.22 at 5 yards

[Bubba]

One of my buddies argued with his dad about being able to knock someone down with a
.22 pistol at 5 yards when the person was charging.. I was on the dads side and said BS. I say this because I am a big guy and i bet that If I was pissed enought, I would get to the shooter.... THOUGHTS????

1. Could this be reaslistic to knock someone down with a .22
2. I know a larger caliber is better, but keep the comments focused on a .22

 

[HooVooLoo]

Any projectile through the eye-socket will take down the biggest of foes.

 

[atmay]

It could happen, but I wouldn't count on it.

 

[MadHatterPDC]

Are you asking if it will physically knock a person over or merely stop the attack?

I only ask because I seem to remember Mythbusters getting at the myth of movie-style knockdowns and it was pretty much impossible. I think only the 12 ga at point blank moved their hanging dummy the tiniest bit.

And do I think a .22 will stop the attack? I wouldn't count on it, but if I had a .22 in my hand and .45 on the floor directly in front of me, I'd empty the .22, then grab that .45

 

[Dziner]

as far as "stopping power" I would say highly unlikely. As HooVooLoo states though, a well placed round will definitely shut down some internal systems. But, as for ballistics I just wouldnt think a 22 round would really get far into the body. However, if you place it right maybe it could act like a pinball in the ribcage and do some pretty serious damage to the soft tissue protected by the cage.

"Anti-Flame" Disclaimer:
I am in no way an expert in any of this. I did not research any ballistics information. Just chiming into the conversation!

 

[Fixxah]

Yes. It tends to stop you in your tracks when hit center mass.

Drugged out psycho, maybe not.

 

[Bubba]

as far as "stopping power" I would say highly unlikely. As HooVooLoo states though, a well placed round will definitely shut down some internal systems. But, as for ballistics I just wouldnt think a 22 round would really get far into the body. However, if you place it right maybe it could act like a pinball in the ribcage and do some pretty serious damage to the soft tissue protected by the cage.

"Anti-Flame" Disclaimer:
I am in no way an expert in any of this. I did not research any ballistics information. Just chiming into the conversation!

His argument was that if he unleashed all 10 rounds from his .22, this person would not make it to him. I told him, to carry a .38 snub like me.. LOL conversation over. My guess is that if he hit the person with all the rounds, the person, big or small would go down.. Not dead, but down...

 

[T(1)of(3)]

Put down a 600 pound hog with one shot to the head with a .22. Having said that, it would take the same shot to the head to "stop" someone charging you at 10 feet. Even then if they were coming fast they might take you down just from momentum and dead weight...no pun intended. To stop a determined adversary with a mid body shot would be unlikely. A .22 caliber hole to the heart would still take some time to bleed the person out...it would not be instantaneous death. Once took care of a guy with 3 stab wounds to the heart including one that severed the left anterior descending artery and put a hole in the left ventricle...and he still made it all the way to the hospital and to the OR before he died. If your attacker had any kind of a weapon...you are going to get hurt.

 

[OnTheRoad]

A fair speed for someone charging at your friend would be about 10 MPH. At that speed the attacker would cover the 5 yards (15 feet) in about one second. I doubt your friend would be able to react and fire 10 rounds in that brief period of time, not to mention the shot placement that would be needed to hit the few spots on a moving target that would be quickly vulnerable to a .22 projectile.

A shot to the eye socket, kneecap or through the throat to the spinal cord IMO would be a matter of luck over skill. Hard to miss but harder to stop.

 

[GSG]

1. Could this be reaslistic to knock someone down with a .22
2. I know a larger caliber is better, but keep the comments focused on a .22

There have been single shot stops with .22's from handguns. The one below was fired from an NAA .22 mini revolver.

http://www.odmp.org/officer/420-trooper-mark-hunter-coates

There have been people shot countless times with rifles who kept on truckin'

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/threads/100898-Master-Sergeant-Roy-Benavidez

There's a lot of factors involved, too many to give you any kind of an answer you'd want to hear.

I only ask because I seem to remember Mythbusters getting at the myth of movie-style knockdowns and it was pretty much impossible. I think only the 12 ga at point blank moved their hanging dummy the tiniest bit.

Their gun myths aren't always set up very well.

I told him, to carry a .38 snub like me..

Read the 1st link I posted above.

 

[whatluck]

.22 is fine as long as the other guy doesn't have something bigger.

And if you shoot someone all hopped up on PCP only a .22 to the eye is gonna stop him. Tough shot on a moving target.

A .357 mag to the hip would put anyone down, regardless of size or state of mind.

 

[In God We Trust]

I am actually the proud owner of a .22 that has been imbedded in my ankle for the past 20 years. It didn't hurt at all when I got shot with it and I was able to limp to the car and then into the hospital. The next day it hurt like a mother. Granted there is a big difference as to where I got shot, but I can tell you for a fact that unless you get a kill shot, it aint stopping anyone!

 

[glockstones]

I know if I place a round in the right spot with a .22 I have dropped a coyote before not the same as a person but yes it killed it in one round.

 

[cekim]

Stopping power of a 22LR might be a new NES low...

 

[MassMark]

This will do the trick at 5 yards....

 

[richc]

Jeez... in Swamp People they kill 10 foot alligators with a single .22 shot. But it has to be a perfectly aimed shot to their small brain.

I think it all comes down to what Dirty Harry said: "Are you feeling lucky punk?"

With a .357 less luck is involved.

 

[Mike-Mike]

Ask Bobby Kennedy

http://www.museum.tv/eotvsection.php?entrycode=kennedyrobe

"Two hours later, however, the weapon was identified as an Iver Johnson .22-caliber pistol, a weapon capable of eight shots."

 

[KMaurer]

There are really three different things mixed up in this question.

1. Will [fill in the blank] actually knock someone over? The answer is definitely "no". If it would knock them over, then it would just as certainly knock the shooter over. Assuming that the shooter is standing still, and the other person advancing, it's even more certain to knock the shooter over.
2. Will [fill in the blank] kill someone? The answer is "maybe". People have been killed by a single shot from a BB gun, and survived multiple hits with 12ga slugs and .50BMG. Bigger is always better, but there's nothing certain at either end of the spectrum.
3. Will [fill in the blank] stop someone's attack? Again, the answer is "maybe". It all depends on shot placement and the attacker's determination. While some people will give up the attack after being grazed by a .22, only a clean hit to spinal cord or some parts of the brain are guaranteed stoppers. People have been hit with 12ga slugs to the heart, totally destroying their heart and shutting down all blood/oxygen to the brain, yet still continuing to attack for 20-30 seconds after being "dead" on their feet. One of the bad guys in the FBI Miami debacle sustained a non-survivable would early in the fight, but continued for a couple of minutes afterward, killing one of the FBI agents.

Ken

 

[BigMike]

10 shots from a .22 will hopefully make 10 different wound channels. Getting all those shots off, on target, and before someone gets to you seems to be a tall task.

There are times when it's important to question certain issues when it comes to guns, but this isn't one of them.

Any instructor/guru will tell you to atleast HAVE a gun. After that, the consensus seems to be carry the biggest one you can!

 

[Coyote33]

...
1. Could this be reaslistic to knock someone down with a .22
2. I know a larger caliber is better, but keep the comments focused on a .22

There are really three different things mixed up in this question....

No. Actually, there were 2 pretty clear questions asked. Of course, this reply might fall under the "thoughts?" category. (-;

Stopping power of a 22LR might be a new NES low...

1% low.

 

[redtail]

Any of you who doubt a 22 will quickly knock down a BG need to watch the video of President Reagan being shot. Specifically the other 3 victims who all are incapacitated very quickly.

 

[atmay]

Any of you who doubt a 22 will quickly knock down a BG need to watch the video of President Reagan being shot. Specifically the other 3 victims who all are incapacitated very quickly.

There is a marked difference in shooting someone who is not expecting it, and someone who is intent on ripping your head off.

Try it out sometime -- sucker punch someone. Then, get in a real fight with someone. Chances are the sucker punch will have a much greater effect than blows struck during a fight.

 

[HooVooLoo]

This will do the trick at 5 yards....

Neat oh!

 

[cekim]

There is a marked difference in shooting someone who is not expecting it, and someone who is intent on ripping your head off.

Try it out sometime -- sucker punch someone. Then, get in a real fight with someone. Chances are the sucker punch will have a much greater effect than blows struck during a fight.

I recommend against trying either, but I think your analogy might fail because of the broad spectrum of responses possible in both cases.

In both cases a surprise (punch or shot) that fails to reduce function of an attacker or victim might go unnoticed (in terms of function) in the heat of the moment (until the longer term damage - swelling, blood loss, etc... - kicks in), but both also have a variety of potential responses ranging from immediate incapacitation to little effect at all based on the damage done by the impact.

A punch is perfectly capable of being lethal if well placed and hard enough. A bullet is perfectly capable of passing through the body with little to no immediately recognized effect.

So, what exactly are you assuming would be the same different between a sucker punch and a "boxing style" hit to a ready target?

 

[ecnal]

I'll say this; unless I'm in some sort of life or death situation or drunken irish rage, if someone shot me from ~5 yards with ANY caliber, I'd most likely stop what I was doing that got me shot.

.22 or .45, I cannot imagine it would feel very good. And I'm by no means an expert of ballistics or anything of the sort, but a .22, in my eyes, is capable of doing a pretty decent amount of damage at short range. In the head, chances are that if it doesn't pierce the skull, the spread from the bullet along the skull (face, side, top of head, etc) would cause a decent amount of damage. A chest shot has the chance of piercing a lung if it makes it through the rib cage. A abdomen shot would probably do the most damage as there are no bones in the way or vital organs.

 

[cekim]

I'll say this; unless I'm in some sort of life or death situation or drunken irish rage, if someone shot me from ~5 yards with ANY caliber, I'd most likely stop what I was doing that got me shot.

.22 or .45, I cannot imagine it would feel very good.

I've never been shot, but have had plenty of deep holes poked in me, broken plenty of things, dislocated some others... I doubt you'd feel much at all between 5ft out from your target and getting to your target. Unless he hit central nervous system or shattered a well placed bone, whatever you were planning on doing at 5ft out, you'd finish up before you'd notice the pain. Unless you were planning on knitting him a sweater and it was a big misunderstanding...

You are also thinking rationally and logically without all the stuff going on that had you running towards someone with a gun in the first place (which again, likely had little to do with sweater knitting). The human body, for all its frailty, like most predators, is remarkably well designed to take a beating and keep moving. Part of that is that pain is dulled to non-existent at the point of serious injury. In part because of the arrangement of nerve endings. In part because of adrenaline. In part because of the design of our brains.

 

[atmay]

So, what exactly are you assuming would be the same different between a sucker punch and a "boxing style" hit to a ready target?

Just out of curiosity....have you ever been in a fight?

I have...so I based my post on my experiences. When you expect to get hit, and have even a little time to get yourself mentally ready to fight, and the adrenaline is flowing prior to the first blow....it is VASTLY different from getting hit out of the blue. That's happened to me too.

Is it possible that a sucker punch be easily brushed off? Sure. Is it possible to die in a fist fight? Well yeah, no sugar. Are you more likely to get stopped in your tracks, wondering what the hell just happened, when some random ass dude uppercuts you in the sternum walking down the street, than when you're rolling on the gravel, choking someone out, and they're still landing hooks on your jaw? uh....yeah.

 

[blindfire]

I am actually the proud owner of a .22 that has been imbedded in my ankle for the past 20 years. It didn't hurt at all when I got shot with it and I was able to limp to the car and then into the hospital. The next day it hurt like a mother. Granted there is a big difference as to where I got shot, but I can tell you for a fact that unless you get a kill shot, it aint stopping anyone!

Wow...this comment begs some more detail

Why didn't they yank the bullet?
How did you get shot?
Did you beat the crap out of the person who did it?

 

[cekim]

Just out of curiosity....have you ever been in a fight?

Ayup, never as the initiator or by choice...

I have...so I based my post on my experiences. When you expect to get hit, and have even a little time to get yourself mentally ready to fight, and the adrenaline is flowing prior to the first blow....it is VASTLY different from getting hit out of the blue. That's happened to me too.

Same here on most counts - except below

Is it possible that a sucker punch be easily brushed off? Sure. Is it possible to die in a fist fight? Well yeah, no sugar. Are you more likely to get stopped in your tracks, wondering what the hell just happened, when some random ass dude uppercuts you in the sternum walking down the street, than when you're rolling on the gravel, choking someone out, and they're still landing hooks on your jaw? uh....yeah.

As I said, I'd expect a wide array of responses making the comparison (other than to say anything is possible) somewhat moot...

My personal experience was that the sucker punch took me from 0-100 in nothing flat. It did not phase me physically at the time (though I was left with a small fracture, lots of swelling and nasty black eye later). I was of course wondering WTF happened, but mostly I was concerned with what to do about the three guys in front of me who were clearly not interested in directions and thankfully had opened with a punch instead of the other toys they had with them...

Had the punch been more effective mechanically, my physical response could have ranged from falling down to death... I thankfully have a hard head...

 

[EddieCoyle]

If I had a butcher knife, and somebody with a .22 was attacking my daughter 5 yards away, he wouldn't live.