Help with validating a Remington-Rand M1911A1

[majspud]

I have a friend being offered this minty Remington-Rand M1911A1. He can chime in if he wants to. I don't know enough about these to comment either way, but it sure looks nice. He's asking $1900. Correct? Worth it?

t

 

[BriMac]

Pistol Markings
Have fun .

 

[Sprocket]

Find out when it was made via the seriL number - search here for a thread by me. Lots of folks pointed me toward excellent site for research

 

[majspud]

1279699-1441430 Remington Rand 1944 starts at 1363700 161,732

...so early1944

t

 

[n1oty]

That's a high asking price for a Remington Rand. I got a nice one last year that also came with an original M1916 leather holster, matching leather mag carrier and one WW2 original magazine for $1600.

 

[Welder1]

I think that is a fair price for a very nice gun. They are selling in the low $2k range on some of the bigger auction sites.

 

[FPrice]

Four Seasons has an R-R for a nickel short of $2300. Ser number 1486xxx. The finish on the one you are looking at looks awfully good for a 75 yo pistol. Some obvious wear marks here and there but no real bad dings that I can see.

Let's face it, they are not making any more and prices are not going down.

 

[jpm]

Woah is it with the original shipping box? Looks like its been shot a little bit and maybe holstered a few times.

It sure looks right from what we can see. I'd want to field strip it and check the innards and take off the grips and inspect them.

From what I've seen them going for, that's not a bad price.

 

[mac1911]

What barrel also is the feed ramp in the white?
I have forgotten a lot about the 1911s since I stopped loo k ing several years ago. Even then anything in that condition was either suspect or $1200+

 

[45collector]

Everything looks correct and original and in excellent shape. The safety is a bit different looking than everything else parkerized on the gun, and that could possibly mean the safety is Dulite finish.
RR's began production with Dulite finish in 1942 and were switched to Parkerized finish in 1944.

The Barrel is most likely High Standard. Do you have the opportunity to field strip it?

 

[garandman]

That's a high asking price for a Remington Rand. I got a nice one last year that also came with an original M1916 leather holster, matching leather mag carrier and one WW2 original magazine for $1600.

I’m wondering if it’s been reparked. Also have a 1944 RR and the worn finish is much more gray scale.

 

[majspud]

Pistol is in Arizona

t

 

[45collector]

I’m wondering if it’s been reparked.

Maybe but look at the crispness of the markings. Usually with a repark you get more vague letters/ numbers.

 

[Welder1]

From my experience with a refinish you almost always lose the crossed cannons. This one has a relatively crisp stamp. All others markings are crisp as well.

 

[garandman]

There is so much counterfeiting and refinishing that I’d be really skeptical that finish is original.

We were still using M1911’s in the service (1985) and I never saw one remotely that nice. This is the one I have, wit typical finish wear. It has a High Standard barrel. Purchased from the original owner who bought it through DCM in the 60’s. Many DCM pistols were arsenal rebuilds, and that I would believe. There were some new RR’s (very narrow SN Range, you can research) sold as well.

Whether $1,900 is a fair price for an arsenal rebuild, I don’t know. This one is alleged to be as-built, and all the markings point to that being true.

 

[40 caliber]

yup, that looks like the one I carried in the 80s as well. Until they took my 45 away and gave me a 9mm

 

[majspud]

More pics....

comments during pic exchanges...

The last picture of the feed in the white is typically proof that it's original. the reparked guns usually reparked this area

Very little wear on rail surfaces

picture of the FJA inspector stamp shows white metal this is also indicative of an original as they gun was parked first and them stamped causing the gun to show white inside the stamping. reparked guns would be green in the crack

Offer on the table is $1850 shipped.

t

 

[jpm]

IMO the small stamps are too crisp and clean to be reparked. I think you'd be hard pressed to find anything that nice for the price. The ones I've seen lately have been over 2K.

 

[Hardwired]

That's a high asking price for a Remington Rand. I got a nice one last year that also came with an original M1916 leather holster, matching leather mag carrier and one WW2 original magazine for $1600.

Was that for an original as manufactured all matching RR?

 

[Hardwired]

Just curios what the estimated ratio is between an all original vs a rebuild. How many went thru post ww2 rebuilds?

What's the consensus on the postwar Rock Island Armory rebuilds with mixed parts? Did they actually swap slides and frames during these rebuilds?

Whats an arsenal rebuild worth that's mixed manufacturer between frame and slide worth these days in good condition?

 

[45collector]

Just curios what the estimated ratio is between an all original vs a rebuild. How many went thru post ww2 rebuilds?

What's the consensus on the postwar Rock Island Armory rebuilds with mixed parts? Did they actually swap slides and frames during these rebuilds?

Whats an arsenal rebuild worth that's mixed manufacturer between frame and slide worth these days in good condition?

Like anything else they're worth what people are willing to pay. RI rebuilds are still 100% GI guns IMO, and 1911A1 parts are not serialized like say a P.08 is. So as long as all the parts are correct I wouldn't consider one a hell of a lot less valuable than an all original "unissued" gun. But then I like to shoot my guns, not just let them sit oiled in the safe. So my idea of a good find is a nicely priced original config milsurp that I can shoot without worrying about the value going down. The one and only gun I own that I don't shoot is an all original and excellent shape 1915 Luger, and I bought that on a whim because the price was too good to pass up. I've put exactly 16 rounds through it and I don't plan on shooting it again because I have two other shooter Lugers.

 

[40 caliber]

Thanks Tim, I guess I will out myself here and tell everyone i bought it and it will be here Monday. Tim and i were Pm'ing on the gun and he posted it. *which was fine". I appreciate all the comments. I spent a lot of time looking at Gunbroker and another gun forum WTS and came to the conclusion that the delivered price was more than fair. I saw similar guns over $2K disappear from the other board in 24 hours or less. Virgin finish or refurbished ? I may never know. but i do know it will be a fun piece and my first G.I. 45!

At the end of the day, i have to remind myself that in all my years of collecting i have never overpaid for a Milsurp...... I have bought a couple early, however,

 

[45collector]

Nice. Enjoy it. At least put a few mags through it.
I reload, so I make somewhat mild loads for shooting my milsurps.

 

[jpm]

Nice. Enjoy it. At least put a few mags through it.
I reload, so I make somewhat mild loads for shooting my milsurps.

Same here, no need for full power loads when punching paper or plinking with them.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Offer Greg Derr a reasonable fee for his professional opinion. It will be worth it.

 

[FPrice]

It is possible that it was issued to someone, probably a high ranking staff or rear echelon type who was able to keep it after the war and just happened to be one of those types who kept his possessions in good shape.

I've seen examples of this behavior with other firearms, generally non-military. That's about the most rational explanation I can think of for an old gun in such good condition.

Did we ever determine if that was the original box in the first few pictures?

 

[ridleyman]

I think that is a fair price for a very nice gun. They are selling in the low $2k range on some of the bigger auction sites.[/QUOTE

Said auction sites are expensive and does that include the "buyers fee"?

 

[40 caliber]

I will have it on Monday and can get a pic of the box. he said he is providing that too. I have read about a lot of fake boxes for 1911 RR. there are a number of posts of beautiful RRs and the guns tend to be legit but the box is a phony. i don't remember how you know but i will go back to look.

I have a BEAUTIFUL 55 russian SKS that i posted years ago here. The owner bought it in 1990 at a gun show at the worcester centrum. He picked through all the boxes and picked the nicest one. He then put it in his safe until 2012 when he sold it to me. I have kept it in the same condition. the guys on the SKS boards all came to the consensus that the rifle was probably made at the factory, put in a box new stored in the cold war and sold without ever being issued. The butt plate doesn't even have a scratch which lead them to believe it never even sat in an armory rifle rack. Of course we will never know.

so it does happen. I don't know (and doubt) that's the case. Realistically, its a 74 year old gun so being completely original is a stretch (but gawd i hope so!!!) but either way, it's going to be a nice piece.

 

[n1oty]

Was that for an original as manufactured all matching RR?

I had been waiting for years specifically for a WW2 GI bring back that had not been re-arsenaled. Got this complete with his issued holster and magazine. He was a REMF type, but that just meant it was not beat up. I carried 1911's for four years in the USMC. I know what the ones that went through WW2, Korea and Vietnam looked like...............mix n' match and well worn, with an emphasis on well worn.

 

[40 caliber]

I had been waiting for years specifically for a WW2 GI bring back that had not been re-arsenaled.

So what your saying is "you stole it"