long distance 9mm load for carbine?

[*chris*]

I am picking up a 9mm carbine later today with a 16" barrel and have the urge to try to shoot it at 100 yards. To get the flattest trajectory I assume I need a lot of speed and a light as bullet as possible with a slow burning powder behind it. Is my logic correct? Should I look at 90 grain bullet or will the wind knock it around too much? What powder?

Chris

 

[Glasgow Grin]

I understand the curiosity factor here, but the 9mm is never going to be a rifle round. Keep it inside of the 50 yard line and you will be happier.

 

[duarteus]

My Hi-Point 9mm do Just fine around 100yards with my 12inch metal gong.
On my own cast lead bullets
124gr. 3.7 Bullsyes
105gr 4.0 Bullsyes
.




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[duarteus]

Just for the heck of it.. Hitting a target at 100y is not impossible just not very easy lol my 12inch gong was hit before by .38 revolvers .22 pistol and revolver, .380auto and both of my 9mm pistols .... Don't over think just practice and have fun ;-)


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[*chris*]

My Hi-Point 9mm do Just fine around 100yards with my 12inch metal gong.
On my own cast lead bullets
124gr. 3.7 Bullsyes
105gr 4.0 Bullsyes
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks, so does the lighter bullet have a flatter trajectory?

Chris

 

[Moderator]

My Spear manual has a recipe for Blue dot and 115gr bullet. Starting charge is 7.7gr@1161fps and maximum charge is 8.5gr@1258fps. Hornady has several maximum charges @ 1400 fps using a 90gr bullet.


Be sure to read the manuals yourself incase of any typographical errors I may have.

 

[FPrice]

When I had my Beretta CX-4 I found that it really liked 147 gr rounds (mine were Federal) at longer distances.

YMMV.

 

[gerrycaruso]

The 9mm is a pretty flat shooting handgun round. Any load that produces factory velocity will work. I shoot the 9mm at 100 yards out of a handgun. You should have no problem.

 

[SJan]

I think heavier bullets will be more accurate at 100 yards. Not because they are heavier, but because they have more surface area in contact with the barrel. Faster bullets are not always more accurate. Look at 22lr, standard velocity is typically more accurate than hi velocity.

If you plan on shooting mostly at 100 yards, I would experiment with several slower pistol powders under a 147gr bullet. Find the one that groups best in your carbine.

If you plan to shoot 20 yards - 100 yards and everything in between -a flat shooting round would be better.

 

[saltydude]

I have an general purpose light load I use for steel. 124gr plated w/ 3.6grs titegroup. When I shoot it out of my carbine or pistol it seems to share the same zero at 100 yards as it does at 25feet. I align the sights the same way and get the same results. A 6 inch steel plate is no problem with the carbine and 2moa dot. Funniest thing is the delay between the report and impact.

ETA: Speaking of the "delay". I've found out the hard way that a Texas star is next to impossible with this set up.

 

[xtry51]

9mm rifles have no problem hitting at 100 yards and are still well within minute of man at 200 if your doing your part.

 

[*chris*]

I think heavier bullets will be more accurate at 100 yards. Not because they are heavier, but because they have more surface area in contact with the barrel.

Interesting, this is just for fun, heavier bullets are used for longer distances with rifles as far as I know.

Chris

 

[dcmdon]

I'd suggest you try something like H110.

It is a slow burning (for pistol) powder thats commonly used for high powered magnum handguns.

I'd bet that you could work up a heck of a load that would make use of all 16" of the barrel with H110.

If you don't know how to work up to a maximum load then you shouldn't try this. But I'd bet you anything it would lead to some impressive MVs.

Re drop. A lighter bullet will fly flatter in the beginning because its going faster. But it will slow down more rapidly than a heavier bullet. So it depends on what range you are shooting. Some experimentation with an external ballistics calculator could help you find the range at which one becomes better provided you plugged in realistic MV and ballistic coefficient numbers.

Don

 

[Supermoto]

I have shot 125g 9mm to 1500 fps using HS6 without pressure issue in a pistol. The OAL was 1.170, there was still more room in the case

 

[*chris*]

Don and Supermoto, this is the kind of stuff I am looking for. Looking at my burn rate chart, HS6 is half way between 231/HP38 and W296/H110.

I can't find any reloading data for h110 and 9mm but I will look at my books at home. How does Unique compare with HS6? I have some Unique and see some reloading data for some fast loads.

Good point on the ballistics calculator, I will run a few different scenarios based on reloading book data and see what it says.

Chris

 

[dcmdon]

There probably isn't any data on H110 in 9mm because in most pistols the powder will still be burning when the bullet leaves the muzzle.

I load .460 S&W with H110. My gun has a 9" barrel. Thats like a 11" barrel in a semi-auto. (Remember that the chamber is figured into barrel length in a semi-auto and is added to it in a revolver)

The fireaball is not too bad.

I've shot my reloads out of a 4" .460 and the fireball was HUGE. Which showed that much of the powder was still burning when the bullet left the barrel.

If there is data available for HS6, I'd suggest trying that first

One other thing that I dont know about is whether H110 requires higher pressures to burn completely. It may. You should certainly be able to research that on the internets.
The SAAMI max pressure for 9mm is somewhere around 30,000 psi. The max for .460 S&W is 65,000 psi.

Don

 

[dcmdon]

Check this out:

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-674086.html

 

[drgrant]

H110 in 9mm? Yeah have fun with that. H110 is weird shit, and it's one of the few powders I would not use outside of what the book says is OK.

He'd be better off stoking up some Power Pistol or IMR SR-7625.

-Mike

 

[Supermoto]

H110 in 9mm? Yeah have fun with that. H110 is weird shit, and it's one of the few powders I would not use outside of what the book says is OK.

He'd be better off stoking up some Power Pistol or IMR SR-7625.

-Mike

I couldn't get enough 7625 in the case to get to 1400 fps

 

[*chris*]

Check this out:

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-674086.html

Neat, so Blue Dot and AA#7 are halfway between H110 and HS6 and both have recipes for 9mm. Power Pistol seems to be of similar ilk to HS6 and Unique.

Looks like the 124gn bullet is the favorite for carbines.

Ill try to find some blue dot and wait for the snow to melt a little.

Chris

 

[EddieCoyle]

Lots of sketchy info here.

I think heavier bullets will be more accurate at 100 yards. Not because they are heavier, but because they have more surface area in contact with the barrel.

What?!?! Is this something you made up?

Interesting, this is just for fun, heavier bullets are used for longer distances with rifles as far as I know.

Because the heavier bullets have higher BCs. Even though they might start out slower than lighter bullets, they retain their velocity better at distance, so at longer ranges they end up going faster than a lighter bullet at the same distance.

ETA: 'Longer ranges' means a heck of a lot longer than 100 yards.

I'd suggest you try something like H110.

Try it. I bet you won't be able to get a 9mm bullet over 900 fps with H110. There's no data because the 9mm lacks the case capacity to allow it to reach even normal velocities with H110.

My 9mm carry ammo clocks in at about 1500 fps with a 115gr bullet. I won't give out the load.

 

[*chris*]

So Jim, do you think I am on the right path with Blue Dot and a 124gn bullet?

 

[dcmdon]

I couldn't get enough 7625 in the case to get to 1400 fps

Thats a problem with a lot of the slow powders. There isn't enough case volume in a 9mm. This includes my original though to investigate H110.

- - - Updated - - -

Try it. I bet you won't be able to get a 9mm bullet over 900 fps with H110. There's no data because the 9mm lacks the case capacity to allow it to reach even normal velocities with H110.

My 9mm carry ammo clocks in at about 1500 fps with a 115gr bullet. I won't give out the load.

Yeah. I thought of that after the fact.

So Jim, do you think I am on the right path with Blue Dot and a 124gn bullet?

One other thought. If your goal is something with the least rainbow at 100 yards, I'd bet lighter is better. Ballistic coefficient has already been discussed and again an external ballistics calculator could give you all the data you need, but I'd bet that you were better off with a 115 gr. Because while 100 yards may seem long to you. From a ballistic perspective, its not far at all.

Don

 

[*chris*]

. Because while 100 yards may seem long to you. From a ballistic perspective, its not far at all.

Don

Good point, once I find one of these powders in stock, I will run the tables and see what the drop is.


Chris

 

[Supermoto]

Thats a problem with a lot of the slow powders. There isn't enough case volume in a 9mm. This includes my original though to investigate H110.

Don

There are only few powders that are slow enough and dense enough to push 9mm fast safely . HS6, Autocomp, Silhouette are the only ones I would use.

 

[55_grain]

Yeah, forget about H110. Save it for your magnum wheelgun.

Work up something using "regular" powders with book values for 9mm. Make it something you'd shoot in your pistol, too. A regular 115gr or 124gr 9mm will get out to 100 yards with no problems at all.

55_grain

 

[*chris*]

Phew, after searching for 2 weeks, finally came up with a pound of HS-6. Got robbed at $35 but whatever. I will load a few and post the results.

Chris

 

[*chris*]

I have shot 125g 9mm to 1500 fps using HS6 without pressure issue in a pistol. The OAL was 1.170, there was still more room in the case

Is it safe to assume this load was a lot higher than published maximums in reloading books? The Hodogon online site lists 6.8gn for 1169FPS, you are reporting a velocity 28% higher.

Chris

 

[drgrant]

Is it safe to assume this load was a lot higher than published maximums in reloading books? The Hodogon online site lists 6.8gn for 1169FPS, you are reporting a velocity 28% higher.

Chris

You're not gonna get to the velocity he posted without doing some clark maguson-like experimentation, lol.

-Mike

 

[Supermoto]

Is it safe to assume this load was a lot higher than published maximums in reloading books? The Hodogon online site lists 6.8gn for 1169FPS, you are reporting a velocity 28% higher.

Chris

8.7 hs6 with a 125 loaded 1.170
I recommend you work up slowly if you are going to try this