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MA deer shotgun season

pupchow said:
In 4S, I'm not seeing the rubs I typically see. Maybe 10%. Scat in the usual places but very sparse. The last half hour today, I tried a fawn bleat to see if a bear would come in. A doe started blasting at me and circled around behind. She hung out in a thicket 30 yards behind me. The banter between us went on for 20 minutes. I tried using snort-wheeze and stomps, to see if something else would show. Nope. But she just stayed put. I couldn't take it anymore and had to get up and leave.
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I did a dark to dark in Ashby last week. First time there, beautiful woods. Same signs in there. Scat all over but nothing fresh, a handful of old rubs, and an eery lack of wildlife overall. No rabbits, no squirrels, no turkey. All that unmolested land and almost nothing to show of it.
 
rogerk said:
I did a dark to dark in Ashby last week. First time there, beautiful woods. Same signs in there. Scat all over but nothing fresh, a handful of old rubs, and an eery lack of wildlife overall. No rabbits, no squirrels, no turkey. All that unmolested land and almost nothing to show of it.
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Just because you didn't see any rabbit squirrel or turkey for a day doesn't mean they aren't there at all. I hunt small game in different patches of woods alot..... i hunt small game more than deer.......im probably in the woods more field days than the majority of deer hunters! Ive been out in a patch of woods where squirrels and Wildlife were so active it was insane......come back the next weekend and swear everything died....like nothing moving no wildlife sounds....not even song birds....dead quiet. Some weather patterns just make the wildlife stay put. One day of quiet doesn't mean the property is mismanaged.
 
whacko said:
Just because you didn't see any rabbit squirrel or turkey for a day doesn't mean they aren't there at all. I hunt small game in different patches of woods alot..... i hunt small game more than deer.......im probably in the woods more field days than the majority of deer hunters! Ive been out in a patch of woods where squirrels and Wildlife were so active it was insane......come back the next weekend and swear everything died....like nothing moving no wildlife sounds....not even song birds....dead quiet. Some weather patterns just make the wildlife stay put. One day of quiet doesn't mean the property is mismanaged.
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While I do see Turkeys a fair amount and hear them. If you can't kill a Turkey in North Central, you aren't much of a hunter.

Around me there is very little small game like squirrels, grouse, and rabbits etc. Too many predators like Woodsloafer said. Turkeys mostly avoid them because they roost up high. Other animals get slaughtered...including deer.

Rabbits were on the upswing last year, haven't seen many this year.

When I go out....the woods almost every time is totally quiet and devoid of small game in my area of Z5. Lot of overly mature stands of forest, which is dead land really for wildlife. Oaks aren't producing, and clusters of pines and stuff around them are taking too much of the nutrients to get good acorns. Not nearly enough edge cover.

My dad's area in South Central.....less land but more of it is better suited to wildlife and the patchwork of development has pushed deer into smaller woodlots. I really should deer hunt around there but it seems silly to me as I like to walk out of my house and hunt. If I really cared about killing a deer I would.
 
MP-3pt-12-2-23.jpg

Got my 3 pointer on Saturday @7:20AM....only other deer I saw was on opening day (deer/shotgun) @3PM.... I finished processing the deer today...and will hunt again tomorrow AM! BTW: I thought my shot was high..but at 10 yards sitting HIGH in a tree...the hole in the side might have been a bit high...but it took off the top 1/3 of his heart.

Good luck guys!
 
Mark from MA said:
Who the hell uses as shotgun out where we live?
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IK,R? 3 shots in the heat with a 10/22 is sufficient.

www.wcvb.com

Brothers shot deer from truck, illegally killed fox in Mass., state police say

Investigators are now working to determine whether the siblings are habitual poachers responsible for several illegal hunts over the last two years.
www.wcvb.com www.wcvb.com

peterk123 said:
It's rough reading about the state of deer hunting in mass. As crowded as it is there, I thought that years ago mass did an excellent job of managing the herd. I would tag out every year during bow season. But I agree with many of your comments. I hang around on a local hunting forum and I've noticed the harvest is down.

As for dog walkers. I always hated them. And I own and love dogs. I would never bring my dog into the woods during the season. Now if, they paid a user fee than it's a different story. But they don't. They never ever should be off leash though. That to me is hunter and wildlife harassment. In many states off leash dogs on public land is considered a form of wildlife harassment. So, you can shoot the dog. I have no issue with that.

One of the worst things in the woods is the spandex wearing 30 something with her three off leash dogs running wild. I came across one here in Montana while hunting grouse. The dogs come barking and bolting toward me. A kindly told the woman she should leash her dogs because people are hunting in here and some will not be as tolerant as me and will shoot her dogs. I get to the parking area and notice out of state plates on her vehicle. Shocking. So even starting to deal with it here. Fortunately, they don't go in far enough to become a real bother and the acreage of public here is considered small if its under 100k acres.
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First, MA COULD manage the western part of the state deer herd. It's simple. Cut back on permits. Go to a zoned permit system and NO permits for a year or three west of the 413 or even 495. Shocking what a few years of NO hunters will do for the stocks. Look at Striper fishing in the Northeast. It went from pitiful to WOW in just a relatively short time as soon as they buttoned up the limits and sizes from Mary-land to Maine. (IIRC, the Chessy didn't have any real restrictions for years. They were effectively poaching our fish.)

But no one wants this either. They just want deer to magically appear tomorrow. So our choice is a few years of crappy tag distribution OR a decades of lower and lower deer #'s until 413 hunters STOP hunting deer and there #'s return. Our grandkids might get some good hunting out of that.


As far as going into the woods during hunting season - the woods are for us all. I'm NOT a dog owner and I'm an outdoorsman. But that land was made for you and me. (I should write a song!) Pay??? Nah. I'll have them NOT pay, thank you. I won't restrict their movements - because that will get them to want to pay and then THEY get a seat at the table. But make them pay? Bad bad bad idea. The unintended consequences of the non-hunting community funding wildlife is massive. Super-massive.

Bottom line - the "woods" are for us all. But I do appreciate your off-leash comments. Not a fan of off-leash folks.
 
Dennis in MA said:
First, MA COULD manage the western part of the state deer herd. It's simple. Cut back on permits. Go to a zoned permit system and NO permits for a year or three west of the 413 or even 495. Shocking what a few years of NO hunters will do for the stocks. Look at Striper fishing in the Northeast. It went from pitiful to WOW in just a relatively short time as soon as they buttoned up the limits and sizes from Mary-land to Maine. (IIRC, the Chessy didn't have any real restrictions for years. They were effectively poaching our fish.)
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We already have a zoned doe permit system. The “anyzone doe tages” from the eastern part of the state are an issue out here.
We need to stop the print your own tag nonsense and go back to state issued single use tags. Like the Tavel tags that were used in Connecticut. It’s pretty difficult to catch a poacher if they can print their own tags to bring them home with. I would gladly pay more for real tags.

The first step is for DFW to admit there is a problem and do an arial FLIR deer surveying Jan/Feb to see what the population actually is.


Dennis in MA said:
Bottom line - the "woods" are for us all. But I do appreciate your off-leash comments. Not a fan of off-leash folks.
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This.
It’s public land. Open to all, first come first serve. IMG_0470.jpeg
 
Unfortunately no hunting for me this year, as I'm waiting on knee surgery from a work injury. I did head out to CT public land Sunday to retrieve a two cameras I put out prior to my injury. Probably wasn't the best thing for my knee, but psychologically it was what I needed, just to get out in the woods. Pouring rain, I took it nice and easy and coming back out from retrieving Camera #2 I did a little scouting for possible tree stand locations next year. Pretty much walked right up on a doe that I didn't see as I was looking up and out. She was bedded down under a bush, gets up and we have the old staring contest for about 30 seconds. She couldn't have been more than 20 feet away! She eventually turned and sauntered off, no huge rush to get away. Scouted another area totally seperate from that and found plenty of fresh sign. Again, it was nice to just get out in the woods, without mucking shit up for anyone hunting.
 
kerryman71 said:
Unfortunately no hunting for me this year, as I'm waiting on knee surgery from a work injury. I did head out to CT public land Sunday to retrieve a two cameras I put out prior to my injury. Probably wasn't the best thing for my knee, but psychologically it was what I needed, just to get out in the woods. Pouring rain, I took it nice and easy and coming back out from retrieving Camera #2 I did a little scouting for possible tree stand locations next year. Pretty much walked right up on a doe that I didn't see as I was looking up and out. She was bedded down under a bush, gets up and we have the old staring contest for about 30 seconds. She couldn't have been more than 20 feet away! She eventually turned and sauntered off, no huge rush to get away. Scouted another area totally seperate from that and found plenty of fresh sign. Again, it was nice to just get out in the woods, without mucking shit up for anyone hunting.
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Hopefully you have a complete and speedy recovery. No deer is worth blowing out your knee before surgery. No sense making it worse.
 
HorizontalHunter said:
We already have a zoned doe permit system. The “anyzone doe tages” from the eastern part of the state are an issue out here.
We need to stop the print your own tag nonsense and go back to state issued single use tags. Like the Tavel tags that were used in Connecticut. It’s pretty difficult to catch a poacher if they can print their own tags to bring them home with. I would gladly pay more for real tags.

The first step is for DFW to admit there is a problem and do an arial FLIR deer surveying Jan/Feb to see what the population actually is.




This.
It’s public land. Open to all, first come first serve. View attachment 824916
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I was impressed with nh system.....live check all season and they put a metal seal on your deer when you check it. But this season they went to mostly online check in which will encourage some taking of does from the northern zones just like ma**h***s do in the western zones with zone 10 tags.

Nh really had a better system till they went online check this season. You get a fire arm deer tag.....and each zone has "any deer" and "antlered only" days. Zones with high populations get more any deer days. Simple. And forcing a.live check in makes it less likely that someone would poach a deer up north cuz if your pulling into the check station with a doe your f***ed.....you can't just print a tag from another zone and use it. Sure they could make a 100 mile drive south and check it in a southern zone but at least there is more of a deterrent.

I think mass should go live check in only and go to any deer and antlered only day system like nh.
 
I do like the convenience online registering offers. However, I’d enjoy the camaraderie around a check station even more.

I’ve avoided this Pandora’s box so far by not harvesting anything
 
HorizontalHunter said:
We already have a zoned doe permit system. The “anyzone doe tages” from the eastern part of the state are an issue out here.
We need to stop the print your own tag nonsense and go back to state issued single use tags. Like the Tavel tags that were used in Connecticut. It’s pretty difficult to catch a poacher if they can print their own tags to bring them home with. I would gladly pay more for real tags.

The first step is for DFW to admit there is a problem and do an arial FLIR deer surveying Jan/Feb to see what the population actually is.




This.
It’s public land. Open to all, first come first serve. View attachment 824916
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Arial or FLIR surveys in winter, with real results on state land. Don't doctor them or whatever because the insurance companies lobby you to. Likely around me.....less than 5 deer per mile on state land would be the result.

After you find out there is Ass population on state land.....put each state area by quota only or quota by permit only. Meaning......Barre Falls Area only gets 10 deer taken out of it as a goal, and they must be reported and checked. Then its closed to all hunting. Or.....assuming the success rate is 5%.....give out 200 permits for that area only and 10 deer taken should be the result give or take a few.

You can imagine for Wardens......this would be much easier to manage and catch poachers as well, as....if you don't have the Barre Falls permit, or the area is closed to deer hunting because the quota has been reached........Any dipshit in there with anything other than birdshot/bird gun in their truck.....will be a problem easy to solve.

Make smaller parcels of state land bowhunting only, with antler restrictions...focus these for quality deer......... Manage them similarly to above. Again....guns prohibited...easy to give citations.
If they get overpopulated.....quota doe permits till back in line.

One buck only will make hunters more selective, and Antler restrictions to older more mature hunters. Let kids be kids and shoot a doe or small buck one time.

In my opinion this would increase the deer pop on state land over time without an all out hunting ban. If all state land was managed this way the hunting would be much better on state land. This is the way a lot of other states do it. Some state land would actually be a destination to try for....like the Quabbin Park was this year.

Private land.......less control...but if certain averages say deer pop is down.....No doe permits in that general zone , til a rebound takes place.

MA should be managed Central/West for 30 deer a mile and you should be seeing deer in the fields now and then. It should not be a rare occurance.

Kill them all in eastern MA urban areas....you'll never do it because of Karen's land, Karen closing the town, Karen not allowing discharge, etc. Less active management other than all out slaughter is needed there.
 
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Mark from MA said:
Arial or FLIR surveys in winter, with real results on state land. Don't doctor them or whatever because the insurance companies lobby you to. Likely around me.....less than 5 deer per mile on state land would be the result.

After you find out there is Ass population on state land.....put each state area by quota only or quota by permit only. Meaning......Barre Falls Area only gets 10 deer taken out of it as a goal, and they must be reported and checked. Then its closed to all hunting. Or.....assuming the success rate is 5%.....give out 200 permits for that area only and 10 deer taken should be the result give or take a few. You can imagine for Wardens......this would be much easier to manage and catch poachers as well.

Make smaller parcels of state land bowhunting only....open to crossbows. Manage them similarly to above.

One buck only and Antler restrictions to older more mature hunters. Let kids be kids and shoot a doe or small buck one time.

If all state land was managed this way the hunting would be much better on state land. This is the way a lot of other states do it.

Private land.......less control...but if certain averages say deer pop is down.....No doe permits in that general zone , til a rebound takes place.

MA should be managed Central/West for 30 deer a mile and you should be seeing deer in the fields now and then. It should not be a rare occurance.

Kill them all in eastern MA urban areas....you'll never do it because of Karen's land, Karen closing the town, Karen not allowing discharge, etc. Less active management other than all out slaughter is needed there.
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Great Ideas and I agree with all of them but this is Massachusetts they don't care about good deer hunting they just rather there would be no hunting or no deer.
 
Sparkey said:
Great Ideas and I agree with all of them but this is Massachusetts they don't care about good deer hunting they just rather there would be no hunting or no deer.
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Fully agree....kill them all hunters will cease to go here is the goal.
 
HorizontalHunter said:
We already have a zoned doe permit system. The “anyzone doe tages” from the eastern part of the state are an issue out here.
We need to stop the print your own tag nonsense and go back to state issued single use tags. Like the Tavel tags that were used in Connecticut. It’s pretty difficult to catch a poacher if they can print their own tags to bring them home with. I would gladly pay more for real tags.

The first step is for DFW to admit there is a problem and do an arial FLIR deer surveying Jan/Feb to see what the population actually is.
Click to expand...

Close all deer hunting Zone 1-9. 2 years. Forget the special permits or reduced limits per zone. Just NO deer in those two zones. People will bitch. It's a no-win situation for F&W just like the federal mandates on fishery catches years ago were a no-win from commercial fishermen in the Northeast. Of course the Feds should have had bigger balls.

Fisherman: "You can't do that. I need that catch to keep my boat. You're gonna let me lose my boat?"

Fed: "Well, we've got a choice. You can lose your boat or we can lose the whole fishery. Which do you think we should pick? Which do you think the rest of the country will pick?"

(They did give compensation for those that left fishing, IIRC.)
 
Dennis in MA said:
Close all deer hunting Zone 1-9. 2 years. Forget the special permits or reduced limits per zone. Just NO deer in those two zones. People will bitch. It's a no-win situation for F&W just like the federal mandates on fishery catches years ago were a no-win from commercial fishermen in the Northeast. Of course the Feds should have had bigger balls.

Fisherman: "You can't do that. I need that catch to keep my boat. You're gonna let me lose my boat?"

Fed: "Well, we've got a choice. You can lose your boat or we can lose the whole fishery. Which do you think we should pick? Which do you think the rest of the country will pick?"

(They did give compensation for those that left fishing, IIRC.)
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That is just plain ignorant
 
Dennis in MA said:
Close all deer hunting Zone 1-9. 2 years. Forget the special permits or reduced limits per zone. Just NO deer in those two zones. People will bitch. It's a no-win situation for F&W just like the federal mandates on fishery catches years ago were a no-win from commercial fishermen in the Northeast. Of course the Feds should have had bigger balls.

Fisherman: "You can't do that. I need that catch to keep my boat. You're gonna let me lose my boat?"

Fed: "Well, we've got a choice. You can lose your boat or we can lose the whole fishery. Which do you think we should pick? Which do you think the rest of the country will pick?"

(They did give compensation for those that left fishing, IIRC.)
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More than half the state? Aren't poachers gonna poach regardless? The antis would love that. You would never get it re-opened again as they would take it to court to stop it from ever being re-opened.
 
Need to get rid of more predators, looks like this coyote is carrying a deer leg (not sure what else it would be with that length) for breakfast this morning.

21432.jpeg
 
RDG said:
can't seem to find a deer of my own to kill but I managed to find this dead head.
I did bring it home to try doing a euro mount on it.
any tips or suggestions.

View attachment 827206
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I would just boil mine in a pot of water and washing soda. The meat comes off easier and it whitens the bone. Just get as much of the big stuff off as you can first. If you dont have washing soda you can make it by baking, baking soda in the oven at like 350 for a while. Ur just turning sodium bicarbonate into sodium carbonate.
 
ace7644 said:
I would just boil mine in a pot of water and washing soda. The meat comes off easier and it whitens the bone. Just get as much of the big stuff off as you can first. If you dont have washing soda you can make it by baking, baking soda in the oven at like 350 for a while. Ur just turning sodium bicarbonate into sodium carbonate.
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Boil too hard or too long and the cartilage breaks down.
The handle on a Homer bucket makes a good hook to get the brains out. Just cut it in half and straighten it out.
 
Someone got a doe around 7:30 behind my house. BOOM! It was too light to be a buck. Unless he was a dumb buck. (YOU DUMB BUCK! LOL)



And ignert - exactly what the commercial cod fishermen said 30 years ago. What's the cod stock in the waters off of New England now? Zero? I think the catch per boat is 1. One fish. Per boat.

Again, the alternative is that you keep hunting your asses off, extending the season. In a decade, there will be so few deer that no one will hunt anymore. About 30 years later, there will be a massive overabundance of deer because not only does no one hunt anymore, there is no tradition of hunting. A fraction of the fractional-hunters we have now.

So if you're under. . . .30, go for the extended season. By the time you retire, you'll be up to your waist in deer. Over 30 - you probably should consider some sort of cut-back to restock the herd.
 
Dennis in MA said:
Someone got a doe around 7:30 behind my house. BOOM! It was too light to be a buck. Unless he was a dumb buck. (YOU DUMB BUCK! LOL)



And ignert - exactly what the commercial cod fishermen said 30 years ago. What's the cod stock in the waters off of New England now? Zero? I think the catch per boat is 1. One fish. Per boat.

Again, the alternative is that you keep hunting your asses off, extending the season. In a decade, there will be so few deer that no one will hunt anymore. About 30 years later, there will be a massive overabundance of deer because not only does no one hunt anymore, there is no tradition of hunting. A fraction of the fractional-hunters we have now.

So if you're under. . . .30, go for the extended season. By the time you retire, you'll be up to your waist in deer. Over 30 - you probably should consider some sort of cut-back to restock the herd.
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Pretty much. All you have to do is look at the Quabbin boom-bust cycle of deer management to see exactly that cycle. The Prescott segment was pretty dismal this year. When I asked the biologist how it was going she didn’t give me a number she just said: “Less than we hoped but at least everyone is having fun.”

I guess that at the end of the day it doesn’t matter much for me. I don’t have kids and my hunting days are numbered. It’s a shame for sure.
 
It seems to me, I just saw something about starting the season here in Western MA earlier so it aligns with the Eastern MA season. That's definitely not going to help build numbers out here. I'll try to find where I saw that.
 
deerdad said:
It seems to me, I just saw something about starting the season here in Western MA earlier so it aligns with the Eastern MA season. That's definitely not going to help build numbers out here. I'll try to find where I saw that.
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That's true, Zones 1 - 9 will start archery two weeks sooner than it has in the past beginning in 2024.
 
Mark from MA said:
Who the hell uses as shotgun out where we live?
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As opposed to what? Black powder or archery? Shotgun is the only other choice. Oh, and crossbow.

kerryman71 said:
That's true, Zones 1 - 9 will start archery two weeks sooner than it has in the past beginning in 2024.
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I don't know why they need so many different zones. West of 495 to Connecticut River could be one or two zones, then West of the Connecticut River could be another one or two.
 

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