JimConway
Instructor
If you are a CCW holder that is made by the police, here is some info ny a highly esteemed police instructor.
"PREFACE: Don't shoot the messenger, this an FYI post with a little bit of my dry humor tossed in. I am not overtly being a dick but a few things need to be said, I'm not one for diplomacy.
For those who are NOT cops, nor ever held gen-U-ine bad guys at gunpoint, been shot at/shot, dealt with armed people on a regular basis.
I'll start with the little statement I give the kids when in training, "Sit down, shut up, get back in your lane and listen, then learn....we'll chit-chat later". I am no SME on this, but I might have smidgen of experience that I would like to share.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE think about some of things you say you want to do if you are ever "made" with your CCW and held at gunpoint by the Police. They are in control of the situation, yes really...you might not like it, in fact you will HATE it, but they control you for the interaction. Can I predict what cops might say or ask you to do?
No....we can play the "what if" game forever. Usually we apply a "Control and Cover", one Po-po does the verbal, another the covering.
They both involve guns. If the cover dude senses a weapon, he speaks up and orders you to do SOMETHING. Yes this can contradict the Control officer, many times one officer see's something the other does not.
These roles can switch, Shit happens.
What we teach. You have a gun in your hand, you don't comply with orders to drop it or in ANY way make a movement to hurt the cop/others/yourself, you get shot. There ya go. Simple. That is what is being taught to police, that is what to expect. Other Cops/Trainers, jump in if our stuff is contradictory to yours. A reasonable attempt is made for verbal control, game-on if you don't want to drop your $3K 1911. (balance out the cost of a funeral or a new refinish...) We are not counselors, mental health professionals or best bud's though we will fake it if needed.
Tidbit: Recall how fast you can shoot from low ready and concealed/holstered Cops know this too, hence the response.
Sidenote: I routinely get gigged during training because I push the verbal part to far and wind up in, or something close to, gunfights.
NOTE: I am NORMALLY far, far, far quicker to get hits than my "bad guy"
but I have been on the receiving end a few times.
Sidenote Part Deux: Monday morning quarterbacking, we use the term"Subjective" when reviewing cases and such. So, when we talk about the La CCW guy, we need to ponder what the dispatcher told the responding units. I'll jump in opine (guess!) something along the lines of "Please respond to an Armed irate shoplifter" . We know NOTHING about his CCW/Prior Service or the real situation, but we have a few of clues that stand out. The guy has a gun (not necessarily a crime, but is it an AK/Active shooter or a CCW?), is being a douchenozzle to SOMEONE
(could be a crime), and is committing a crime (why we do this!). We
know nothing other than this and respond accordingly. That's wrapped up....simple until something stupid happens and people get hurt.
My 2 cents on the missing video: It's not missing, it's being held by the DA or IA. If it is missing, I would expect some heads to roll."
This is the stark reality for a CCW holder that gets stopped
"PREFACE: Don't shoot the messenger, this an FYI post with a little bit of my dry humor tossed in. I am not overtly being a dick but a few things need to be said, I'm not one for diplomacy.
For those who are NOT cops, nor ever held gen-U-ine bad guys at gunpoint, been shot at/shot, dealt with armed people on a regular basis.
I'll start with the little statement I give the kids when in training, "Sit down, shut up, get back in your lane and listen, then learn....we'll chit-chat later". I am no SME on this, but I might have smidgen of experience that I would like to share.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE think about some of things you say you want to do if you are ever "made" with your CCW and held at gunpoint by the Police. They are in control of the situation, yes really...you might not like it, in fact you will HATE it, but they control you for the interaction. Can I predict what cops might say or ask you to do?
No....we can play the "what if" game forever. Usually we apply a "Control and Cover", one Po-po does the verbal, another the covering.
They both involve guns. If the cover dude senses a weapon, he speaks up and orders you to do SOMETHING. Yes this can contradict the Control officer, many times one officer see's something the other does not.
These roles can switch, Shit happens.
What we teach. You have a gun in your hand, you don't comply with orders to drop it or in ANY way make a movement to hurt the cop/others/yourself, you get shot. There ya go. Simple. That is what is being taught to police, that is what to expect. Other Cops/Trainers, jump in if our stuff is contradictory to yours. A reasonable attempt is made for verbal control, game-on if you don't want to drop your $3K 1911. (balance out the cost of a funeral or a new refinish...) We are not counselors, mental health professionals or best bud's though we will fake it if needed.
Tidbit: Recall how fast you can shoot from low ready and concealed/holstered Cops know this too, hence the response.
Sidenote: I routinely get gigged during training because I push the verbal part to far and wind up in, or something close to, gunfights.
NOTE: I am NORMALLY far, far, far quicker to get hits than my "bad guy"
but I have been on the receiving end a few times.
Sidenote Part Deux: Monday morning quarterbacking, we use the term"Subjective" when reviewing cases and such. So, when we talk about the La CCW guy, we need to ponder what the dispatcher told the responding units. I'll jump in opine (guess!) something along the lines of "Please respond to an Armed irate shoplifter" . We know NOTHING about his CCW/Prior Service or the real situation, but we have a few of clues that stand out. The guy has a gun (not necessarily a crime, but is it an AK/Active shooter or a CCW?), is being a douchenozzle to SOMEONE
(could be a crime), and is committing a crime (why we do this!). We
know nothing other than this and respond accordingly. That's wrapped up....simple until something stupid happens and people get hurt.
My 2 cents on the missing video: It's not missing, it's being held by the DA or IA. If it is missing, I would expect some heads to roll."
This is the stark reality for a CCW holder that gets stopped