1911 issue

[Chet0729]

So lately my Remington 1911 has has an issue chambering the first round. It doesn't happen all the time and I had attributed it to being dirty. I have tried different ammo and 5 different mags and they all have the same issue. The round will be sitting at teh mouth of the barrel and the rear of the round not quite lifted parallel. All I have to do is pull the slide back a hair and the round pops up and chambers. I never have problems with the rest of the rounds in the magazine. Its almost like it is catching on the bolt face. The bolt face isn't glass smooth but isn't terrible either.

Has anyone experienced this or have any suggestions. I am going to tear it apart again but I didn't see anything obvious last time I had it apart to clean it..

 

[Golddiggie]

How old are the magazine springs? I was having feed issues with one of my 1911's and it was fixed by changing out the old (over 20 years old) magazine springs for new ones.

 

[Chet0729]

How old are the magazine springs? I was having feed issues with one of my 1911's and it was fixed by changing out the old (over 20 years old) magazine springs for new ones.

They are fairly new and 1 was a mag I bought a while ago new that had never been used.

 

[drgrant]

Almost sounds like too much extractor tension, but if the gun worked properly before (was uncertain from your post) that probably isn't it, usually extractors lose tension, not gain it.

-Mike

 

[Chet0729]

It has worked fine for 2 or 3 years. I would think if it was extractor tension it would be worse under a recoil re-chamber. maybe i am thinking about it backwards.
I have some 45acp snap caps here somewhere. I am going to take a harder look at it.

 

[bfm]

How many rounds through the pistol? Maybe it is time to replace the recoil spring.

 

[Sweeney]

How many rounds through the pistol? Maybe it is time to replace the recoil spring.

My thought as well. If this is only happening on the first round of each magazine then the one thing that changes is the force applied to the magazine feed lips. The first round is under higher pressure (greater friction) than the next and so on. The recoil spring might not have enough energy to move the first round into battery.

Also, make sure you're not riding the slide forward when chambering the first round.

 

[Chet0729]

How many rounds through the pistol? Maybe it is time to replace the recoil spring.

Not a lot, probably around 1-2K. If the recoil spring was weak would I just be able to nudge it into battery instead of having to pull the slide back slightly. I didn't try it I was just curious.

- - - Updated - - -

My thought as well. If this is only happening on the first round of each magazine then the one thing that changes is the force applied to the magazine feed lips. The first round is under higher pressure (greater friction) than the next and so on. The recoil spring might not have enough energy to move the first round into battery.

Also, make sure you're not riding the slide forward when chambering the first round.

It does it on the first round if I only load 2 rounds. It is an odd issue

 

[Sweeney]

And it does this only when you rack the slide?

 

[Chet0729]

And it does this only when you rack the slide?

Yup, lock back after last round, insert new mag and more often than not the first round does not chamber. All I need to do is just slightly pull the slide back like a 32nd of an inch, almost like just taking the spring tension off and it chambers.

 

[drgrant]

Odd question but if you are making reloads for this gun, have you changed the COAL of the cartridge at all?

Reason I mention this is it can change the chambering characteristics of the gun. It's possible to make ammo that works some of the time but not all of the
time. The lead bullets my friend used to make for .45 were like this, if you didnt set the coal back far enough they would choke when used in 1911s because the bullet profile interfered with the feeding dynamics of the 1911. With other guns we could get away with loading those dome headed ball rounds at 1.260 but in a 1911, it was no dice, caused a similar kind of failure.

Probably isn't it but won't hurt to check this. Use a factory round of 230 gr ball as a "control".

-Mike

 

[92G]

Almost sounds like too much extractor tension, but if the gun worked properly before (was uncertain from your post) that probably isn't it, usually extractors lose tension, not gain it.

-Mike

^this
it's either the extractor tension or your mags. extractor tension could be too tight. remove the slide and check the tension with some ammo. can use live round or empty brass. also if you're running reloads I agree gotta go back to factory ammo to test this issue.

the remington 1911 is a series 70 -ish design w internal extractor although i believe it has a firing pin safety as well. this is one reason I have grown to actually prefer the external extractor design even though it's heresy among 1911 enthusiasts.

 

[shootymacshootface]

I would remove the extractor and clean the extractor tunnel with a 22cal pistol brush. If there is gook building up behind the extractor it will be more difficult for the case to push it aside.

 

[jkelly1229]

What are you using to clean the gun. If your using Remington dri lube hoppes or other crap products maybe your gun is unhappy. However when you shoot more force is applied so the gun is ok. Sounds dumb but my beretta had that issue when I used dri lube.

 

[Wrench75]

Almost sounds like too much extractor tension, but if the gun worked properly before (was uncertain from your post) that probably isn't it, usually extractors lose tension, not gain it.

-Mike

Unless it it dirty under the back of the extractor. Carbon or unburnt powder under the extractor could cause a problem on the first rack then not be apparent when it is cycling at high speed.


ETA:

I would remove the extractor and clean the extractor tunnel with a 22cal pistol brush. If there is gook building up behind the extractor it will be more difficult for the case to push it aside.

Ya that. I should have read the rest of the thread. lol

 

[Chet0729]

Odd question but if you are making reloads for this gun, have you changed the COAL of the cartridge at all?

Reason I mention this is it can change the chambering characteristics of the gun. It's possible to make ammo that works some of the time but not all of the
time. The lead bullets my friend used to make for .45 were like this, if you didnt set the coal back far enough they would choke when used in 1911s because the bullet profile interfered with the feeding dynamics of the 1911. With other guns we could get away with loading those dome headed ball rounds at 1.260 but in a 1911, it was no dice, caused a similar kind of failure.

Probably isn't it but won't hurt to check this. Use a factory round of 230 gr ball as a "control".

-Mike

I do reload but just for a sanity check I bought a couple boxes of factory ammo of a couple different brands. Same result. The crap in the extractor tunnel seems like a possibility. I will pull it apart to take a look.
Thanks for all the suggestions so far. I know it is tough to envision without actually seeing it.

 

[Chet0729]

What are you using to clean the gun. If your using Remington dri lube hoppes or other crap products maybe your gun is unhappy. However when you shoot more force is applied so the gun is ok. Sounds dumb but my beretta had that issue when I used dri lube.

I use CLP or Remington action cleaner then lube as needed. I usually use Remoil for the internals and a little grease on the slide. Same process for all my pistols.

 

[Woody1911a1]

do you use the slide release or "slingshot" the slide ?

when i fit an extractor , i bevel the underside of the claw so the rim of the cartridge slides up in easier . take a look at yours . it can really help with feed problems .

 

[45collector]

My bet is also on extractor tension. But Mike's comment on C.O.L. could be part of your problem too.

 

[Helix142]

I had similar issue, cleaned the breach face on the slide took care of it

 

[Chet0729]

I just took it apart and tore the slide down as well. There was a good amount of gunk in the extractor bore and i cleaned the extractor and the bore. The are shiny now. I also pulled the firing pin out while i was in there and cleaned it and its bore as well. it was a little tricky trying to get the extractor, teh firing pin safety and the firing pin retainer back in. It is times like this that I realize how bad my eyes are getting for close work. I tried it with snap caps and it seemed to work fine but i have found in the past that they (snap caps ) are not a good test.
I will probably go to the range later tonight or tomorrow noon to see if it is better. I will report back.

Thanks again for everyone's suggestions.

- - - Updated - - -

I had similar issue, cleaned the breach face on the slide took care of it

The gun was field stripped and cleaned with special attention on the feed ramp and breach face and it didn't help

 

[45collector]

FWIW, I run 18lb recoil springs in all of my 1911s. That is two pounds heavier than factory weight, although I think some guns nowadays come with 18lb springs already. I'm not sure. Most of my stuff is older.

If you are using factory power ammo and even a tad less than that, it should still cycle just fine with an 18lb spring.

 

[Mark from MA]

FWIW, I run 18lb recoil springs in all of my 1911s. That is two pounds heavier than factory weight, although I think some guns nowadays come with 18lb springs already. I'm not sure. Most of my stuff is older.

If you are using factory power ammo and even a tad less than that, it should still cycle just fine with an 18lb spring.

THIS. My R1 had notoriously low 16# (seemed less) spring power out of the box and wouldnt go into battery on the first round, and also sometimes during shooting as well...... I changed it to a 17# wollff, ( I changed the firing pin spring as well because it came with the recoil spring)

All my issues went away and it ran like a top.

 

[Chet0729]

Well I have had zero luck so far. I am going to order a new recoil spring and a couple mag springs. The thing that is odd is it will cycle every time with snap caps but fails consistently with any ammo I have tried. It is a little better since I pulled and cleaned the extractor but it still fails .

 

[45collector]

Have you tested the extractor tension, and if not, do you know how to properly do that?

 

[Chet0729]

Have you tested the extractor tension, and if not, do you know how to properly do that?

I dont have the tool for it. I did the crude test i found on the internet and also compared it to my other 1911's and it does not seem significantly different. It is hard to check without the tool. Logic tells me that if it was going to change it would get weaker not stronger. I could be wrong. I may have to bite the bullet and buy the tool.

 

[slap shot]

hoppes is crap? 0.0

 

[45collector]

I dont have the tool for it. I did the crude test i found on the internet and also compared it to my other 1911's and it does not seem significantly different. It is hard to check without the tool. Logic tells me that if it was going to change it would get weaker not stronger. I could be wrong. I may have to bite the bullet and buy the tool.

You don't really need the tool. You can bend an extractor at it's center pivot point in or out by just using the extractor channel in the slide and some strong thumbs. But if you've already done the test to make sure the extractor holds a round with just the right tension and it does, then that part may not be your problem. Has anyone else messed with the gun before you bought it? Was it new or used? Have you checked the chamber for any burrs? ***ETA***: Sorry, you already mentioned you've had the gun for several years with a few thousand rounds through it, and this problem is a new development so nevermind those last questions. I would see what the new recoil spring and mag springs do for you. Run factory stuff through it, then your reloads if the factory stuff does well. Good luck!

 

[Chet0729]

You don't really need the tool. You can bend an extractor at it's center pivot point in or out by just using the extractor channel in the slide and some strong thumbs. But if you've already done the test to make sure the extractor holds a round with just the right tension and it does, then that part may not be your problem. Has anyone else messed with the gun before you bought it? Was it new or used? Have you checked the chamber for any burrs? ***ETA***: Sorry, you already mentioned you've had the gun for several years with a few thousand rounds through it, and this problem is a new development so nevermind those last questions. I would see what the new recoil spring and mag springs do for you. Run factory stuff through it, then your reloads if the factory stuff does well. Good luck!

Ya that is the plan at this point. I am actually going to make some dummy rounds, no power or primer to see if they fail. I dont like testing it with live ammo and it doesn't fail with snap caps.

 

[45collector]

That's a good idea. Just make damn sure you don't mix up your dummies and your livelies, unless you are intentionally doing so to train for failures during live fire at the range.