Here's to hoping I didn't ruin my AR...

[Fooped]

Hey Everyone,


Any thoughts on this? I was just finally gettting around to installing my Chip McCormick Super Match AR trigger group, and I made a boo-boo in doing so. Perhaps a BIG boo-boo:

In order to get the self-contained match trigger group into the lower, you have to remove the safety selector. Seeing that the selector was a pin-based switch like most everything else on the gun, it seemed clear to me that it should be drifted out from right to left so I could fit the new trigger group in. I looked on ar15.com and a few other places to see if there was anything else special I should do first, and found nothing.

So....Out came the punch and hammer, and I got the safety out, but not without ripping a 1/4" gouge out of the inside of the receiver wall! Apparently, there's a little detent pin that the safety selector rides on, that makes sure it can move to safe or fire, but nowhere else, and this pin was holding the switch in place! So when I started pounding, it came right through the wall of the receiver along with the switch!

After discovering this, I took off the pistol grip and realized that the little spring that fits inside the pistol grip goes up into a hole in the receiver that this little detent pin sits in. Wish I knew that before smashing away at the selector switch.

So my question is this: did I royally screw up my AR? I very carefully put everything back together, seated the selector switch, and function checked everything with no issues, and the pin still has a fair amount of metal holding it in the lower, along with tension from the spring pushing up, and the selector holding it down.

Also, putting IN the selector switch is easy (take the pistol grip off, remove the little spring, push the detent pin down, slide the selector in and put it all back together. But how do you remove the switch without damaging the receiver? Getting the detent pin out with the switch in seems impossible, and I found out the hard way what happens if you try to drift the selector out without dropping that pin.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Fooped]

Well, I figured out how to correctly remove the selector (too little too late), but I'm still wondering if I'm going have an issue in the future...

 

[Wildweasel]

Well without looking at it I can't tell you. I would replace the detent anyway.
Normally you just drop the spring and the detent falls out (or moves out of the way enough to pull it after rotating the selector around some.

For future referance you should pick up a copy of the USMC tm for the M16a2 (tm05538c-23&P/2) most of it applies to any model AR except the burst controls.

 

[jhrosier]

Darn shame.
It will likely cost more to repair than a new lower would cost.
Someone in another thread made reference to stripped lowers selling for $115.

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=169799

I'd chalk it up to poor judgement and replace it.
The damaged lower would probably sell for $50 as a "project gun" on one of the auction sites.
Here's hoping that it wasn't an SP-1 or other collectable.

 

[GTOShootr]

One of the nice things about the JP trigger kit is that it came with an instructional DVD where John Paul (JP) does an installation from start to finish (btw, I still had a gunsmith put it in).

Have a gunsmith check it out.

 

[hminsky]

I was wondering what that spring in the grip was for

 

[LoginName]

Actually, the proper method for removing the selector switch is to rotate it half-way between safe and fire then use a drift punch (preferably brass), then with a light tap it'll pop right out... no need to remove the pistol grip. Reverse the proceedure for reinstalling it (altough it is easier if you depress the detent slightly with a small screwdriver while inserting the selector switch).

Can you post a pic of the damage?

 

[Wildweasel]

Actually, the proper method for removing the selector switch is to rotate it half-way between safe and fire then use a drift punch (preferably brass), then with a light tap it'll pop right out... no need to remove the pistol grip. Reverse the proceedure for reinstalling it (altough it is easier if you depress the detent slightly with a small screwdriver while inserting the selector switch).

Can you post a pic of the damage?

Where did you read or learn this as being the correct way? if it was an armorers course I would be willing to agree with you, but for ease and safty of the parts I would just drop the pistol grip(one flatheaded screw) and detent and then just pull the selector out. (I am not attacking you but honestly would like to know.)

as for the lower in question if the detent pin is not bent and the selector still works you can likly get away with it, one repair mothod touted on the net is to use JB weld in the damaged area and then re-drill/ream the holes.

I would be inclined to insure the weapon funtions properly and if not then
either check with the manufactuer of the lower/rifle to see if they will offer a repair/swap service or replace it with another lower.

Having the area welded would require a refinishing of the lower. not really worth it unless it was say a preban.

Don't worry everyone has messed up something at some time when worlking on things themselfs.

 

[LoginName]

Where did you read or learn this as being the correct way? if it was an armorers course I would be willing to agree with you, but for ease and safty of the parts I would just drop the pistol grip(one flatheaded screw) and detent and then just pull the selector out. (I am not attacking you but honestly would like to know.)

as for the lower in question if the detent pin is not bent and the selector still works you can likly get away with it, one repair mothod touted on the net is to use JB weld in the damaged area and then re-drill/ream the holes.

I would be inclined to insure the weapon funtions properly and if not then
either check with the manufactuer of the lower/rifle to see if they will offer a repair/swap service or replace it with another lower.

Having the area welded would require a refinishing of the lower. not really worth it unless it was say a preban.

Don't worry everyone has messed up something at some time when worlking on things themselfs.

Spent a lot of time in the arms room when I was in the military.

Sgt. in charge showed me that method and I've used it ever since on every AR I've owned. I can't say with 100% certainty that he was taught that in armorers school or not.

We'd disassemble the fire control group a few times a year (always prior to an IG inspection), to clean out all the sand/dirt/built-up crud that normally couldn't be cleaned out with a Q-Tip or pipe cleaner.

The disadvantage of removing the pistol grip/detent/spring is that if you drop the spring or detent, expect to spend many minutes on your hands and knees cursing loudly as you search for it.

 

[bpm990d]

You can probably get away with just reassembling it. However I would do what WW said and use some JB Weld or Devcon and just fill up the void and let it harden and then drill out the space for the detent and spring.

It should run fine and if you are going to sell it just take of 25 bucks. It doesn't sound like a big deal.

B

 

[Fooped]

Thanks all! Where can I find JB Weld or Devcon?

 

[bpm990d]

You can get JB Weld at wallyworld or an automotive store. It's just two part epoxy. Devcon is lots more expensive and you can get it at a marine supply store. I think the devcon is probably a better epoxy, but I'm not sure you need it.

B

 

[Wildweasel]

Spent a lot of time in the arms room when I was in the military.

Sgt. in charge showed me that method

Ok no problem just not in the tm's I have read. one thing to watch for is if the part is not in spec it could cause an issue. (and when I was in if they saw me with a punch and hammer around my m16 they would have tackled me (LOL)

I have seen some cheap selectors with a ridge all the way where the detent rides. Everyone with an Ar should have a parts bin with commen springs an FCG parts any way right ? (I know I do but I have also built 6 of them over the years)

 

[Scrivener]

Having dropped a Chip McCormick trigger group into my AR last summer, I am surprised to hear of these difficulties. I think I spent more time removing the original parts than I did installing the new, modular unit. It is a very nice trigger and a straight-forward replacement.

I vaguely recall the "halfway" step for removal of the safety, but that is the procedure for a 1911, so I may have gotten them confused.

As for repairs, you might also look into (and for) "Liquid Steel." I found it very effective at filling screw holes some maroon put in an M1 carbine receiver as part of a butchered scope installation.

 

[LoginName]

Ok no problem just not in the tm's I have read. one thing to watch for is if the part is not in spec it could cause an issue. (and when I was in if they saw me with a punch and hammer around my m16 they would have tackled me (LOL)

Actually, we used a section of cleaning rod instead of a drift punch (now that is most likely not in the TM).

Removing the selector and FCG in the manner I posted earlier was a great time saver when GI'ing 200+ rifles.

I have seen some cheap selectors with a ridge all the way where the detent rides. Everyone with an Ar should have a parts bin with commen springs an FCG parts any way right ? (I know I do but I have also built 6 of them over the years)

I have a couple of spare parts kits (an Altoids tin is perfect for storage), and they've been a blessing on a couple of occasions. If a small part is lost or damaged, it's kind'a silly to place an order for a single $1.50 spring or detent.

 

[Wildweasel]

Actually, we used a section of cleaning rod instead of a drift punch (now that is most likely not in the TM).

Removing the selector and FCG in the manner I posted earlier was a great time saver when GI'ing 200+ rifles.

I have a couple of spare parts kits (an Altoids tin is perfect for storage), and they've been a blessing on a couple of occasions. If a small part is lost or damaged, it's kind'a silly to place an order for a single $1.50 spring or detent.

I hear ya brother. I was often stuck cleaning the headsheads weapons in the guard (after 4 years of active duty I knew how to GI A weapon!) so I would end up cleaning 10+ while snuffy smith was doing a bad job on his one.(and pass inspection on all 10) But I had my little tackle box of goodies with me at all times... I allways would much rather be busy than doing nothing.

I guess a lot of the active duty units have dedicated parts washers etc avalible now. that would have been great to have back in the day eh?

And everyone who goes to a gunshow and owns an AR owes it to themselves to stop by a booth with AR parts and get a full set of detents and springs. (at the least) it is only a few bucks after all. the first thing I did when I got my M17S Bushy was order a spare parts kit from them.

JB weld is a VERY handy item to have around. I have used it on motorcycle engine cases etc over the years and it hold up VERY well.
you can get it at Autozone among other places. I like the long cure for more strength but the 5 min stuff will likly work for your use.
http://jbweld.net/dealer/index.php for a listing of suppliers.