AR Recommendations

[fencer]

So I am thinking about my first EBR and was hoping to get some advice. I would like to get it in 5.56 and it will mostly be used for zombie control.
I'd like to buy something off the shelf that I would be happy with. Is this a huge mistake? Should I build it?

I am not opposed to the Sig556. What are the pros and cons. It seems like a lot of members here like the Sig. The Sig556 DMR has caught my eye. With the rebate put towards optics it might make sense. Anyone have any advice or feedback on the DMR

What kind of money should I expect to spend on a decent rifle and some decent optics? I was hoping to stay under $2500.00 complete and telling the wife it was only $1000.00

I can't say you guys didn't warn me this would happen.

 

[wolfhook]

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...r-To-build-or-not-to-build?highlight=ar+build

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Fencer, the SIG556 is a great rifle and they're having a good sale at Four Seasons. Furthermore, Sig is offering a $300 rebate, so you can get it close to $1000. My only complaint is the charging lever. It is straight and angled up slightly. This can result in your thumb getting a "bite" between the handle and optic. However, you can change the lever to one that is angled down, thus avoiding getting the bite. Other than that, a great gun at a great price right now.

 

[TheRoland]

I found the Sig556 to be prohibitively heavy, but people with more rifle experience seem to disagree.

 

[richc]

Fencer, the SIG556 is a great rifle and they're having a good sale at Four Seasons. Furthermore, Sig is offering a $300 rebate, so you can get it close to $1000. My only complaint is the charging lever. It is straight and angled up slightly. This can result in your thumb getting a "bite" between the handle and optic. However, you can change the lever to one that is angled down, thus avoiding getting the bite. Other than that, a great gun at a great price right now.

+1 on changing the charging handle... been there done that. Also... I replaced the takedown screw with an aftermarket pin so no screwdriver is needed.

Great rifle!

 

[fencer]

Thanks for the link. I did a search for AR recommendations and didn't find that thread. I am curious what folks have to say about the Sig. The thing certainly does look serious but looks can be deceiving

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Where dod you have your charging handle changed Rich and how much did it cost?

I didn't find the SIG556 too heavy overall. Some complain about it being front-heavy, but it is also an asset in keeping the muzzle down.

 

[fencer]

Fencer, the SIG556 is a great rifle and they're having a good sale at Four Seasons. Furthermore, Sig is offering a $300 rebate, so you can get it close to $1000. My only complaint is the charging lever. It is straight and angled up slightly. This can result in your thumb getting a "bite" between the handle and optic. However, you can change the lever to one that is angled down, thus avoiding getting the bite. Other than that, a great gun at a great price right now.

Is this price a typo?

 

[jasons]

So I am thinking about my first EBR and was hoping to get some advice.

This is just my opinion, but I think that a first "battle" rifle should be basic and cheap. You can get a decent AR for somewhere in the low $700 range, use the leftover cash for training and practice ammo, and then upgrade to the HSLD piston rifles and optics and all that when you've mastered the basics. A good shooter behind a $700 weapon will beat a mediocre shooter behind a $2,500 weapon 9 times out of 10. Again, just my opinion....

 

[fencer]

This is just my opinion, but I think that a first "battle" rifle should be basic and cheap. You can get a decent AR for somewhere in the low $700 range, use the leftover cash for training and practice ammo, and then upgrade to the HSLD piston rifles and optics and all that when you've mastered the basics. A good shooter behind a $700 weapon will beat a mediocre shooter behind a $2,500 weapon 9 times out of 10. Again, just my opinion....

I appreciate the advice.And I share your opinion. It is the first AR type rifle I have ever purchased, but a long time ago, I too, learned how to shoot and clean one at Parris Island. Semper Fi

 

[crazymjb]

I am only saying this because I was visiting remsport a couple times this week to get my muzzle brake pinned and welded but if you don't want to build one yourself you can have one built for you, and I would recommend... tada: remsport. They had some pretty damn good prices and you can go in and play with countless configurations and they will customize it exactly how you'd like it. I ended up picking and choosing my own parts from the internet through research for my build, but when dealing with them on getting my muzzle brake welded to my barrel I found they had a lot of the same parts for less money as they do a lot of manufacturing on site. I wouldn't hesitate to show up if only to look around. My girlfriend wants to do a build at some point and I think she is sold on their products after looking around there. The gentleman I dealt with, John was very helpful and knew his stuff very well. They will also be setup tomorrow at the show if you are going. Many here will attest to the quality of their products.

I wouldn't be so put off by a build. I too have my AR experience limited to my experience with the M16 in the Marine Corps and to save money and get exactly what I want I made my first AR a build. I am trying to do as much of the work myself for the experience, but you can always have it assembled for something in the neighborhood of 100 bucks. As far as the newer piston versions of the AR are concerned, I am with the "solution to a problem that doesn't exist crowd."

Mike

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Is this price a typo?

Nope. The original price was about $1750. Then Four Seasons started selling it for like $1300 to $1350. When you add in the $300 rebat from Sig, you're getting down to $1,000.00

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

This is just my opinion, but I think that a first "battle" rifle should be basic and cheap. You can get a decent AR for somewhere in the low $700 range, use the leftover cash for training and practice ammo, and then upgrade to the HSLD piston rifles and optics and all that when you've mastered the basics. A good shooter behind a $700 weapon will beat a mediocre shooter behind a $2,500 weapon 9 times out of 10. Again, just my opinion....

I would typically agree, however the SIG556 is priced very aggressively. Getting an entry level for the $700 range vs. the 556 for about $1000 is a no brainer

 

[PaulD]

I don't own a 556 but I've played with one a fair bit. For $1k, I agree that it's a no brainer.

In 5.56, I own a Robinson XCR and an M&P15FT. I'd sell the S&W first.

If you really want an AR instead, I think going to Remsport is a very good way to go.

 

[fencer]

Thanks for the Remsport lead. Maybe I will reconsider a build. It sounds like the end result will be a better rifle for less money, which can then be spent on ammo.

Does anyone know how the Sig stacks up against an AR for overall reliability, accuracy, ease of use etc? Does one platform offer more options for accesories or magazine options?

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Thanks for the Remsport lead. Maybe I will reconsider a build. It sounds like the end result will be a better rifle for less money, which can then be spent on ammo.

Does anyone know how the Sig stacks up against an AR for overall reliability, accuracy, ease of use etc? Does one platform offer more options for accesories or magazine options?

The claim is that the Sig is more reliable because it is a gas-piston system. Versus an AR dumps the gases back on itself and can result in more frequent fouling and need for cleaning.

 

[jasons]

Thanks for the Remsport lead. Maybe I will reconsider a build. It sounds like the end result will be a better rifle for less money, which can then be spent on ammo.

Does anyone know how the Sig stacks up against an AR for overall reliability, accuracy, ease of use etc? Does one platform offer more options for accesories or magazine options?

The AR is like a 70's Chevy with a small block V8 - lots of accessories available at all sorts of price and quality levels. They can be fast (accurate,) reliable, or cheap. (Pick two.)

The 556 is more like a late model BMW 3 series - not as many accessories and they're typically on the pricey side, but they are pretty accurate and very reliable out of the box.


Both use standard AR mags as I recall....

 

[jasons]

The claim is that the Sig is more reliable because it is a gas-piston system. Versus an AR dumps the gases back on itself and can result in more frequent fouling and need for cleaning.

Not to get into another piston vs. gas war, but gas guns work very will in most cases. If you plan on going to A-stan to shoot bad guys you might want to upgrade to a piston. If you want to go to the range and shoot every other weekend or so a gas gun will be fine. (And if you really must have a piston, there are many retrofit kits available for the AR.)

I'm not bashing the Sig by any means. I like Sigs a lot (my favorite pistol is a p226.)

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

The AR is like a 70's Chevy with a small block V8 - lots of accessories available at all sorts of price and quality levels. They can be fast (accurate,) reliable, or cheap. (Pick two.)

The 556 is more like a late model BMW 3 series - not as many accessories and they're typically on the pricey side, but they are pretty accurate and very reliable out of the box.


Both use standard AR mags as I recall....

I both agree and disagree with your statements. When it comes to external accessories, the 556 can take anything the AR can on the picatinny rails. However, you will not have the option of swapping out all kinds of uppers and internal components like you can with the AR. So it depends on exactly what accessories you are interested in purchasing down the road. The good news is that Sig has released a .22LR upper that can be swapped very quickly for indoor ranges or cheap target ammo.

Yes, the 556 supports all AR mags and, at last check, Four Seasons had plenty of pre-ban mags in stock.

 

[jasons]

When it comes to external accessories, the 556 can take anything the AR can on the picatinny rails.

That's great for lasers and flashlights, but what about the important stuff? How many different barrels are available for the556 vs. the AR? How many drop-in trigger kits? How many stocks?

 

[sig2009]

http://www.pistolandpawn.com/store/...=59597&zenid=95c12bcd0c86e819c493331dae8c3387

Bought one here a couple months ago and is Ma complient also!

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

That's great for lasers and flashlights, but what about the important stuff? How many different barrels are available for the556 vs. the AR? How many drop-in trigger kits? How many stocks?

That I can't definitely answer. I've seen several stocks, two different barrels, and I have no knowledge on the trigger kits.

 

[jasons]

That I can't definitely answer. I've seen several stocks, two different barrels, and I have no knowledge on the trigger kits.

That's what I mean. If you buy an AR and decide you don't like the trigger there are probably 50 different replacements to choose from. If you decide you want to get into match shooting there are dozens of different match grade barrels. If you don't like the stock there are basically unlimited choices (not so much in MA but you get the idea.) If you want a new caliber someone somewhere makes an upper for you.

That was my only point. I'm really not bashing the Sig at all. It's a nice rifle, just not one that I would typically recommend to someone who wants a first EBR that will grow with them.

Of course another option is AK.... I don't know much about them though. (I know I want one, but besides that I'm clueless.)

 

[Coyote33]

http://www.pistolandpawn.com/store/...=59597&zenid=95c12bcd0c86e819c493331dae8c3387

Bought one here a couple months ago and is Ma complient also!

$699! If I can build one to my specs for less (and my specs DON'T demand the fancy stock, rail, or flat-top), then I might like Remsport as well. For that matter, I am not against used parts for some non-moving parts, so could save more there.

Refer to:
retro AR: help put together shopping list

Any help appreciated!

Thanks!

 

[PaulD]

I just got an email from Four Seasons saying they're doing $100 off in addition to the $300 SIG rebate on the 556 SCM. So, a total of $400 off.

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

I just got an email from Four Seasons saying they're doing $100 off in addition to the $300 SIG rebate on the 556 SCM. So, a total of $400 off.

Paul, did you happen to get the price before any of the rebates? Last I saw, it was $1300 - $1350 (one week it was the $1300, the next it was $1350)

 

[fencer]

I just got an email from Four Seasons saying they're doing $100 off in addition to the $300 SIG rebate on the 556 SCM. So, a total of $400 off.

Yeah I got that email too. I'll check it out but I wasn't crazy about the SCM. Maybe if I could change the stock and added some nice optics. I may ask them about the DMR. I'll give them a call before I make the trip

 

[SecondAmdFirst]

Yeah I got that email too. I'll check it out but I wasn't crazy about the SCM. Maybe if I could change the stock and added some nice optics. I may ask them about the DMR. I'll give them a call before I make the trip

Fencer, I agree with you on the stock. I am 6'1" tall, so my arms are long. I could use a little more distance to comfortably position for the optics. After checking with some folks at MVGC, apparently I can legally get an adjuststable stock, but there needs to be a bolted screw instead of a pin.

 

[fencer]

Fencer, I agree with you on the stock. I am 6'1" tall, so my arms are long. I could use a little more distance to comfortably position for the optics. After checking with some folks at MVGC, apparently I can legally get an adjuststable stock, but there needs to be a bolted screw instead of a pin.

Yeah me too, 6'1" and about 250lbs. Did you have any opinion or thought on the DMR? According to Sig's website it is the only other 556 approved for sale in Ma. With the bi pod and some nice optics the thing looks absolutely awesome. Yeah it's a little bit more pricey but with a few pre-ban mags I think it would fit the bill for most applications. It is 4lbs heavier but I really don't think that is an issue when you consider its intended use.

 

[Mass-diver]

I like my sig, it's definatly heavier than an AR though and the fact that we can't build the real "evil" version is a drag (i.e. no side folder).