Is this an OK way to transport/store long guns?

[Prepper]

If you put a cable lock through the receiver, then have the gun zipped up in a cloth gun case (the kind that is shaped like a gun, has a zipper along the length of it, and a carry handle), is that OK for transport in a car? (My car is an SUV so it has no trunk, just the back area where I can cover it with a cloth.) How about for storage in a house?

I had previously thought that is OK (because the lock disables the gun) but I keep reading conflicting information on web sites (and we all know that everything on the Internet is highly accurate just because someone put it there). I saw a police department that said they must be in a hard case.

Just making sure I have all my ducks in a row! Thanks.

 

[Adam_MA]

Transportation laws...

G.L.c. 140, § 131C. Carrying of firearms in a vehicle.

(a) No person carrying a loaded firearm under a Class A license issued under section 131 or 131F shall carry the same in a vehicle unless such firearm while carried therein is under the direct control of such person. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

(b) No person carrying a firearm under a Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of $500.

(c) No person possessing a large capacity rifle or shotgun under a Class A or Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container. Whoever violates the provisions of this subsection shall be punished by a fine of not less than $500 nor more than $5,000.

(d) The provisions of this section shall not apply to (i) any officer, agent or employee of the, commonwealth or any state or the United States; (ii) any member of the military or other service of any state or of the United States; (iii) any duly authorized law enforcement officer, agent or employee of any municipality of the commonwealth; provided, however, that any such person described in clauses (i) to (iii), inclusive, is authorized by a competent authority to carry or possess the weapon so carried or possessed and is acting within the scope of his duties.

(e) A conviction of a violation of this section shall be reported forthwith by the court or magistrate to the licensing authority who shall immediately revoke the card or license of the person so convicted. No new such card or license may be issued to any such person until one year after the date of revocation.

Storage..

Section 131L. (a) It shall be unlawful to store or keep any firearm, rifle or shotgun including, but not limited to, large capacity weapons, or machine gun in any place unless such weapon is secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized user. For purposes of this section, such weapon shall not be deemed stored or kept if carried by or under the control of the owner or other lawfully authorized user.

It would appear that when in transport, you need a locked container. BTW, a padlock holding both zippers closed on a soft case would satisfy the letter of the law. For storage, either in a locked container OR equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock, or other safety device properly engaged so as to render the weapon inoperable. So, while a cable lock would satisfy the letter of the law, a secure case or cabinet would be the better choice.

 

[Len-2A Training]

PD is close.

Hi-Cap rifles/shotguns MUST be transported in a LOCKED CASE or LOCKED TRUNK! [Storage law is different and allows a cable lock.] Since the SUV has no locked trunk, it must be in a LOCKED CASE . . . hard or soft is not relevant.

LO-Cap rifles/shotguns could legally be transported in a visible gun rack with no cable lock or anything else . . . of course you'll get stopped by every cop that sees you and perhaps unjustly charged with illegal transport by someone who has no idea what they are looking at. So NOT recommended in spite of legality.

 

[Prepper]

A lock holding the zippers closed on a soft case is OK, but a lock through the receiver of the gun thus disabling it, and that all put in the same soft case, is not OK? The laws are dumb. A knife can easily cut a case but can't easily cut a lock too.

I guess I'll go get myself another hard case that I'll lock and bring with me. My wife's car has a trunk but she doesn't like me driving her car because then she has to drive my car and she doesn't like it.

NOTE: This "locked trunk" concept is rather strange. My previous car had a trunk but I would routinely access the trunk without even leaving the driver's seat. The CD changer was mounted in the trunk, so all I would do is tilt my driver's seat back, pull the tab on the rear seat to pull it down, and reach right into the trunk! It's hardly more secure that way. The back of my SUV may not lock, but it is impossible for me to reach from the driver's seat without parking, getting out and walking around to the back.

 

[Chris]

Len, a case is needed on a public way, even in the back window gun rack. (^_^)

 

[Len-2A Training]

Prepper, Do NOT look for logic in the laws!

If your car has a trunk that can be accessed from inside the car by simply "pulling a tab" (my old VW Rabbits and Acura Integra were like this), it is NOT considered a "locked trunk" for this purpose. If you need to use a key to open the trunk from inside, you are OK.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Len, a case is needed on a public way, even in the back window gun rack. (^_^)

Chris, Not according to Chief Glidden . . . unless he's had someone change his mind on this.

 

[rscalzo]

Without comment on the method of carry, I transport only in a rigid or semi-rigid case. I've had items get thrown on top of my firearms and want to avoid serious damage.

 

[Tater]

does anyone find it "odd" that the law makes it ok to have a cloth case with a cheesy suitcase lock through two zipers but a cable through receiver is not satisfactory???

 

[Len-2A Training]

If you ever met the people who wrote it, you'd fully understand!

 

[drgrant]

I also thought if you had a secure container the trigger lock pretty much
became irrelevant. I know trigger locks are irrelevant for transport and
only relevant for storage, so why bother using em at all?

-Mike

 

[Chopper]

Prepper, Do NOT look for logic in the laws!

If your car has a trunk that can be accessed from inside the car by simply "pulling a tab" (my old VW Rabbits and Acura Integra were like this), it is NOT considered a "locked trunk" for this purpose. If you need to use a key to open the trunk from inside, you are OK.

Is this fact or opinion? My trunk can be opened from inside the car. While transporting, my long guns are in unlocked cases with trigger or reciever locks. The car is locked if I have to pop into a store on the way. Should I change to the less secure way of locking a soft case? If this is fact maybe I should do both.

 

[Prepper]

Prepper, Do NOT look for logic in the laws!

If your car has a trunk that can be accessed from inside the car by simply "pulling a tab" (my old VW Rabbits and Acura Integra were like this), it is NOT considered a "locked trunk" for this purpose. If you need to use a key to open the trunk from inside, you are OK.

Wow! I had no idea. Are there ANY cars out there that have a trunk compartment that truly is locked from all sides? I've never seen any such thing. Does the trunk somehow have to be "locked" in order to prevent me from getting to my own gun quickly and shooting someone? If I were going to do that, I'd just have it loaded and right with me, which is apparently legal for a handgun anyway. I'm am truly amazed at the stupidity of some of these laws.

I only have one hard long gun case... I'll go buy another so I can bring two to the range at once. (My hand guns all came with hard cases so they're all set.)

 

[Chris]

Chris, Not according to Chief Glidden . . . unless he's had someone change his mind on this.

My error. The law does say "on his person".

Thanks Len.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Prepper, Do NOT look for logic in the laws!

If your car has a trunk that can be accessed from inside the car by simply "pulling a tab" (my old VW Rabbits and Acura Integra were like this), it is NOT considered a "locked trunk" for this purpose. If you need to use a key to open the trunk from inside, you are OK.

A person is currently being charged with "improper storage" for leaving his guns "locked in the trunk" whereby there is a trunk release inside the car (true in most cars today) AND he parked the car and failed to LOCK THE CAR!! The guns were stolen and when he reported the theft, he was arrested and charged.

What I stated has been told to me personally by Chief Ron Glidden (Chmn of the Gun Control Advisory Board) as the official position (or it might be in the law itself) of EOPS (might also be in a CMR). I'd say that "you can take it to the bank" or "take it to jail" depending on how you treat it.

Both my cars have trunk releases from inside the car and they can be locked so that they don't work (with the ignition key). The trunk release (flop down seats) from the back seat need the ignition key to work. Thus, the trunk is considered a locked container and I could throw the guns in there uncased/unlocked and be legal (dumb as they'd get damaged).

Is this fact or opinion? My trunk can be opened from inside the car. While transporting, my long guns are in unlocked cases with trigger or reciever locks. The car is locked if I have to pop into a store on the way. Should I change to the less secure way of locking a soft case? If this is fact maybe I should do both.

See the above!

 

[News Shooter]

Question

A person is currently being charged with "improper storage" for leaving his guns "locked in the trunk" whereby there is a trunk release inside the car (true in most cars today) AND he parked the car and failed to LOCK THE CAR!! The guns were stolen and when he reported the theft, he was arrested and charged.

What I stated has been told to me personally by Chief Ron Glidden (Chmn of the Gun Control Advisory Board) as the official position (or it might be in the law itself) of EOPS (might also be in a CMR). I'd say that "you can take it to the bank" or "take it to jail" depending on how you treat it.

Both my cars have trunk releases from inside the car and they can be locked so that they don't work (with the ignition key). The trunk release (flop down seats) from the back seat need the ignition key to work. Thus, the trunk is considered a locked container and I could throw the guns in there uncased/unlocked and be legal (dumb as they'd get damaged).



See the above!

Would he have been charged if he had locked the car doors?

I hate this state

 

[Coyote33]

My error. The law does say "on his person".

So far.

AN ACT relative to an unloaded rifle or shotgun

 

[cobblepot]

FOUND ON EOPS FAQ

Hi, I'm new here. I found this interesting and it can be found here:

Q: Do I need to lock my non-large capacity rifles and shotguns in a case while transporting them in a vehicle?

A: No. They must be transported unloaded, but are not required to be in a locked case while transporting.
top of the page

Q: Can I leave my gun in my car if I need to go into the store on my way home from the range or from hunting?

A: If your handgun or large capacity rifle or shotgun is transported in accordance with the provisions of M.G.L. c. 140, §131C (i.e. unloaded and in a locked case, locked trunk or other secure container) then the gun may be left unattended in the vehicle. Weapons transported in this manner will automatically be considered "stored or kept" in compliance with the safe storage requirements of §131L.

A person leaving a non-large capacity rifle or shotgun in an unattended vehicle is required to lock the rifle or shotgun in a case/container or in the trunk, or install a mechanical locking device on the weapon (i.e. cable or trigger lock).
top of the page

I also found this interesting: MGL

The term “large capacity weapon” shall be a secondary designation and shall apply to a weapon in addition to its primary designation as a firearm, rifle or shotgun and shall not include: (i) any weapon that was manufactured in or prior to the year 1899; (ii) any weapon that operates by manual bolt, pump, lever or slide action; (iii) any weapon that is a single-shot weapon;

So it seems a non-large capacity weapon just needs to be unloaded if transporting or needs a cable/trigger lock if left in the car.

Am I reading this right? I know the safe and easy answer is always "unloaded and in a locked case".

Also, is it wrong to have the ammo in the same locked case? Is a "loaded" magazine that is not in the gun the same as a loaded gun?

 

[drgrant]

A person is currently being charged with "improper storage" for leaving his guns "locked in the trunk" whereby there is a trunk release inside the car (true in most cars today) AND he parked the car and failed to LOCK THE CAR!! The guns were stolen and when he reported the theft, he was arrested and charged.

Course the question of the day is... would someone still get charged if the
thief came and broke a window, or pried the trunk open?

I have heard offhand stories of people getting sacked by the issuing
authority under "unsuitable person" for getting their guns stolen from a
vehicle, as well... so I'm guessing that even if you are compliant with the
law, the possibility still exists for your license to get hosed.

-Mike

 

[USMA-82]

Once you get this lock/unlocked, high-capacity/low-capacity, transport/storage thing worked out in your head, just remember two things:

1. Meeting the "minimum standards" of security for your guns does not help safeguard some VERY expensive investments

2. Even if you are perfectly legal in everything you do, if your chief decides it wasn't a wise move, you may be suddenly transformed into an "unsuitable person" and have your license put in jeopardy.

I know a certain attorney who not only locks his guns in a hard case, in a locked trunk - he runs a cable lock through the handles of each for triple security. A couple of extra seconds for you, a few frustrating extra minutes (or surrender) for a potential thief.

Ken

 

[Coyote33]

...I have heard offhand stories of people getting sacked by the issuing authority under "unsuitable person" for getting their guns stolen from a vehicle, as well...

I'm sorry, but I don't think I buy the second-hand story related second hand through the internet about this happening.

 

[drgrant]

I'm sorry, but I don't think I buy the second-hand story related second hand through the internet about this happening.

You can "not buy" it all you want- all I know is I've heard of this happening
on more than one occasion, and it certainly is plausible given the latitude
chiefs have in MA with licensing.

-Mike

 

[Scrivener]

You can "not buy" it all you want- all I know is I've heard of this happening on more than one occasion, and it certainly is plausible given the latitude chiefs have in MA with licensing.

I am aware of one such case; the cretin owner left the gun in an unlocked car.

The results were eminently foreseeable and the consequences equally predictable.

 

[Coyote33]

My mistake. I thought since we were talking about LOCKED vehicles, this is what drgrant meant. He never mentioned LOCKED, which I somehow created in my mind while reading it. I stand corrected (yet again). In the case of unlocked vehicles, it makes a lot more sense, since part of the law is that you must LOCK it up.

 

[drgrant]

My mistake. I thought since we were talking about LOCKED vehicles, this is what drgrant meant. He never mentioned LOCKED, which I somehow created in my mind while reading it. I stand corrected (yet again). In the case of unlocked vehicles, it makes a lot more sense, since part of the law is that you must LOCK it up.

Yeah, but even given that, a douche anti type chief could still declare someone
unsuitable with a locked vehicle. Administrative punishment does not have
to have a statutory reason behind it. While they would not be able to
get away with a safe storage charge with a (properly secured)
firearm in a vehicle, a chief could still say "that's irresponsible" and declare
someone unsuitable. It all depends on the issuing authority.... while I
believe that many would say "well, mr so and so did lock his vehicle, and
took extra precautions" there are also some who would probably declare
someone unsuitable at a whim- especially in towns where they don't like
issuing LTC's to begin with. I would wager anyone who gets a gun stolen
from a vehicle w/a brookline permit, for instance, is going to get a hatchet
job even if you had the gun in an armored car.

-Mike