Why buy a youth rifle over an AR?

[enbloc]

A kid should not be started on a Barrett .50BMG either, unless his nickname is "Refrigerator"...

 

[mac1911]

I was in Bass Pro in Hooksett today. A dad and his two sons are standing right in front of the red dots, which I wanted to look at. The dad's going through every possible potential youth hunting rifle under $750 and rejecting them all. The kids are like 11, 12 and one of them is getting into hunting and shoots a .410.

Why would someone buy a youth rifle these days instead of an AR with a collapsible stock and a 5-round mag? A kid is going to grow from 5', 100lbs at 12, 13 to perhaps over 6' tall and 180+ pounds. Even a small kid can grow into being like 5'7, 5'8, 150+. Why buy a youth rifle instead of a rifle where, when the kid grows, you can just pull the stock out more?

Even caliber doesn't matter. Deer can be harvested ethically with .223, but if someone isn't comfortable with .223, there's the 6.8s, .260 Remington, .300 Blackout, 7.62x39, etc. A kid could manage the recoil of .223 or x39 much easier than .270 or .30-06.

Edit: I can get being on a budget and the only rifle dad can afford is a NEF Handi-Rifle. But when you're getting into guns in the $350-750 range...

Thoughts?

The big problem with “kids” is gun fit.
Often the only thing that makes a youth gun a youth gun is few inches off the Butt end and a light barrel.
My rifle hunting was short lived buy went right to a 30/30 lever gun with aperture rear sight.
I do like a nice bolt gun , now if im on a ferral hog hunt I might like a AR.

i do think if you buy a youth gun you should make sure there are “full” size stocks available.

 

[mac1911]

Ah, good to know. I'll have to try that next range trip

I dont know, seems like the quieter you try to be with a AR the noiser it is. !

 

[tuna]

To quietly chamber a round into an AR, you ride the bolt down and then use the forward assist.

Or you’d chamber as you head into the woods, same as a bolt, lever or pump. Anything to be spooked is already spooked by your car door.
Insert “Blackhawk Down” gif about “here’s my safety, sir”

 

[JRLB]

Ouch. That hurts, man.

I was just joking. Not serious

 

[Dadstoys]

IMHO .22 is the best starting point.
Noise and recoil can turn a young one off of shooting.
I have a single shot bolt .22 that is close to 100 years old.
It was my Grandfathers.
My father learn to shoot on it, I learned to shoot on it and my son learned to shoot on it.
Hopefully his kids will learn to shoot on it.
Get the basics down first and foremost.
I have seen both kids and adults ruined on shooting because someone handed them too much gun to start.

 

[308rifleman]

.22 is most effective for kids rather than adults. Its basically what a kid between ages 6-12 should be using until they're ready for centerfire. Far less recoil + noise.

Exactly what I bought for my daughter last year for a 6 year old birthday gift. She wanted a semiauto and got a Savage bolt gun instead. Doing her a favor. She is learning to fire accurate single shots instead of wasting ammunition with unaimed rapid fire.

 

[fshalor]

Weird. I have all kinds of toys to play from. And the most fun for me at the range is a bolt action Savage 300 .22lr with irons.

 

[whacko]

Actually, if you hunt bunnies, a .410 makes more sense than bigger shotguns regardless of age. I used a 16 once and nearly cut the bunny in half. Not to mention that it blew the intestines all through the meat and the bunny couldn't be used for eating.

I hunt bunnies with a 12 gauge. Always IC choke and high brass loads. Gotta plan your shots and only shoot em when they are far enough away so you don't destroy them. Ive also hunted bunnies with a 410......in heavy thickets it's not enough pellets or horsepower to make it through the brush and do the job. For bunnies it's always the 12 now......I take plenty of snow shoe hare and cotton tail home every season and don't have a problem with destroying them.

 

[whacko]

I was in Bass Pro in Hooksett today. A dad and his two sons are standing right in front of the red dots, which I wanted to look at. The dad's going through every possible potential youth hunting rifle under $750 and rejecting them all. The kids are like 11, 12 and one of them is getting into hunting and shoots a .410.

Why would someone buy a youth rifle these days instead of an AR with a collapsible stock and a 5-round mag? A kid is going to grow from 5', 100lbs at 12, 13 to perhaps over 6' tall and 180+ pounds. Even a small kid can grow into being like 5'7, 5'8, 150+. Why buy a youth rifle instead of a rifle where, when the kid grows, you can just pull the stock out more?

Even caliber doesn't matter. Deer can be harvested ethically with .223, but if someone isn't comfortable with .223, there's the 6.8s, .260 Remington, .300 Blackout, 7.62x39, etc. A kid could manage the recoil of .223 or x39 much easier than .270 or .30-06.

Edit: I can get being on a budget and the only rifle dad can afford is a NEF Handi-Rifle. But when you're getting into guns in the $350-750 range...

Thoughts?

For many hunters the gun used is a status symbol or tradition more than the economics or ability to have the gun multi task.

That said .....for many hunters ......the guns gotta be a bolt action in a specific "deer caliber".

 

[M60]

I hunt bunnies with a 12 gauge. Always IC choke and high brass loads. Gotta plan your shots and only shoot em when they are far enough away so you don't destroy them. Ive also hunted bunnies with a 410......in heavy thickets it's not enough pellets or horsepower to make it through the brush and do the job. For bunnies it's always the 12 now......I take plenty of snow shoe hare and cotton tail home every season and don't have a problem with destroying them.

I've hunted the scrub on Nantucket with the .410 and brought home the bunnies. Granted some only had one pellet to the head. No where in New England is the scrubb hunting thicker than on the
island of Nantucket. If the .410 works there, it will work anywhere. I can't imagine hunting those little bunnies with my deer shotgun.

 

[whacko]

I've hunted the scrub on Nantucket with the .410 and brought home the bunnies. Granted some only had one pellet to the head. No where in New England is the scrubb hunting thicker than on the
he island of Nantucket. If the .410 works there, it will work anywhere. I can't imagine hunting those little bunnies with my deer shotgun.

Browning a5 ic barrel #5 high brass 12 gauge Remy (1 1/4 ounce 1330 fps) Mossberg 500 12 gauge same setup. No meat damage.

Same shotguns we hunt deer with just change the barrels.

We just have different "style" Iol

Everyone has their way of doing it.

 

[M60]

Browning a5 ic barrel #5 high brass 12 gauge Remy. Mossberg 500 12 gauge same setup. No meat damage.

Same shotguns we hunt deer with just change the barrels.

We just have different "style" Iol
View attachment 312345

Wish I had some monsters like that to hunt around here.

 

[whacko]

Wish I had some monsters like that to hunt around here.

Go north. That's in pleasant ridge Maine. Thick covers.....up in the logging country. My absolute favorite hunting. We go up there a couple times a year.

Full disclosure....those technically are not bunnies they are hares. A bit bigger than cottontail but still pretty soft skinned and easy to take down. The high brass helps blast through the fir trees and have some pellets in target.

 

[moojpg2]

I was in Bass Pro in Hooksett today. A dad and his two sons are standing right in front of the red dots, which I wanted to look at. The dad's going through every possible potential youth hunting rifle under $750 and rejecting them all. The kids are like 11, 12 and one of them is getting into hunting and shoots a .410.

Why would someone buy a youth rifle these days instead of an AR with a collapsible stock and a 5-round mag? A kid is going to grow from 5', 100lbs at 12, 13 to perhaps over 6' tall and 180+ pounds. Even a small kid can grow into being like 5'7, 5'8, 150+. Why buy a youth rifle instead of a rifle where, when the kid grows, you can just pull the stock out more?

Even caliber doesn't matter. Deer can be harvested ethically with .223, but if someone isn't comfortable with .223, there's the 6.8s, .260 Remington, .300 Blackout, 7.62x39, etc. A kid could manage the recoil of .223 or x39 much easier than .270 or .30-06.

Edit: I can get being on a budget and the only rifle dad can afford is a NEF Handi-Rifle. But when you're getting into guns in the $350-750 range...

Thoughts?

The biggest reason here is that when you hunt as a teenager on an FID card, you can't legally carry an AR-15 with a detachable magazine. My first rifle that my dad bought me was a model 7 youth in 7mm-08, I've used it for a hell of a lot more than deer, and I've carried it so much I've had to refinish the stock. I still use it. The short LOP makes it great for winter clothing, and it's nice and light, and I am very confident with it, I know where it hits, and it's got a lot of "old friend" value to me when I go hunting, because it's the rifle I always carried when I hunted with my dad. AR-15 just doesn't have the same feel to it as a hunting rifle.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

The biggest reason here is that when you hunt as a teenager on an FID card, you can't legally carry an AR-15 with a detachable magazine...

NH doesn't have FIDs

If someone's in Mass, it's a different ballgame. Not only do hunters have to comply with the gun laws, but there's also the risk of antis or other hunters flipping out and calling the cops or game wardens. But in NH or Maine? Not as much of an issue.

 

[whacko]

NH doesn't have FIDs

If someone's in Mass, it's a different ballgame. Not only do hunters have to comply with the gun laws, but there's also the risk of antis or other hunters flipping out and calling the cops or game wardens. But in NH or Maine? Not as much of an issue.

You can buy a long gun in NH as a mass resident. . Cash and Carry. Just saying

 

[moojpg2]

NH doesn't have FIDs

If someone's in Mass, it's a different ballgame. Not only do hunters have to comply with the gun laws, but there's also the risk of antis or other hunters flipping out and calling the cops or game wardens. But in NH or Maine? Not as much of an issue.

I know, but lot of us Ma**h***s deer hunt up there, I did when I was 16,17,18,19, etc and I still had to transport whatever I was hunting with if I wasn't going with someone over 21. Just wouldn't have been worth the hassle.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

You can buy a long gun in NH as a mass resident. . Cash and Carry. Just saying

You can, but if someone was going from Mass into NH, I highly doubt they'd fingerf*ck every single possible option and then walk away after spending ten minutes at the counter. If I'm doing a cash sale, I'm going in, asking for exactly what I want, and then leaving with the gun.

That's assuming people act rationally and do research before making a big purchase.

 

[Bmcl322]

When my son was born, he was born with an AR10 .308 in his hands. I made the nurse clean off the AR10 before she cleaned off my son! & my wife, who looks like a super model, was smoking a cigar during labor.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJfTqOYe_2A

 

[whacko]

You can, but if someone was going from Mass into NH, I highly doubt they'd fingerf*ck every single possible option and then walk away after spending ten minutes at the counter. If I'm doing a cash sale, I'm going in, asking for exactly what I want, and then leaving with the gun.

That's assuming people act rationally and do research before making a big purchase.

Wow this guy really got your attention eh?

 

[308rifleman]

You can buy a long gun in NH as a mass resident. . Cash and Carry. Just saying

Did just that. 12 gauge 870 for me and Jill's Mini 14 ranch rifle. The sales tax savings was an added bonus. Jill spent it on M193 ammo.

 

[Deleted member 67409]

Wow this guy really got your attention eh?

Like I said, they were in the way of the red dots. I drove two hours to look at red dots (and found what I wanted at Shooter's)

 

[fshalor]

I've hunted the scrub on Nantucket with the .410 and brought home the bunnies. Granted some only had one pellet to the head. No where in New England is the scrubb hunting thicker than on the
island of Nantucket. If the .410 works there, it will work anywhere. I can't imagine hunting those little bunnies with my deer shotgun.

For you maybe. I have watched your posts well enough to trust you to be able to shoot the head off a moose with a belt fed at 30 yards and keep plenty of eddible meat left over.

Others? Not so much.

I'd consider .410 inhumane outside of clear air short range events on birds.

While my experience is shy, by understanding of ballistics is fair to good. I'm in the 12ga all day with the right round club.

.410 feels like winged thing only. Same reason why I never hunt deer with a .223. I am just not good enough to make the shot with a rifle with that round. Have I managed that with a .30-06 and a 7.62x54r? Yes.

But. Wow. .410 has some scatter.

 

[M60]

For you maybe. I have watched your posts well enough to trust you to be able to shoot the head off a moose with a belt fed at 30 yards and keep plenty of eddible meat left over.

Others? Not so much.

I'd consider .410 inhumane outside of clear air short range events on birds.

While my experience is shy, by understanding of ballistics is fair to good. I'm in the 12ga all day with the right round club.

.410 feels like winged thing only. Same reason why I never hunt deer with a .223. I am just not good enough to make the shot with a rifle with that round. Have I managed that with a .30-06 and a 7.62x54r? Yes.

But. Wow. .410 has some scatter.

I can't speak for others, but I only use the .410 on bunnies. Bunnies drop pretty easily. I have hunted geese, but for geese I use a Benelli M1 Super 90, with a bird barrel attached.

 

[M60]

Weird. I have all kinds of toys to play from. And the most fun for me at the range is a bolt action Savage 300 .22lr with irons.

A bolt action savage , .22 , with a fluted barrel is my fun range toy too.

 

[ScottS]

The one thing I don't understand, and it goes for both the AR and 10/22 comments: you do know that an AR15 (or 10/22) with one round in the magazine is the same as a single-shot bolt action rifle, right? Everyone is treating it like you're handing the kid an AR with a Beta C Mag. If you want to teach your kid discipline while hunting, and making every shot count, then hand him a mag with one round in it.

 

[mac1911]

The one thing I don't understand, and it goes for both the AR and 10/22 comments: you do know that an AR15 (or 10/22) with one round in the magazine is the same as a single-shot bolt action rifle, right? Everyone is treating it like you're handing the kid an AR with a Beta C Mag. If you want to teach your kid discipline while hunting, and making every shot count, then hand him a mag with one round in it.

this is a good approach, also adding a nice adjustable iris to the rear sight would make for a good quick sight picture. you can go large hole for hunting and dial it down for target.
The rifle is long gone(336 ) but had a williams rear aperture with a .125" peep.