DeLeo Gun Bill and Mil Surp Collectors

[xcom]

Since this Bill (H.4121) also gives more power to the AG to restrict the types of handguns that are allowed in this state, it could quite possibly kill the ability to acquire C&R handguns.

I think we would be in the same boat as everyone else. That is, when we bring a C&R Handgun to the FFL dealer to get it transferred they could refuse to do it as as has happened with newer firearms in the state. We have been somewhat speared from this as it is an FFL transaction with a registration for us and no need to hit the dealer.

It's a difficult situation, as a collector I want to argue with reps that ANY FFL should be able to transfer firearms. However, I do not want to argue this and potentially shaft other gun owners when they see this as a "compromise" position that they can explain to the moonbats and say to the gun folks "we gave you something."

Hence, I've been arguing for the greater good at this point.

 

[JZ1018]

I think we would be in the same boat as everyone else. That is, when we bring a C&R Handgun to the FFL dealer to get it transferred they could refuse to do it as as has happened with newer firearms in the state. We have been somewhat speared from this as it is an FFL transaction with a registration for us and no need to hit the dealer.

It's a difficult situation, as a collector I want to argue with reps that ANY FFL should be able to transfer firearms. However, I do not want to argue this and potentially shaft other gun owners when they see this as a "compromise" position that they can explain to the moonbats and say to the gun folks "we gave you something."

Hence, I've been arguing for the greater good at this point.

If this passes, in the future, all handgun transfers would have to go through a dealer. If the C&R handgun is not on the list, you are out of luck. I don't see many Lugers or P38s being sent to the state for testing.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Since this Bill (H.4121) also gives more power to the AG to restrict the types of handguns that are allowed in this state, it [STRIKE=undefined]could quite possibly[/STRIKE] Will Likely kill the ability to acquire C&R handguns.

If this passes, in the future, all handgun transfers would have to go through a dealer. If the C&R handgun is not on the list, you are out of luck. I don't see many Lugers or P38s being sent to the state for testing.

If we make noise about it, they will MAKE SURE that C&R FFLs can NOT get any gun shipped to them directly (the "C&R Loophole"), so staying off the radar is the best way to deal with this. [IIRC in CA, NO C&R handguns can ship to a C&R FFL, they all have to go thru a CA dealer.]

Since ONLY the mfr can submit 5 BRAND NEW guns for destructive testing to get on the list and brand new Lugers or P38s are likely to be worth $20K+ each and most of the mfrs aren't making them any more, they would never get tested and listed.

The AG (per the bill as written) has VETO power on ANY gun (handgun, rifle or shotgun) to prevent it from being transferred in MA. I suggest reviewing the "AG's List of Approved Handguns" and you'll see what the new List will look like. HINT: There never has been and never will be any AG List of approved guns (which, BTW is actually required per the current law). Ergo, no guns will be transferable in MA! That will shut-down all the gun dealers in the state and after 1 generation, there will be no more legal gun owners in the state. Brilliant plan, absolutely brilliant!

 

[browncoat]

If we make noise about it, they will MAKE SURE that C&R FFLs can NOT get any gun shipped to them directly (the "C&R Loophole"), so staying off the radar is the best way to deal with this. [IIRC in CA, NO C&R handguns can ship to a C&R FFL, they all have to go thru a CA dealer.]

Since ONLY the mfr can submit 5 BRAND NEW guns for destructive testing to get on the list and brand new Lugers or P38s are likely to be worth $20K+ each and most of the mfrs aren't making them any more, they would never get tested and listed.

The AG (per the bill as written) has VETO power on ANY gun (handgun, rifle or shotgun) to prevent it from being transferred in MA. I suggest reviewing the "AG's List of Approved Handguns" and you'll see what the new List will look like. HINT: There never has been and never will be any AG List of approved guns (which, BTW is actually required per the current law). Ergo, no guns will be transferable in MA! That will shut-down all the gun dealers in the state and after 1 generation, there will be no more legal gun owners in the state. Brilliant plan, absolutely brilliant!

Part of me thinks that this is the only way to get the system dismantled. If (especially long guns) get defacto banned, there would be good grounds for a federal lawsuit that we would definitely win. It is the gradual progress of these laws that is slowly killing us

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk

 

[drgrant]

(which, BTW is actually required per the current law).

Len, I'm infinitely curious about this.... I know the law says that EOPS must publish the AFR for handguns now, but I wasn't aware of anything that stated that the AG has to publish a list of stuff that is CMR940 compliant....

-Mike

 

[Len-2A Training]

Len, I'm infinitely curious about this.... I know the law says that EOPS must publish the AFR for handguns now, but I wasn't aware of anything that stated that the AG has to publish a list of stuff that is CMR940 compliant....

-Mike

I thought it was in 940 CMR 16, but can't find it at the moment. So now I'm unsure myself.

 

[xcom]

I thought it was in 940 CMR 16, but can't find it at the moment. So now I'm unsure myself.

I'd be interested too, thanks!

Similar to, I guess, "shall inform Congress", or "faithfully enforce the laws" I guess.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I remember seeing in MGL where the AG will annually release a list of reciprocity states for LTCs (never been done).

I may well have been wrong above since I can't imagine a MA AG actually writing a CMR that would "mandate" that they release info that they never intend to release in the first place since the entire purpose of the CMR/regulation is to be an obstructionist.

 

[xcom]

Looks like there was some candy in the Senate Version of the bill:

"1005 A firearms collector, licensed pursuant to 18 U.S.C. 923(b), may purchase a rifle, shotgun
1006 or firearm that was not previously owned or registered in the commonwealth from a dealer
1007 licensed under section 122 if that rifle, shotgun or firearm is a curio or relic as defined in 27 CFR
1008 478.11."

It seems to me that we lost the door to door service but avoided the "list" issue.

 

[mac1911]

Looks like there was some candy in the Senate Version of the bill:

"1005 A firearms collector, licensed pursuant to 18 U.S.C. 923(b), may purchase a rifle, shotgun
1006 or firearm that was not previously owned or registered in the commonwealth from a dealer
1007 licensed under section 122 if that rifle, shotgun or firearm is a curio or relic as defined in 27 CFR
1008 478.11."

It seems to me that we lost the door to door service but avoided the "list" issue.

Ok i mightr be wrong and cant look up the definition of "dealer" here at work but wouldnt this be the law that shows all the distributors we can in fact buy and recieve C&Rs from them? Does MGL define "dealer" as any FFL dealer or just those licensed in Ma?

 

[jpm]

I believe the 'licensed under section 122' part is referring to a state license.

 

[xcom]

I believe the 'licensed under section 122' part is referring to a state license.

That is my reading as well.

MGL Ch. 140 Sec. 122:

Section 122. The chief of police or the board or officer having control of the police in a city or town, or persons authorized by them, may, after an investigation into the criminal history of the applicant to determine eligibility for a license under this section, grant a license to any person except an alien, a minor, a person who has been adjudicated a youthful offender, as defined in section fifty-two of chapter one hundred and nineteen, including those who have not received an adult sentence or a person who has been convicted of a felony or of the unlawful use, possession or sale of narcotic or harmful drugs, to sell, rent or lease firearms, rifles, shotguns or machine guns, or to be in business as a gunsmith. Every license shall specify the street and number of the building where the business is to be carried on, and the license shall not protect a licensee who carries on his business in any other place. The licensing authority to whom such application is made shall cause one copy of said applicant’s fingerprints to be forwarded to the department of the state police, who shall within a reasonable time thereafter advise such authority in writing of any criminal record of the applicant. The taking of fingerprints shall not be required in issuing a renewal of a license, if the fingerprints of said applicant are on file with the department of the state police. The licensing authority to whom such application is made shall cause one copy of such application to be forwarded to the commissioner of the department of criminal justice information services. Any person refused a license under this section may within ten days thereafter apply to the colonel of state police for such license, who may direct that said licensing authorities grant said license, if, after a hearing, he is satisfied there were no reasonable grounds for the refusal to grant such license and that the applicant was not barred by the provisions of law from holding such a license. The fee for an application for a license issued under this section shall be $100, which shall be payable to the licensing authority and shall not be prorated or refunded in case of revocation or denial. The licensing authority shall retain $25 of the fee; $50 of the fee shall be deposited into the general fund of the commonwealth; and $25 of the fee shall be deposited in the Firearms Fingerprint Identity Verification Trust Fund. A person licensed to sell, rent or lease firearms, rifles, shotguns or machine guns shall not be assessed any additional fee for a gunsmith’s license. Whoever knowingly issues a license in violation of this section shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than six months nor more than two years in a jail or house of correction.