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Pin/Weld Lantac muzzle device

parallax222

parallax222

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Hi all.

Doing my first AR build. Called a shop close to me and they said they wont do a pin/weld on one specific muzzle device.. surprise surprise its the one I already purchased. Not sure why, but whatever.

By trade, I am a machinist/welder and have access to solid machinery/tooling. So my questions are 1. is this too difficult/risky to do myself? and 2. does anyone who has successfully done it feel like reaching out to me for a few clarifying questions?

Thanks
 
I have never done it. but I stayed at a Holiday Inn one time.

I believe what they do is:
File a flat spot on the bottom of the thread where they want the pin to rest.
Drill a hole through the bottom of the muzzle device where it lines up with the flat spot.
Tap the hole to fit a set screw. Screw down the set screw and lock in the place the muzzle.
Then put a welding bead over the set screw so it's permanent.

Is yours a real flash hider and that's why they wont install it?
 
FWIK (helped one person do this a few years back)... Attached muzzle device, drill a hole to put some kind of metal rod into, that will rest between the threads of the barrel. Put a tack weld at the top of the rod, to hold it to the MD.
IMO, I wouldn't go overboard on this no matter what. I've heard of people using steel [clothes] hanger wire to do this. Pretty sure you don't need to drill and tap the MD and such for this either. If you want to go to the insane level, feel free. But, IMO, if they're looking to see how strong the 'pinning' on your MD is, you're already in deep sheit. It will just be an 'add-on' charge.
 
jayhitek: Nah its a lantac dragon. Was listed as a muzzle device not a flash hider. They just said something about there not being enough of a flat? Sorta made me think they were going to do it with a hand drill and not even a bridgeport/press.

Golddiggie: you're probably right.


I was going to drill the hole, screw it on, and then use a flat endmil through the drilled hole into the barrel threads to plunge the depth of the thread height. Then just slip the pin in and tig weld a bead on top. Probably is overkill..
 
It's amazing, to me, the amount of BS the 'law abiding' gun owners go thru to 'stay legal' with their EBRs [in MA]... I've heard of some people simply putting a spot weld on the MD to hold it to the barrel. I'm just glad I don't live in a state where I have to deal with all that bullshit. Especially when any 'welding job' worth a damn would be invisible to anyone actually looking at it. Plus, you actually need a wrench to remove the MD from a barrel (when properly installed even without being welded on). It's just another case of completely moronic, useless, laws being in place for inmates of the PRM.
 
If you want to do it yourself, check YouTube.
To an uneducated peasant like me it looks like an easy procedure for a semi-skilled welder.
The one vid that I checked, they drilled a hole through MB and partially into the barrel, dropped a pin into the hole and spot-welded the top/outside.

If you want someone else to do it, contact Randy at DeanSafety (he has account here). He did a fantastic job to massify my new purchase. :)
 
Judging by what the OP put in the first post, I suspect he'll be ok doing this himself. Why pay for a shop to do it when he has access to the tools to do it (to make the hole then put the weld on)? Just like when a friend did it to his barrel at my place (not where I am now). With a good drill press (that can run at the right speed), a vise for it (with way to secure that to the drill press table), good drill bits and such, it's not something that will take all that long.

Personally, I wouldn't do it in such a way that you'll never be able to change the muzzle device in the future. Which means not F'ing up the threads.

IIRC, you don't need to pin AND weld the MD onto the barrel. Putting a bead from the MD to the barrel (or to the crush washer then to the barrel) should be enough to pass the muzzle Nazi's inspection. I believe most go with the pin and weld option just to go over the top (to satisfy the muzzle SS officers).
 
jayhitek said:
I have never done it. but I stayed at a Holiday Inn one time.
Click to expand...

That was a motel 6.

ccioff said:
Nah its a lantac dragon.
Click to expand...

You must like to shoot alone too. LOL.
Lantac_Dragon_Pand_W_900.jpg
 
ccioff said:
jayhitek: Nah its a lantac dragon. Was listed as a muzzle device not a flash hider. They just said something about there not being enough of a flat? Sorta made me think they were going to do it with a hand drill and not even a bridgeport/press.

Golddiggie: you're probably right.


I was going to drill the hole, screw it on, and then use a flat endmil through the drilled hole into the barrel threads to plunge the depth of the thread height. Then just slip the pin in and tig weld a bead on top. Probably is overkill..
Click to expand...

This is what I did. Same muzzle brake. Love my Lantac dragon. Have it on 2 rifles and considering threading my .300wm barrel for one.
 
Incredibly easy - you don't need a flat spot, either.

Position/torque as needed, drill a hole to the appropriate depth, insert a piece of drill bit (nice and hard) and weld/file. A little cold blue and you're done.
 
thanks for all your input. any suggestions on where to get cold blue and which to pick up? would four seasons have it?
 
You could also use a dab of high temp paint over the weld... Like the stuff commonly used on BBQ's, or headers. I actually have some of that on hand (from another project). It's a flat finish so it has a better chance to blend in with the rest. Hell, you could just mask off the MD and spray the entire thing with that paint so it's uniform. If you have a media blast cabinet at work, a minute in there would get the surface prep work done. That should make the color more uniform. IF you care about that at least.
 
I hope people realize that things like muzzle devices are typically treated with a black oxide coating, not blueing.

IF the OP wants to go the high temp paint route, he can have/use what I have. I even have a blast cabinet if he wants to hit the MD before painting it.

I also have everything else needed to do this. So it could all be done that same day. Probably the longest part would be the paint drying.
 
ccioff said:
Hi all.

Doing my first AR build. Called a shop close to me and they said they wont do a pin/weld on one specific muzzle device.. surprise surprise its the one I already purchased. Not sure why, but whatever.

By trade, I am a machinist/welder and have access to solid machinery/tooling. So my questions are 1. is this too difficult/risky to do myself? and 2. does anyone who has successfully done it feel like reaching out to me for a few clarifying questions?

Thanks
Click to expand...
OP your a machinist------just get it done for Pete's sake! God the shit I would attempt if I had a mill!
Also while im here since your a machinist can you make a #10-44 pitch screw for me?
 
mac1911 said:
Also while im here since your a machinist can you make a #10-44 pitch screw for me?
Click to expand...

Might be showing my ignorance/inexperience here but I've never heard of a #10-44 screw thread. I didn't realize that you can get #10 threads finer than 32. According to the unified screw threads chart I'm looking at here, 32 is as fine as it gets for #10.
 
Some surface hardened MDs are too much of a pain for the money a shop makes pinning and welding. Specially if they do not have a flat where the pin would normally go. Too say to wander off the mark or wreck a bit to some. Your plan is good just a couple things.


Some bad advice in this thread. Do as you stated but use drill rod or other suitable hardened pin material as you can turn off a MD if the pin is soft. Don't use coat hanger or other junk metal. Don't use an Allen set screw as threading the hole just adds complexity.

Do not file a flat spot on the threads. Do not put a single weld in the washer or barrel to the device if you want to follow ATF guidelines.

Frizzle Fry had it dead nuts in a couple sentences


Acceptable practices are pin and weld, high temp silver solder or 360 degree weld around device to the barrel ( which nobody does as the other two are easier ).

Drill into the barrel deeper than thread depth as the pin must stop the device from being unscrewed. You can unscrew a MD that has a shallow pin. It just wrecks the threads.

Small weld on top that can be cleaned up and finished works well.

All this advice is irrelevant depending on your want to either stay within industry guidelines or if you just want to wing it.
 
JMC Arms said:
Do as you stated but use drill rod or other suitable hardened pin material as you can turn off a MD if the pin is soft. Don't use coat hanger or other junk metal. Don't use an Allen set screw as threading the hole just adds complexity.
Click to expand...

true. I was going to use a 316 stainless dowel

JMC Arms said:
Drill into the barrel deeper than thread depth as the pin must stop the device from being unscrewed. You can unscrew a MD that has a shallow pin. It just wrecks the threads.
Click to expand...
How deep past the threads do you think its safe to drill before I risk damaging the ID of the barrel?

JMC Arms said:
All this advice is irrelevant depending on your want to either stay within industry guidelines or if you just want to wing it.
Click to expand...

I really just wanted it to be reliable, not damage my barrel, look half decent, and not make the old guy who taught me how to use a bridgeport do a facepalm. hah
 
JMC Arms said:
Frizzle Fry had it dead nuts in a couple sentences
Click to expand...

Thanks!


JMC Arms said:
Acceptable practices are pin and weld, high temp silver solder or 360 degree weld around device to the barrel ( which nobody does as the other two are easier ).
Click to expand...

QFT - the only acceptable solder is that with a melting point over 1100*f which is expensive, ugly, and tough to work with. Definitely not worth your time.
 
ccioff said:
Might be showing my ignorance/inexperience here but I've never heard of a #10-44 screw thread. I didn't realize that you can get #10 threads finer than 32. According to the unified screw threads chart I'm looking at here, 32 is as fine as it gets for #10.
Click to expand...
I'm not trying to be a dick but seems the gun manufactures especially older ones used a lot of stuff not known to today's machinist. Believe I don't know shit about all the newer stuff on cars these days and have no idea what's available for parts and aftermarket anymore.
I'm talking out of my ass here but I sit here thinking that screws seem to be one of the easiest items to make. I lost our local machine shop years ago as they moved to Texas. Guys where great there. Fixed some butchered threads on a M1 garand barrel , made a few small parts for me. D&T'd a receiver so many other places said could not be done.
Its all good and eventually I will either find the screw or someone who can make one or I will break down and buy the tap die set and hack one out myself
 
ccioff said:
true. I was going to use a 316 stainless dowel


How deep past the threads do you think its safe to drill before I risk damaging the ID of the barrel?



I really just wanted it to be reliable, not damage my barrel, look half decent, and not make the old guy who taught me how to use a bridgeport do a facepalm. hah
Click to expand...
Is that old guy still around, have him do it[rockon]
 

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