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Cop learns about the 2A....The hard way...
- Thread starter pipmaster1971
- Start date
I'd say he's lucky to be alive!
![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
+1. Don't get into a road rage dispute. Just let it go. There's nothing good that will come out of getting into such a dispute.
I wouldn't have done anything different. Good for him.
As opposed to everyone here who, in the midst of an adrenaline dump, would have reached across the seat to push their spouse out of the way, drawn their gun and put two through the center of mass and the third through his head.
An old friend of mine, who was a cop at the time, shot pretty regularly and was a much better than average shot at the range. He once had a guy he was questioning pull a gun on him and start shooting from no more than two feet away. He of course drew and returned fire. After both of them had emptied their guns, his superior marksmanship skills had resulted in one hit in the punk's thigh out of 8 rounds fired, in contrast to 6 misses (one of which did manage to put a hole in his coat) by the would-be Curly Bill Brocius. 'Nuff said.
Ken
Ken:
My issue with the situation isn't the marksmanship. My issue is with both of the parties getting into a stupid, pointless, confrontation that could have been avoided.
Don't get into a shouting match when some jerk cuts you off. Don't flip in the bird or flash your lights or tailgate. Just let it go. Testosterone poisoning never helped anyone.
My issue with the situation isn't the marksmanship. My issue is with both of the parties getting into a stupid, pointless, confrontation that could have been avoided.
Don't get into a shouting match when some jerk cuts you off. Don't flip in the bird or flash your lights or tailgate. Just let it go. Testosterone poisoning never helped anyone.
Maybe I should have deleted the first sentence of the quoted post, but re-reading my post it still seems to to be fairly clearly addressing the second sentence. After all, there's not word one about driving, rage or anything similar. Given the choice between having to draw on somebody and turning around and walking away saying "yes, you're right; I really am a chicken-shit a**h***, and I sincerely apologize for offending you with my presence," I'll take the second option every time. I've got nothing I need to prove to anybody that badly.
Ken
Ken
jkelly
Shooting at the big range in heaven
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I don’t think the shooter got good hits but he didn’t miss and he apparently stopped the attack. So I don’t think I could fault his shooting.
What I don’t understand is how the “perp” (the LEO in this case) could be 3 feet from the shooter but be pointing his gun at the shooter’s wife who was in the passenger seat.
I wonder if the shooter shot using both hands or strong hand only.
Having only played at shooting from inside a vehicle I know it’s not easy, especially if you’re shooting from the driver’s side out the passenger’s side window. Must have been pretty loud for the wife and kids.
Any way I think these are much better results (accuracy wise) then most police involved shootings I’ve read about.
I guess I don't need to comment on the road rage aspect.
Respectfully,
johnk
The way I read it, the shooter (SUV driver) pulled up to a light on the left of the undercover cop - so the cop's driver's side door was next to the passenger side of the SUV. The cop got out and pointed the gun at the shooter's wife in the passenger seat.
What I don't get is how you hit someone in the legs from the driver's seat of an SUV when the target is standing three feet away from the passenger side window. Did they guy shoot through the door?
RE: Road Rage - I avoid it because I carry a gun.
Interesting observation.
Every once in a while I get a reaction from someone who knows (or becomes aware of) my usual status of being armed whilst abroad, to the effect, "Wow, I guess that means you can go where you please without fear (unlike the rest of us)."
My response has been, "Not quite. Because I am armed, I feel obliged to cross to the other side of the street before someone else might, simply because I have to go to greater lengths to avoid a confrontation."
What I don't understand...if the cop was the first out with a gun...and pointing it at the car. And the driver had to PULL his gun, and then point it..
Why didn't the cop get any shots off? I mean, if I already had my gun at ready, and then someone starts shooting at me...I would like to think that I would try to get a round off.
Unless the cop was thinking that he might hit the wife or kids. If so, then he shouldn't have gotten out of the car with the gun drawn.
Why didn't the cop get any shots off? I mean, if I already had my gun at ready, and then someone starts shooting at me...I would like to think that I would try to get a round off.
Unless the cop was thinking that he might hit the wife or kids. If so, then he shouldn't have gotten out of the car with the gun drawn.
dwarven1
Lonely Mountain Arms
Precisely - you cannot afford to get angry while carrying.
Someone cuts me off? Just shrug it off and continue on my way while silently wishing that the next person he does it to is driving an unmarked car. Someone tailgates me? Pull over and wave him/her/it on.
You just can't afford to get stupid - the consequences can be deadly.
Maybe. You only assume that these guys were doing the "mutual provocation"
type deal, but IMO anyone that gets pissed off enough to pull
a gun on someone over a car incident is probably operating on a hair trigger
to begin with; eg, once the turd is attached, he's not going to let go until
he does something stupid, and that's exactly what this sounded like.
I'm not sure what the intersection was like, but if the guy was stuck at a red
light in a busy intersection, driving away was probably not a viable option.
The article is pretty sparse on information, but if we trust the defender's
account, the cop here was WAY out of line, and escalated the whole thing.
If anything you would expect a LEO to be a lot more professional about
it. Last I knew cops didn't draw guns on bad drivers except as a last
resort or when out of the cruiser.... and this guy got out of his vehicle
and confronted the other guy, and if he didn't identify himself, and then
escalated even further, he gets what he deserves. Those kind of LEOs
make it that much harder for every other LEO that is out there. It is
those kind of turds that create unnecessary friction between law
enforcement and the public.
-Mike
There is this nifty thing called an OODA loop..... the attackers mindset/focus
was probably that his display of force would not be challenged; and it takes
time for his brain to process that the other guy is now pointing a gun at him,
partially because of the OODA thing, but also because he probably was not
expecting that response. Believe it or not, under some circumstances
it takes a lot of time (eg, a few seconds) for it to register that all of a sudden
the conditions have changed, that you need to react (in actions) to those
changes. )
On the other hand if the guy had stepped out of his car with the sole
intention of shooting the other driver, this probably would have
turned out a lot differently. More than likely he was trying to scare
the shit out of the other driver, but his idea failed miserably.
-Mike
I agree, and I avoid antagonizing other drivers at any/all costs. Some
road ragers though, are not deterred by being passive, and then they require
other kinds of action.
I remember years ago somehow or another I pissed off this guy in an
18 wheeler (I have no idea how I did it, it wasn't like I had cut in front
of him or something... maybe he was just pissed off and decided to try to
ram me off the road... maybe it was a matter of false identification,
etc. ) he was tailgating so close that if I had tapped my
brakes my car would have been destroyed instantly. Then he followed
as I tried to jockey my way through the cars (simply trying to
let him pass wasnt an option, I was boxed in from the rear, all I could do d
was advance) eventually I outran him because I slalomed a few cars
and he couldn't do it without destroying them in the process. Since I was
trying to pay more attention to stay alive, it was too hard to get any identifying
info off the thing, and I sure as hell wasn't sticking around. After I broke free of
the logjam I had the accelerator buried into the floor for a mile or two, only slowing
down back to a more reasonable speed after a few minutes.... My eyes glanced
to that rear view mirror a second or two every minute, though, It was like that
movie with the guy that had the psycho tanker truck thing that was constantly following
him and trying to run him off the road. I forget the name of that
movie, but it had a guy in it with a little red car that was driving on some
rural highway...
-Mike
Chris
NES Member
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It almost sounds like the powers that be are trying to just make this "go away".
The very fact that the shooter "pulled up next to the cop" could indicate a willingness to escalate the situation. The shooter was armed. The proper response is to AVOID any chance of needing it. Let the other guy go.
If you can get out of a situation with just words, count your blessings and allow the other party to go.
The only people who would think you less of a man for deciding NOT to have to shoot someone are not the kind of people who's opinions I care much about.
My goal in life is to never again ever have to do harm to someone else. But you can be sure that if that was the only option, the response will be quick and to the point. I practice BOTH skills.
The very fact that the shooter "pulled up next to the cop" could indicate a willingness to escalate the situation. The shooter was armed. The proper response is to AVOID any chance of needing it. Let the other guy go.
If you can get out of a situation with just words, count your blessings and allow the other party to go.
The only people who would think you less of a man for deciding NOT to have to shoot someone are not the kind of people who's opinions I care much about.
My goal in life is to never again ever have to do harm to someone else. But you can be sure that if that was the only option, the response will be quick and to the point. I practice BOTH skills.
The name of the movie was Duel, with Dennis Weaver driving a red Plymouth Valiant; released in 1971. See http://members.tripod.com/webzapper/duel.html
jkelly
Shooting at the big range in heaven
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That’s how I pictured it too but was confused by the 3 feet statement.
That was confusing to me also which is why I wondered if the perp (the LEO) moved around to the SUV driver’s side door.
And because he might be carrying one also.
Respectfully,
jkelly
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