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High pressure?

Realtor MA

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I'm assuming these rounds are a little hot. Didnt run them through a chrono but primers seem like they are taking a beating. Safe to shoot?
 

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moojpg2

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I would back them down a little bit, maybe like .2 grains and see if it goes away. Clean and check the breech face on your pistol too, make sure there aren't any issues there. If you don't have a chrono and your reloading, this is a sign that it's time to get one.
 

Realtor MA

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Factory ammo seemed normal. I have about 200 rounds like this and i would hate to waste them. By the same token i would hate to ruin a gun. Maybe i'll see how a glock with a lone wolf barrel handles them. ETA no 2 will hit the paper in the same spot. Lol
 

Realtor MA

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I would back them down a little bit, maybe like .2 grains and see if it goes away. Clean and check the breech face on your pistol too, make sure there aren't any issues there. If you don't have a chrono and your reloading, this is a sign that it's time to get one.
Btw. I do have a chrono and a labradar but didn't bring either with me. These were in my ammo locker. I mustve loaded them several years ago.
 

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Factory ammo seemed normal. I have about 200 rounds like this and i would hate to waste them. By the same token i would hate to ruin a gun. Maybe i'll see how a glock with a lone wolf barrel handles them. ETA no 2 will hit the paper in the same spot. Lol
If it's a well made gun rated for +p I'd probably let em fly and just back the load down .2 grains next batch, right now 200rds of 9mm is worth $120, I wouldn't pull em.
 

Realtor MA

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I put a few of these rounds through the chrono(actually radar) today. They ranged from 1150 to 1198 fps. The bullet is 124 grain jacketed.
 

drgrant

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I put a few of these rounds through the chrono(actually radar) today. They ranged from 1150 to 1198 fps. The bullet is 124 grain jacketed.
What's the powder and OAL? I used to load 124 CMJ up (like assloads of them) with that press (the one I sold you ages ago? although you may have upgraded to something bigger better faster?) at 1.155 with like 4.2-4.3grs titegroup and landed in that same velocity range, although I dont remember primers being that effed up.
 

drgrant

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Actually in retrospect that might be hot but not that bad.... those primers aint even flat yet.... but you might be on the edge depending on the powder.
 

Realtor MA

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What's the powder and OAL? I used to load 124 CMJ up (like assloads of them) with that press (the one I sold you ages ago? although you may have upgraded to something bigger better faster?) at 1.155 with like 4.2-4.3grs titegroup and landed in that same velocity range, although I dont remember primers being that effed up.
So i have a 650 now which i bought at least a few years ago. At that time i sold your 550. But... these were loaded with that 550. Loa is 1.148 (for no particular reason). If the markings on the container are accurate it's 5.0 of w231. Gun is a sig m17
 

drgrant

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So i have a 650 now which i bought at least a few years ago. At that time i sold your 550. But... these were loaded with that 550. Loa is 1.148 (for no particular reason). If the markings on the container are accurate it's 5.0 of w231. Gun is a sig m17

I do know that W231 doesn't scale well with 9mm, or at least it didn't when I used to run ladders with it.... I basically ditched that powder (well, I used it to make some .45 ACP loads, at least) when I found out I couldn't make an easy factory replication load with it without going over book. It's probably perfectly fine though if you wanted to tweak it to run a typical USPSA fluff-crew load right over minor, though.
 

dgrantdoherty

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I do know that W231 doesn't scale well with 9mm, or at least it didn't when I used to run ladders with it.... I basically ditched that powder (well, I used it to make some .45 ACP loads, at least) when I found out I couldn't make an easy factory replication load with it without going over book. It's probably perfectly fine though if you wanted to tweak it to run a typical USPSA fluff-crew load right over minor, though.
Over my head but thanks. Alot to google. Trying to understand it all
 

Realtor MA

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I do know that W231 doesn't scale well with 9mm, or at least it didn't when I used to run ladders with it.... I basically ditched that powder (well, I used it to make some .45 ACP loads, at least) when I found out I couldn't make an easy factory replication load with it without going over book. It's probably perfectly fine though if you wanted to tweak it to run a typical USPSA fluff-crew load right over minor, though.
Not even sure why i had the w231. If i use it again I suppose I will back it down a few tenths
 
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Just asking, since this seems like a 'teaching moment'.

What's 'wrong' with those primers? The deep indentions? Or am I missing something?
They look a little flat, which means the pressures are forcing the primer against the breechface and it's starting to flow over the chamfer of the primer pocket. This is normal for certain high pressure magnums, but not 9mm at standard pressure. The PMC case looks fine, but the Federal is looking like it's a bit hot, but that could be that Federal's case doesn't have the same exact primer pocket as the PMC does, so... yeah, this is why when we're testing out a load we want to use the same brass so we have more consistency, especially if we're trying a new handload out.

Different brass is like a box of chocolates in you never know how it's gonna go while loading. I was using some PPU .357 brass recently that I picked up at the range and for some reason during mouth flaring the bullets I was using dropped right down the neck with no tension. All the other .357 brass I was using, multiple brands, had no issue.
 

marleythefish

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Just asking, since this seems like a 'teaching moment'.

What's 'wrong' with those primers? The deep indentions? Or am I missing something?
When working up a load for any caliber i watch the primers as they will tell pressure signs. As you reach max pressure the primers will flatten out and fill the space between the primer pocket and the breech, this is a rudimentary indication that the pressure is very high. In addition to this you may see the primer start to enter the firing pin hole, that's over pressure. Its an old school method of reading pressure, some would discount it but i don't. I have a .460 rowland that the pressure was so high i would pierce the primers and powder would foul the firing pin, i modified the gun to use a 9mm firing pin which stopped that. You are at the edge from those primers. anything that i load at the edge is starline brass and CCI primers. some primers are softer than others, CCI has never let me down.
 
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When working up a load for any caliber i watch the primers as they will tell pressure signs. As you reach max pressure the primers will flatten out and fill the space between the primer pocket and the breech, this is a rudimentary indication that the pressure is very high. In addition to this you may see the primer start to enter the firing pin hole, that's over pressure. Its an old school method of reading pressure, some would discount it but i don't. I have a .460 rowland that the pressure was so high i would pierce the primers and powder would foul the firing pin, i modified the gun to use a 9mm firing pin which stopped that. You are at the edge from those primers. anything that i load at the edge is starline brass and CCI primers. some primers are softer than others, CCI has never let me down.
You just reminded me CCI's primers are harder because I've been using Federals for revolvers for a bit given they are softer and have been trying to work out a wadcutter .32 Long load with Titegroup. Last time I shot it it looked like high pressure, now I'll have to try again with CCI.
 
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When working up a load for any caliber i watch the primers as they will tell pressure signs. As you reach max pressure the primers will flatten out and fill the space between the primer pocket and the breech, this is a rudimentary indication that the pressure is very high. In addition to this you may see the primer start to enter the firing pin hole, that's over pressure. Its an old school method of reading pressure, some would discount it but i don't. I have a .460 rowland that the pressure was so high i would pierce the primers and powder would foul the firing pin, i modified the gun to use a 9mm firing pin which stopped that. You are at the edge from those primers. anything that i load at the edge is starline brass and CCI primers. some primers are softer than others, CCI has never let me down.
Thanks. I doubt I'll ever reload to the max, but it could help me identify issues when I start reloading.
 

Zappa

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I've used plenty of W231 over the years for 9mm and .38 special with good results.

I just consulted my load data log book and I'm showing my own garden variety 9mm loads run a range from 3.9 - 4.4 grains of W231 for 125 gr. LRN, with an OAL of 1.125".

I've also used W231 for 115gr. FMJ-RN, at a range from 4.5 - 5.5 grains, with an OAL of 1.105"

So your data of 5.0 grains of W231 for 124 gr. jacketed loads may be a tad on the hot side, but they're likely still safe for use in a locked breech firearm.
 
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