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Healy to lend voice.

"In January, Healey said that much of the gun violence in Massachusetts stems from “a failure to address some of the root causes of violence”

And since she and other pols have no interest in addressing those root causes, (gangs, repeat offenders, drug dealers, etc.) she'll keep harping on GUNZ BAD, MMMKay? :rolleyes:
 
See the lawyer Mark Smith on Four Boxes Diner, he has discussed this many times. To keep and bear arms means that we need a means to have arms, including if that means that we make them ourselves. Her ban would die due to SCOTUS decision with the Heller, Bruen, and Caetano plain language reading of the 2nd amendment. (IANAL)
 
IPSC_DRL said:
"In January, Healey said that much of the gun violence in Massachusetts stems from “a failure to address some of the root causes of violence”

And since she and other pols have no interest in addressing those root causes, (gangs, repeat offenders, drug dealers, etc.) she'll keep harping on GUNZ BAD, MMMKay? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Just more pandering to the sheeple. No difference than Dementia Joe vowing to ban Assault Weapons.
 
timmay said:
See the lawyer Mark Smith on Four Boxes Diner, he has discussed this many times. To keep and bear arms means that we need a means to have arms, including if that means that we make them ourselves. Her ban would die due to SCOTUS decision with the Heller, Bruen, and Caetano plain language reading of the 2nd amendment. (IANAL)
Click to expand...
Then SCOTUS failed reading. There should be NO permit required. We pay a tax for a right.
 
Chevy 2 65 said:
Then SCOTUS failed reading. There should be NO permit required. We pay a tax for a right.
Click to expand...
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
 
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Agnotology said:
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...
You agree with paying a fee for permission slip for a right. You also agree with making people take safety courses. Should be a choice.

You use taxes on roads as an example and tolls. You have no right to use the roads, driving is not a right.
Freedom means you will have to be responsible for every act, for every breath; whatever you do or don't do, you will be responsible. People don't want that.
 
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Agnotology said:
EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...
All of it. The right to keep and bear arms is necessary to protect citizens from government who have a monopoly on weapons and force. Giving government the authority to regulate who can and can't have firearms through licensing is in direct contrast and opposition to this.

Requiring licensing and training also does nothing to reduce gun violence. Almost all of our nations violence committed with guns takes place in places where legal gun ownership does require one to have to jump through the egregious hoops that you are suggesting, and almost none of it is committed by those that do. If you have determined that someone is so dangerous to society that they cannot be around a firearm, then you've failed us all by not keeping them in jail where they belong, which would actually be a step toward reducing violent crime.

Firearms licensing is a major deterrent to firearms ownership. I have multiple family members in MA who otherwise would own firearms but do not have the hundreds of dollars that it would require them to do so in their town that requires the training class, the rod and gun club membership, and the license itself on top of the inflated prices of firearms in MA where the government has done all that it can to make it as expensive as it can to sell and purchase firearms.

Your road analogy is terrible. Besides the fact that we don't have a constitutional right to drive a car, if we have the right to move freely, and the money taken from us allegedly allows us to move about more freely, then taxes on firearm ownership should result in enabling us to own and use firearms more freely. In fact, the result is the opposite.

What else? I don't know. Why should I explain what else? Why shouldn't you demonstrate why it is that licensing of a right is constitutionally allowed, and provide us with actually evidence that it results in a net good for society, not just your emotional perception that it does.
 
Agnotology said:
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...

(in accented skeptical, sardonic DeusEx Prague police woman encumbered in body armor with rifle voice)

"Here we go....." [rolleyes]



prague.png


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Y6cNrBJiFU

[/QUOTE]
 
I believe in freedom for all it's worth.
Any person here in the good ol' US of A that is not in prison should be able to own machine guns.
Even fellons. Hey, if they are safe enough to be out in society and did their time. They are once again free men. Just like it was back in the late 1700's and 1800's.
The only ones that would need permits would be law enforcement and the military. To keep them in line from oppressing our citizens!
We would have the right to disarm them. Not how it is now.
A politician nowadays represents only himself and not the people or their rights. Where he alone chooses who gets said rights!
 
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Agnotology said:
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...

Driving a vehicle is not a constitutional right. It is a privilege.
 
Agnotology said:
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...
Huh?? You lost me at pay taxes for a lot of rights. I stopped after that one. Taxes have nothing to do with rights. You may want to edit your comment.
 
oldguy68 said:
I believe in freedom for all it's worth.
Any person here in the good ol' US of A that is not in prison should be able to own machine guns.
Even fellons. Hey, if they are safe to be out in society and did their time. They are once again free men. Just like it was back in the late 1700's and 1800's.
The only ones that would need permits would be the police and the military. To keep them in line from oppressing our citizens!
We would have the right to disarm them. Not how it is now.
Where a politician nowadays represents himself and not the people or their rights. He gets alone chooses who gets said rights!
Click to expand...
And fighter jets! Our drooler in charge made it pretty clear that US citizens need fighter jets. I just have to figure out how to afford one. NES group buy?
 
Agnotology said:
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...
The whole thing.
 
Chevy 2 65 said:
Then SCOTUS failed reading. There should be NO permit required. We pay a tax for a right.
Click to expand...
SCOTUS answers the questions before them.
The direct question of requiring permits was not part of Heller, McDonald, Cataeno, or Bruen.

Once enough states go CC, we will likely see a challenge to permits.
 
pastera said:
SCOTUS answers the questions before them.
The direct question of requiring permits was not part of Heller, McDonald, Cataeno, or Bruen.

Once enough states go CC, we will likely see a challenge to permits.
Click to expand...
They did agree it's OK for a fee and permit. No?
 
Agnotology said:
We pay taxes for lots of rights. Some are necessary. We have the right to move freely but pay taxes to upkeep the roads we freely move on. Certain roads and highways are more convenient or faster, and we pay additional taxes to utilize those roads and highways as tolls.

I'm fine with $100 for 5 years as it costs money to produce the ID's and do things like background checks. Given all that is required is a 4 hour class and in some towns some range time, I can't exactly complain. Nothing wrong with asking people to invest 4 hours into a LTC class to ensure can safely handle a firearm and you don't lose your rights by violating law, the constitutionality of said laws not withstanding. MA stays out of the instruction side of things other than giving a basic outline of what should be covered.


Ideally, your firearms safety training card would replace the LTC, you'd show that when you purchase a gun, do the 4473, and the state would stay out of licensing, as it's a pointless expense for the individual and the state given the redundancy of a 4473 and a LTC.

EDIT: You know, instead of meme'ing a genuine reply with a laughing emoji, you could say what you disagree with.
Click to expand...
FNFUD
Not a single infringement you listed has a significant impact on violent crime or accidents.

I hope you're actually trolling with the 4 hour class teaching gun safety.
Gun safety is a culture taught through experience and constant reinforcement.

Had the government not infringed in the first place most children would demonstrate handling instinctually by the time they are 8-9 years old.
 
Chevy 2 65 said:
They did agree it's OK for a fee and permit. No?
Click to expand...
They stated those were presumptively allowable. Sinve they were answering a very narrowly defined contraversy they necessarily had to bookend their response to ensure f'cers like roberts would sign on.
Again, SCOTUS does not "find facts" so it csn only speak to the facts presented before the court.
Want an answer on the question of permits being lawful? ask a district court and if they improperly apply the law appeal that error to the next higher court until you get relief.
 
pastera said:
FNFUD
Not a single infringement you listed has a significant impact on violent crime or accidents.

I hope you're actually trolling with the 4 hour class teaching gun safety.
Gun safety is a culture taught through experience and constant reinforcement.

Had the government not infringed in the first place most children would demonstrate handling instinctually by the time they are 8-9 years old.
Click to expand...
Fudd? Perhaps. Totally ignorant about RKBA? Confirmed
 

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