Recommendations on a smaller .22 for training shooters with small hands

[dwarven1]

At the Turkey Shoot this weekend, I realized that all of my .22s are heavier and larger than shooters with small hands would be comfortable with. I have, currently, a Ruger Mark 1 (6" heavy bbl), a Mark II (5" bull barrel), and a S&W 617. (I also have a Beretta 21A in .22, but I'm not at ALL sure about using that for teaching!)

Anyway, as I'm planning on getting my NRA Instructor cert next year, it occurred to me that I might want a smaller .22 for shooters with small hands - ladies and younger shooters, mainly. I'm just not sure what to get.

I tried the 317 a couple of years ago, but thought it had more kick than a new shooter would be happy with. I'm thinking of a Walther P22, but I've never tried one out... and Walther is jacking up their prices 8% in January, too. Since I'm in MA, that really tends to limit the guns I can get.

Should I try searching for a S&W 17 Kit gun? It's gotta have a smaller grip than the 617 (L-frame)! Or would having three semis be OK - I remember I was happier with a revolver when I was a brand new shooter.

Thoughts?

 

[mike93lx]

the P22 is a nice, small gun. A buddy of mine has one that I believe he is looking to sell to put towards a 10/22 for Appleseed, and since I live in Hudson, I'm sure that I could arrange to meet up with you to let you try it out (even if you want to buy a new one). Let me know if you're interested.

 

[Radio]

Sig Mosquito?

 

[jenlynn724]

I have teeny tiny hands, and started shooting with a Mark III with no problem.

 

[Roastie]

The P22 I own has no noticable recoil at all and you can change the grips to fit smaller hands. (Grips were included.)

Weight is also a non-issue.

Only issue I have is it is very particular on what you feed it and tends to gum up pretty fast. (CCI and Remmington both work fine, Federal jammed.)

Your mileage may vary.

 

[eisenhow]

Ruger 22/45: It's lighter than the regular version (polymer frame) and the grip is much thinner. It's a little top heavy. Since I know you have an irrational hate of the MkIII they did make them in the MkII version .

 

[PSS]

my 9 year daughter shoots my p-22 when we go to the range.besides the small grip it is also a small gun so it's not too intimidating to the young shooter

 

[dwarven1]

I have teeny tiny hands, and started shooting with a Mark III with no problem.

Which is a polymer frame, right? At least, my Mark III was. But it's now in NJ in MikeInNJ's gun box, getting shot every other Thursday at matches. My Mark I and II are significantly heavier... and I was watching a lady who was about 5 foot nothing, with VERY small hands having a hard time with the heavier guns.

Seems to be a lot of love out there for the Walther. My only worry is that I hate having to stock more than one brand of .22 ammo for finicky eaters. Perhaps I'll check into the Mosquito.

 

[dwarven1]

Ruger 22/45: It's lighter than the regular version (polymer frame) and the grip is much thinner. It's a little top heavy. Since I know you have an irrational hate of the MkIII they did make them in the MkII version .

No, I have a hatred for taking it apart. The gun itself is a nice shooter, and I believe I've said so on more than one occasion. CLEANING it sucks, however. The lawyers who designed it should be boiled in Hoppe's 9.

 

[JGreen]

I have great success with the 4" Ruger MK III and 4" S&W 617.

 

[Slim]

Try a S&W model 63. It's a .22 J-frame revolver. Very nice and easy to shoot.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

I recently grabbed a sig mosquito for my fiancee to begin shooting with.I have heard horror stories about them being finicky with ammo, but we put 800 rounds through it this past weekend with only three FTE.

 

[dwarven1]

I have great success with the 4" Ruger MK III and 4" S&W 617.

Jon, I have a 617 - I was watching this poor lady tea-cupping it because she simply could not hold it up with any other grip!! Very delicately built lady... and the 617 is an L-frame. She had a hard time just grasping it.

As for the Mark III...

 

[Len-2A Training]

Ross, didn't you buy the 6" bbl 617? I'm pretty sure that's what I recall when you were at the S&W Shooting Center.

My personal opinion is that the 6" bbl guns are too heavy and too long for new shooters. 4" seems to be ideal for training.

 

[dwarven1]

Ross, didn't you buy the 6" bbl 617? I'm pretty sure that's what I recall when you were at the S&W Shooting Center.

My personal opinion is that the 6" bbl guns are too heavy and too long for new shooters. 4" seems to be ideal for training.

Nope, bought the 4" bbl. For the lady in question, and a younger lad we had at the shoot, even the 4" was too heavy. Thus the search.

I don't know... I do like the looks of the P22. I'll have to take someone up on their offer and try one out and see what the recoil is like for myself.

 

[pernox]

The P22, for all its shortcomings, is a good loaner/first shooter gun. My wife loves ours, and I've finally got it running steady enough to go a few hundred rounds without a bunch of FTE issues. The key for her is that it's light; she's got awful wrists and even has trouble shooting more than a few mags out of my Sig P6. The P22 has been a valuable tool for her to get trigger time in and get comfortable shooting, as she moves toward being comfortable carrying a defensive gun regularly.

If you ever want to make a trip out to Lee Sportsmen's, I'd be glad to hand it over so you can check it out.

 

[caillean]

What about a Ruger Single-Six? It's got a similar sized grip as the Security Six, which is somewhere between a j-frame and a k-frame.

A K-22 or Model 17 is a Kframe, and perhaps a bit big for small handed shooters. Walther P22 is pretty tiny, and that might work. A J-frame 22 revolver might work well, too. If you can find one of the Colt .22 revolvers, like their police-trainer, those are also fairly small-framed.

The biggest thing I've found with frame-size is how long and what angle the reach is for you index finger to reach the trigger. Fat or slim grips can be worked around fairly easily, even for a newbie, as long as that total-length-of reach for the index finger isn't too long.

 

[nhdude]

I have a 317 revolver and it seems to have almost no recoil at all. Kind of like shooting a cap gun, at least compared to my 642 ;-) And, for a 2 inch barrel, it's pretty accurate as well.

 

[45collector]

They're tough to find, but if you can get your hands on one, a Beretta model 87 is perfect for what you're looking for. I've had one for years and that thing will eat anything you throw at it. It's basically the same as the model 85 (single stack version of the model 84 .380acp) and it's very comfortable to shoot.

 

[dixidawg]

Is it the size of the grip or the weight of the gun itself that is the problem?

If the problem is weight, I have an Advantage Arms .22 conversion for my Glock 19. It is VERY lightweight. Plus it gives tha advantage of the same trigger etc of the 9mm.

 

[n1zfg]

I am annoyed that S&W quit making the 422. Maybe you can find a 2nd hand one around. Next time we get out onto a range, I'll let you try it out. The Aluminum alloy frame makes them remarkably light.

If that blasted fever had actually broken on Thursday, you'd have had a (another) chance to drive it.

 

[PaulD]

Which is a polymer frame, right? At least, my Mark III was. But it's now in NJ in MikeInNJ's gun box, getting shot every other Thursday at matches. My Mark I and II are significantly heavier... and I was watching a lady who was about 5 foot nothing, with VERY small hands having a hard time with the heavier guns.

Seems to be a lot of love out there for the Walther. My only worry is that I hate having to stock more than one brand of .22 ammo for finicky eaters. Perhaps I'll check into the Mosquito.

"Mk III" usually seems to be used to denote a Ruger .22 pistol with the standard grip angle and metal frame. The 22/45 has a plastic frame and 1911 style grip angle.

The grip on the 22/45 certainly would be good for people with small hands as the grip is quite thin. You might want to get a shorter barrel version though. Then again, every noob who's tried my 22/45 Hunter with the long barrel has really liked it. The long sight radius makes it easy to hit the target.

 

[KMaurer]

While the 6" barrel on mine makes it a little bit heavy, the Ruger single-six .22 has small enough grips to fit my granddaughters hands just fine. I find it a bit too small for most adults, but YMMV. The fact that it's single action also tends to force them to slow down a bit and do a better job focusing on aiming and trigger control rather than throwing a lot of lead down range as fast as they can.

Ken

 

[Len-2A Training]

I am annoyed that S&W quit making the 422. Maybe you can find a 2nd hand one around. Next time we get out onto a range, I'll let you try it out. The Aluminum alloy frame makes them remarkably light.

Yup, we own a 622, same gun in "white". My Wife loves it. However it lives with a Red-Dot on it and thus NRA doesn't allow us to use it for NRA Instruction.

They are a royal PITA to take down and reassemble for cleaning however. I find my Ruger MKIII 22/45 EASIER to take apart and reassemble.

While the 6" barrel on mine makes it a little bit heavy, the Ruger single-six .22 has small enough grips to fit my granddaughters hands just fine. I find it a bit too small for most adults, but YMMV. The fact that it's single action also tends to force them to slow down a bit and do a better job focusing on aiming and trigger control rather than throwing a lot of lead down range as fast as they can.

Ken

My Wife owns the Single-Six. Nice gun, great for "training" but I shy away from it for NRA Instruction since it's not as obvious that it is unloaded (can't "swing cylinder open").

 

[BossHarley]

I definitely think a K frame Smith. Also could consider getting a lighter upper for the MKII (like tactical solutions)

J

 

[supton]

North American Arms Mini-Master? It's a small gun, and will "feel" much different than any other revolver; but it's a small light single action gun.

 

[mike93lx]

I don't know... I do like the looks of the P22. I'll have to take someone up on their offer and try one out and see what the recoil is like for myself.

let me know. I can get a P22 and meet you over at Riverside (or your club) this weekend.

 

[Ray-500]

Jon, I have a 617 - I was watching this poor lady tea-cupping it because she simply could not hold it up with any other grip!! Very delicately built lady... and the 617 is an L-frame. She had a hard time just grasping it.

As for the Mark III...

The 617 is the piece I have been training my wife on. Her progress makes me feel proud. Not bullseye training....two-handed center hold.

Without going through all the training steps, she is now able to call her shots. She has eliminated the trigger pull/hesitation that goes with new shooters. All shots are double action only...in sequences of 3-5. This is a 10-shot revolver. Her groups are tightening and she is literally "busting her ass" and concentrating on sight picture, alignment and control. Am very proud of her...and her determination.