Brining home a weapon from Florida?

[Chuck]

Hi,

If I while on vacation I find a handgun I like, is it simply a matter of having the Florida FFL ship it to a cooperative FFL here in Boston? Provided of course the weapon is pre Oct 98. If it's newer, then the multiple lists get me all confused!

I wonder because last time I was down in Florida I stopped in a huge gun shop in Ft. Lauderdale on a rainy day and the prices were amazing for someone from PRoM!

What about rifles? Can I bring one home in checked backage?

thanks for any info,
Chuck

 

[dreppucci007]

Not quite that simple, Chuck.

Provided of course the weapon is pre Oct 98

If you're thinking along the lines of an H&K for example that's not on the AG's list since 98, it's not gonna happen. It's gotta be a gun that's on the AG's approved list. With that, you can have a Florida FFL ship it to a willing MA FFL, and then you will do the paperwork when you get home.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

Sorry to be the bearer of [potential] bad news, but I'd have a shitload of H&Ks if it were that easy.

 

[Len-2A Training]

You are wrong!

There is NO AG's List and there NEVER will be one!

To correct your post . . .

There is an EOPS List and it MUST be on that list OR have been in MA on 10/21/98. Not likely that much you find in FL will fit this bill.

In addition, it has to be certified as "MA AG Compliant" by the Mfr (IN ADDITION to being on the EOPS List) if it was made post 10/21/98.

 

[dreppucci007]

You are wrong!

There is NO AG's List and there NEVER will be one!

Sorry, that's what I was thinking...Going too long without sleep. Thank you for correcting me, Len.

 

[Len-2A Training]

dre,

No problem, I'm running on almost empty myself. Just got in from a long day out of the office.

 

[KMaurer]

You are wrong!

There is NO AG's List and there NEVER will be one!

To correct your post . . .

There is an EOPS List and it MUST be on that list OR have been in MA on 10/21/98. Not likely that much you find in FL will fit this bill.

In addition, it has to be certified as "MA AG Compliant" by the Mfr (IN ADDITION to being on the EOPS List) if it was made post 10/21/98.

Well, to make a slight correction to LenS' correction, in addition to all of that, the AG has to be willing to accept the manufacturer's certification that it meet's the AG's requirements. Such acceptance is never confirmed; the only announcement the AG's office ever makes is when then go after some dealers for selling guns whose certification he has decided not to accept. (viz. Glock)

Ken

 

[Coyote33]

legal to purchase in MA

 

[Chuck]

EOPS List and it MUST be on that list OR have been in MA on 10/21/98

This is the important point I'm taking away from this discussion. If I take a copy of the EOPS list (the ONLY list with some defined validity) with me, if I see something I like on this list, that I can somehow confirm was made prior to 21 Oct 98, then it's worth calling Carl at FS and seeing about a transfer. I've had good luck calling Glock and S&W (for a Walther P22) and finding out manufactor dates, so I figure this approach could work.

Thanks folks,
Chuck

 

[Scrivener]

...in addition to all of that, the AG has to be willing to accept the manufacturer's certification that it meet's the AG's requirements. Such acceptance is never confirmed; the only announcement the AG's office ever makes is when then go after some dealers for selling guns whose certification he has decided not to accept. (viz. Glock)

True, in my experience. I've never received confirmation of certification, which is why I sent the certifications Certified Mail/Return Receipt Requested.

 

[Soxfan9]

This is the important point I'm taking away from this discussion. If I take a copy of the EOPS list (the ONLY list with some defined validity) with me, if I see something I like on this list, that I can somehow confirm was made prior to 21 Oct 98, then it's worth calling Carl at FS and seeing about a transfer.

Chuck, I think it has to be proven to be in Mass before 10/21/98, not simply made before.

 

[Scrivener]

Chuck, I think it has to be proven to be in Mass before 10/21/98, not simply made before.

Then where are all those refurbished Glocks coming from?

Here is the AG's own enforcement letter:

TRANSFERS OF NEW AND USED HANDGUNS -- MANUFACTURE DATE

The Attorney General will enforce the regulations as follows:

Guns manufactured on or before October 21, 1998

If a handgun-purveyor transfers a new or used handgun that was manufactured on or before October 21, 1998, the handgun must meet applicable requirements of sections 16.05(1) and 16.06 of the regulations. That means it must have an approved lock, and the dealer must provide the appropriate written and verbal warnings and disclosures upon transfer of the handgun. The other requirements of the regulations will not apply.

The gun STILL must be on the AFR, however.

 

[walta44]

Pre 10/21/98 guns grandfathered?

Hope this has`nt been discussed ad nauseam before, but I`m new here. I`ve heard some dealers ( no names!) will take pre-ban hand guns,even from out of state and transfer with apparent impunity. Can anyone qoute " chapter and verse" reg.s on this? Is it MGL or CMR? There is also confusion re: in MA prior to 10/21/98 or actually registered to a MA owner.Anyone know for sure?

 

[Len-2A Training]

There is also confusion re: in MA prior to 10/21/98 or actually registered to a MA owner.Anyone know for sure?

There is NO CONFUSION! The MGLs/CMRs are quite clear. Some dealers "take liberties" in interpretation. The fine and penalties are all on their shoulders, so as a buyer I only have one piece of advice (free of course and IANAL) . . . buy what you like that is offered to you where it is not illegal to POSSESS said item and enjoy. If the dealer gets jammed up, too bad for him, but you did nothing illegal. [Although I expect someone to disagree with me, the law clearly states that "purveyors of guns" shall not sell . . . and nothing about "buyers of guns may not buy" in it. Past experience by dealers who were persecuted by the AG was that the AG got the FA-10s with the buyers info REDACTED and all persecutions were done against the dealers, no buyers were hurt in that operation.]

If you use the search feature above you will find tons of info on this topic, it's been answered many times before.

 

[Coyote33]

In case anyone else was wondering:

1 entry found for redacted. re·dact Audio pronunciation of "redacted" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (r-dkt) tr.v. re·dact·ed, re·dact·ing, re·dacts

1. To draw up or frame (a proclamation, for example).
2. To make ready for publication; edit or revise.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Not to play games with semantics . . .

Redacted is a common legal term meaning "removed". Specifically, the AG was NOT given any info on the buyers of said guns that he claimed to be "illegal sales".

 

[center442]

Now I'm really confused....

There is NO CONFUSION! The MGLs/CMRs are quite clear. Some dealers "take liberties" in interpretation. The fine and penalties are all on their shoulders, so as a buyer I only have one piece of advice (free of course and IANAL) . . . buy what you like that is offered to you where it is not illegal to POSSESS said item and enjoy. If the dealer gets jammed up, too bad for him, but you did nothing illegal. [Although I expect someone to disagree with me, the law clearly states that "purveyors of guns" shall not sell . . . and nothing about "buyers of guns may not buy" in it. Past experience by dealers who were persecuted by the AG was that the AG got the FA-10s with the buyers info REDACTED and all persecutions were done against the dealers, no buyers were hurt in that operation.]

If you use the search feature above you will find tons of info on this topic, it's been answered many times before.

I was under the impression, based on what I read on these forums, that in order for a dealer to sell a pre-98 gun legally he/she had to have "proof" that the gun was in MA prior to 98. Yet earlier in this thread is the quote from our esteemed Attorney General's enforcement letter saying:

2. TRANSFERS OF NEW AND USED HANDGUNS -- MANUFACTURE DATE

The Attorney General will enforce the regulations as follows:

>>Guns manufactured on or before October 21, 1998
If a handgun-purveyor transfers a new or used handgun that was manufactured on or before October 21, 1998, the handgun must meet applicable requirements of sections 16.05(1) and 16.06 of the regulations. That means it must have an approved lock, and the dealer must provide the appropriate written and verbal warnings and disclosures upon transfer of the handgun. The other requirements of the regulations will not apply.<<

I went and read sections 16.05(1) and 16.06 and these dealt with safety devices (locks), safety warnings, etc. The last sentence in the above quote seems to imply that as long as 16.05(1) and 16.06 are met AND the gun was manufactured on or before Oct. 21, 1998, that dealers would be free to buy and sell said guns in state no matter where they were owned prior to 98.

I've done searches and tons of reading and I'm more confused than ever. I can see why so many out of state companies just "write-off" the People's Republic. Can someone point me to a thread/site or crystal ball that clarifies this? Thank you!

 

[Len-2A Training]

It is MGL that requires the gun IN MA ON 10/21/98. AG Regs just say that the gun was mfd prior to that date. That is one source of your confusion.

Do a look-see with Search in the Gun Laws forum and you should find the MGL cite. It's late and I have some other things to do, so I don't have time to look it up again now.

 

[center442]

Got it now

Len, I found it on the GOAL site.

“SECTION 79. Clause Eighteenth to Twenty-first, inclusive, of said section 123 of said chapter 140, inserted by section 19 of this act, shall not apply to any firearm lawfully owned or possessed under a license issued under said chapter 140 on the effective date of this act.”

I can see why some dealers wouldn't touch a gun without proof of in-state ownership. I think the dealers that are handling these guns without such proof are probably relying on the AG's statement that he wouldn't prosecute a dealer under the "safety" rules, for lack of a better term.

This does complicate things if I want to use a dealer to sell my guns. I've been buying guns since I turned 21 which is more then 30 years ago. I probably can only find sales slips on a couple of them. Some were bought from individuals via the old "blue cards" which I understand the state has disposed of. Never thought back in the 1970's that I would have to have "evidence."

Perhaps GOAL could champion a change in the wording of section 79 to read simply "...manufactured on or before the effective date of this act."

Well, I can dream...