A problem with my Smith and Wesson 1911.

[adweisbe]

This is the engineer in me speaking.
Failure to eject is the symptom. There are a number of things you can do to prevent the symptoms from appearing but that does not necessarily solve the underlying problem.

The S&W 1911s (two of them I have tested anyways) I have cycle reliably (thought not positively) with a 16 pound recoil spring and 23 pound mainspring with 230 grain ammo going as slow as 650 FPS. A 16 pound spring should function with a wide variety of ammunition in a correct gun and respringing should not be necessary though it does have other benefits especially when shooting power puff loads. Correct guns are not functioning at the edge of reliability so you have quite a bit of lee-way before problems start showing up. If problems show up when they should not then it is time to address the root cause.

The magazine is an ammunition feeding device. I wouldn't eat off it, why would I rely on it for reliable ejection?

Cue the delicate and sensitive fine china firearm crowd.

 

[jkelly]

I have the same issue with my S&W1911.
I'm glad you brought it up.---Matt

Lets hope we find a solution.

Failure to eject is the symptom. There are a number of things you can do to prevent the symptoms from appearing but that does not necessarily solve the underlying problem.--- adweisbe

That is why I asked S&W to respring the gun as necessary.

Respectfully,

jkelly

 

[Moderator]

This has been a great 1911 information thread. Keep up the good work guys.

 

[tele_mark]

+1

As a S&W 1911 owner this is a thread I'm watching closely. I hope this thread ends up being stickied.

 

[GTOShootr]

John,
Try calling EGW or Caspian and seeing if they offer an improved extractor.

Worst case, use the frame and barrel and buy a new slide fit with an internal extractor.

 

[jkelly]

John,
Try calling EGW or Caspian and seeing if they offer an improved extractor.---Steve

Steve,
I might look into EGW after my next go round with Smith & Wesson.

BTW, I was just down MF&G and Scott Smith was just telling me how good a shooter you've turned into.


Respectfully,

jkelly

 

[Moderator]

John,

For shits and giggles, have you tried shooting the gun with a different slide? Could this possible tell you if it is a problem with the frame or slide?

 

[jkelly]

Type01313,
No I've only shot the gun with its slide. It's the only full size .45 acp 1911 that I own.


Respectfully,

jkelly

 

[Moderator]

I might be able to meet up with you this week if you want to try mine out. I have a stainless full size S&W 1911. PM me if interested.

 

[adweisbe]

No one makes aftermarket extractors for the S&W 1911. You might be able to convince EGW to mill the slot out for their extractor but there is no guarantee that is possible. It is almost cheaper and easier to buy a new slide.

 

[jkelly]

It is almost cheaper and easier to buy a new slide.---Adweisbe

My though was, should S&W fail to fix the problem and I needed to buy a new slide, then I would want a company such as EGW to do the job with a slide other then a S&W.

I’m disappointed in that you were not able to read my mind.

I was thinking that if I’m paying for the slide, then why would I want to replace it with a S&W slide that I might have the same problems with?


Respectfully,

jkelly

 

[Moderator]

John I am moving this to the "Firearms, Equipment, and Ammo " forum. I don't want to see this info get lost.

 

[RKG]

I don't have a lot of faith in long-distance, sight unseen diagnostics, but if forced to bet on this issue, I'd put my money on either (a) insufficient extractor rim tension or (b) the extractor bearing on the groove of the case versus the rim of the rim. Both are known causes of erratic ejection and, as others have noted, while a magazine bearing more loaded rounds is not intended as an ejection element, it does tend sometimes to mask ejector problems so that they only appear on the last round.

S&W 1911s are not perfect copies of Colt pistols, but Kuhnhausen has a detailed section on ejector problems and their cures on pages 60-61.

 

[adweisbe]

I sent in two guns this morning. I bought an internal extractor slide but i haven't tried it out yet. I am going to give them one more chance.

 

[jkelly]

I haven't had a chance to ship mine yet. But I'm very interested to see what they do for you.

Respectfully,

jkelly

 

[adweisbe]

I haven't had a chance to ship mine yet. But I'm very interested to see what they do for you.

Respectfully,

jkelly

I got a call yesterday. They say that the inability to extract without a mag is normal. They claim it will extract when they do it "fast enough"...

They are still looking at the second gun I sent in (already been there once) because they ignored my letter and just shot it and then wondered why it didn't happen (only happens on last round, or with mag removed).

I have pretty much given up on correcting the extractor. I am going to try and treat the symptoms by switching to a lower weight variable recoil spring (slide goes back faster, case has less time to fall under feed lips) and replacing the mag springs (follower is more likely to keep case head above feed lips) and the followers as a last resort. It's going to be expensive because I can't use all the 16 pound springs I already have and I will need to experiment with variables before I can buy the correct weight for all my S&W 1911s. Mags springs are $5+ dollars a pop and new followers are $9 a pop and recoil springs are $6. I have to fix at least 7 mags.

That is easily $130+ to fix guns that are dependent on the magazine for extraction/ejection. What's most frustrating is that I had one gun for a year and a half without this issue and then they replaced the barrel because it was breaking link pins it started.

One person I talked to had good luck with the GI magazine feed lip design. They don't provide a place for the case to jam into the same way wadcutter mags do. I am still waiting on my Checkmate magazines, but that still won't help me for games.

 

[adweisbe]

Met another person at Harvard who had this issue. My third S&W 1911 started having this issue, it had been fine for about 3k rounds since I bought it. It did it once this Sunday ruining a stage @ Bass river and once when I was testing at the plate rack with a brand new Wilson 47D.

 

[jkelly]

adweisbe,
That's not a good sign. I'm trying to get an "experimental" extractor that I'm told was designed with the S&W in mind. I'll give you more info when I get it.


Respectfully,

jkelly

 

[adweisbe]

I talked with the person who is working on one of my guns right now at the Harvard sectional. I told him about how others had resolved the issue by removing the extractor and removing material so it can pivot in farther to maintain control of the case when the barrel links down. I also mentioned that fitting a new barrel that is timed differently had helped on one of my guns but not totally eliminated the problem. He seemed to think it was worth looking into. I will let you know when I get it back. I think the existing design is adequate if it is assembled correctly.