation home not qualify?
     
  13. plumber

    plumber

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    I am not an attorney at all, so you've got one up on me. Your point is well taken and I agree 100%. Place of business means you own the place, residence is not as clear. If you have but one home tbs is defined, you can have more than one residence, but a weekend home is not your residence. The statute also makes referance to 'dwelling place' I assume that is the same as 'residence'. What I believe covers him is property possessed by him or her.
     
  14. dwarven1

    dwarven1 Appleseed Instructor Dealer NES Member

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    Then why do you think you know the laws better than the guys who have to live under them?
     
  15. MPK61

    MPK61

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    Thanks for all of the replies. Look like I might be OK. Which is where I started. I guess my next step is to go to the Local Chief Of Police (Gloucester/Chepachet) and see what he has to say. Maybe I can talk him to a Non Resident CCW.
     
  16. plumber

    plumber

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    DO NOT GO TO THE POLICE STATION!!!

    You will just leave frustrated. Write the Glouster police chief a short polite letter stating that as a Glouster tax payer, you wish to apply for a pistol permit through him via 11-47-11. Keep it short and to the point. As I don't believe Glouster is currently following the law, you will most likley receive a reply that "we don't do that here, you must apply through the AG". If you get that response, PM me, you have some options. If you get an application let me know, I can qualify you unless you know of an NRA pistol instructor.
     
  17. jdubois

    jdubois

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    You were missing a word.
     
  18. plumber

    plumber

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    You were missing a word.

    $&@! Youre right, must have somehow clipped it when I highlighted the other words. A good reason to verify the statutes, read them yourself so you may know them.
     
  19. RKG

    RKG NES Member

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    Good question. Not entirely sure of the answer, but it may be influenced by: (i) not knowing anything about those folks' legal knowledge, (ii) being able to read English, and (iii) being sensitive to terms that, when used in a statute, usually (but certainly not always) have a specialized meaning (such as "place of business").

    However, my intent in writing anything was not to state what the RI law is, but rather to raise a caution about interpretations that were not easy to square with the words of the statute. The only legal advice I was offer the OP (or any other Rhode Islander, full- or part-time) would be to consult competent RI counsel.
     
  20. terraformer

    terraformer NES Member

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    Spoken like a lawyer... Oh wait! [grin]
     
  21. plumber

    plumber

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    Could not agree more.

    In RI place of business means the business premises YOU OWN. Residence and dwelling place mean your legal residence. However, RI also includes "property posessed by him or her"
    The Internet is not an attorney, there is no replacement. But some common sence and some reading does go a long way. That's why I posted the RI Firearms Act. So all can read for themselves. The problem in RI is not many attorneys are versed in 11-47, nor is there much case law. Most folks have the same level of understanding of the law after they are read. RI is not tricky of confusing like Mass or other states. But, when in doubt consult an attorney.
     
  22. RI_John

    RI_John

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    which is why I didn't offer a legal opinion and merely quoted the relevant statutes. I don't know the answer to the question. Neither do the police. I would wager that it would be a coin toss whether an LEO would be even marginally familiar with the relevant statutes and how to interpret them. The statute language is sloppy and ambiguous in RI. I always err on the side of not becoming a test case here.
     

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