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Deer and the FLIR Thermal Imager

Blame ITAR for the 9hz limit

Export regulations make it a lot easier to export thermal imagers where "the video frame rate is factory set to be less than 9 frames per second". There's no legal impediment to selling 30hz units to civilians in the USA, but OpticsPlanet has their own rules.

IR Defense "Patrol" has 60hz models for helmet mounting, I definitely wouldn't want to wear a 9hz unit that way, but the lower frame rate is okay for even moving objects, for example see the video linked in reply #52 for a comparison.

Anybody have a Pulsar or IR Defense thermal unit?
 
Kevin_NH said:
Anybody have a Pulsar or IR Defense thermal unit?
Click to expand...

Nothing here yet, but the Pulsar HD38S is what I'm hoping to have funded before the current coyote season ends in MA. After reading reports of LCD displays being effected by cold, I'm wanting the OLED flavor. And it uses AA cells, which I'd favor over embedded rechargeable.
 
Has anyone used the seek XR thermal imager adapter for the phone. I just ordered one for detecting heat loss in homes but I can't see why it wouldnt have value otherwise in a hunting environment.
 
pupchow said:
Nothing here yet, but the Pulsar HD38S is what I'm hoping to have funded before the current coyote season ends in MA. After reading reports of LCD displays being effected by cold, I'm wanting the OLED flavor. And it uses AA cells, which I'd favor over embedded rechargeable.
Click to expand...

Damn that's a cool IR Scope, I'd love to get one but I don't think I could talk the wife into $4k for a scope. Maybe if they get silencer hunting approved in NH, I'd like to night hunt Coyote's with a silenced 300blk.
 
NHAtHeart said:
pupchow said:
Nothing here yet, but the Pulsar HD38S is what I'm hoping to have funded before the current coyote season ends in MA. After reading reports of LCD displays being effected by cold, I'm wanting the OLED flavor. And it uses AA cells, which I'd favor over embedded rechargeable.
Click to expand...

Damn that's a cool IR Scope, I'd love to get one but I don't think I could talk the wife into $4k for a scope. Maybe if they get silencer hunting approved in NH, I'd like to night hunt Coyote's with a silenced 300blk.
Click to expand...
I doubt I'll get enough shots at coyotes that unsuppressed night hunting will annoy my neighbors... much.

The Pulsar Quantum HD38S gives 384x288 @ 30hz which is good enough for hunting, but I'm not sure about the fixed 2.1x optical zoom or utility of the digital 2x zoom.

Unlike other sights in this price range, the Quantum line is not designed nor waranteed for use as a weapons sight, has no recticle. So how much do you want OLED?

sbandit said:
Has anyone used the seek XR thermal imager adapter for the phone. I just ordered one for detecting heat loss in homes but I can't see why it wouldnt have value otherwise in a hunting environment.
Click to expand...
Biggest downside of the Seek is that it is not weatherized. Here's a video of the Seek XR showing how it fares at 100 yards:
 
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pupchow said:
Nothing here yet, but the Pulsar HD38S is what I'm hoping to have funded before the current coyote season ends in MA. After reading reports of LCD displays being effected by cold, I'm wanting the OLED flavor. And it uses AA cells, which I'd favor over embedded rechargeable.
Click to expand...

I have the HD19A, it has the LCD screen and i've had no issues with it thusfar. I've been told it will only freeze up around 0 degrees and that if you tape handwarmers to it when it's that cold it fixes the issues of the screen freezing. If you wan't to fork over the extra cash for the HD50 and the OLED feel free.

The HD19 uses (4) AA batteries and IMO they last a long time, i've gone out two consecutive days/nights and it didn't drop below full. I leave it on the entire time while calling.

Love mine, highly doubt you'd be disappointed. Forget anything that doesn't have 30HZ frame rate.

Edit: thought i'd add a little more info.

With the pulsar you can see clearly across fields at night- 500-1000 yards no problem. Also the 1X with the 2X digital zoom is perfect for scanning, it provides you a wider FOV and also thermal IS NOT used for identification just detection. You can tell what something is by the way it walks, however you cannot see high detail until its inside 100 yards. You will still need some form of night vision, or a moonlight night to identify/make a shot. I've only used mine for predators, haven't used it for deer as the thread is titled so no experience there.
 
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larueminati said:
I have the HD19A, it has the LCD screen and i've had no issues with it thusfar. I've been told it will only freeze up around 0 degrees and that if you tape handwarmers to it when it's that cold it fixes the issues of the screen freezing. If you wan't to fork over the extra cash for the HD50 and the OLED feel free.

The HD19 uses (4) AA batteries and IMO they last a long time, i've gone out two consecutive days/nights and it didn't drop below full. I leave it on the entire time while calling.

Love mine, highly doubt you'd be disappointed. Forget anything that doesn't have 30HZ frame rate.

Edit: thought i'd add a little more info.

With the pulsar you can see clearly across fields at night- 500-1000 yards no problem. Also the 1X with the 2X digital zoom is perfect for scanning, it provides you a wider FOV and also thermal IS NOT used for identification just detection. You can tell what something is by the way it walks, however you cannot see high detail until its inside 100 yards. You will still need some form of night vision, or a moonlight night to identify/make a shot. I've only used mine for predators, haven't used it for deer as the thread is titled so no experience there.
Click to expand...


Great feedback. Thanks for posting.
 
pupchow said:
Great feedback. Thanks for posting.
Click to expand...

I should have also mentioned that the picture is highly adjustable for contrast/brightness which allows you to adjust it for any scenario. It will need to be adjusted/calibrated onsite, and I pretty much only use the white-hot setting. Something to consider if you are selecting a different unit, make sure it's fully adjustable.
 
larueminati said:
I should have also mentioned that the picture is highly adjustable for contrast/brightness which allows you to adjust it for any scenario. It will need to be adjusted/calibrated onsite, and I pretty much only use the white-hot setting. Something to consider if you are selecting a different unit, make sure it's fully adjustable.
Click to expand...

For what's currently available, I'm pretty much sold on a Pulsar unit. And from what you've related, it seems the HD19 would suffice for my intended use (detecting predators inside 200 yds). What are you using for a sight?
 
Kevin_NH said:
I doubt I'll get enough shots at coyotes that unsuppressed night hunting will annoy my neighbors... much.

The Pulsar Quantum HD38S gives 384x288 @ 30hz which is good enough for hunting, but I'm not sure about the fixed 2.1x optical zoom or utility of the digital 2x zoom.

Unlike other sights in this price range, the Quantum line is not designed nor waranteed for use as a weapons sight, has no recticle. So how much do you want OLED?


Biggest downside of the Seek is that it is not weatherized. Here's a video of the Seek XR showing how it fares at 100 yards:
Click to expand...


The only way you get a image that good with the Seek "I have one now" is if you have a phone with absolutely nothing running and it's on a mount of some sort. I tried a ton of testing when I went hunting and the image is no where as good as that video. I used a note 2 and a samsung s5. Next time I'll spend more money so I use for multiple purposes.

I had a friend with me on one of the hunt days at about 75 yards and after playing with settings for about 20 minutes he was nothing more than a spec. He didn't even show up until I put on a mount that didn't move.
 
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strangenh said:
Not bad for a 160x120 sensor.
Click to expand...

100 yard detection on a human & 9hz frame rate.

Bad detection and a slow choppy image for $600.

Edit: Looking at Flir units and the majority if not all of the hunting units have a 9HZ refresh rate, which flat out sucks once you see what 30Hz is like. Seems like they also hide this info under the specifications and are not forthright about listing it on the front page. They're going to face stiff competition up against pulsar.

One thing to consider is were all used to smartphones and high-def, if you pick up a 9HZ unit as your first you'll be wondering why its so slow. They also use LCD screens with resolution comparable to the old flip phones, so that in itself takes getting used to when you're expecting this great image for all the money you just paid. It's not Gen3 night vision.
 
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Seems like at the moment there isn't anything of too much value for less than $4k or so. Hoping those prices come down over the next couple of years.
 
NHAtHeart said:
Seems like at the moment there isn't anything of too much value for less than $4k or so. Hoping those prices come down over the next couple of years.
Click to expand...

IMO for scanning purposes and what you can actually see you're getting better value out of a $2k pulsar thermal than you are a $2K gen2 night vision, especially in Mass with no IR lights.
 
NHAtHeart said:
Seems like at the moment there isn't anything of too much value for less than $4k or so. Hoping those prices come down over the next couple of years.
Click to expand...
Actual production costs have come down over the past few years, but with so few companies making uncooled thermal imager cores, they are keeping their margins up.
 
Just curious, do thermal scopes pick up IR lasers? It seems every time I see a rifle with a thermal scope it has some kind of IR pointer on it. Is that because if you have thermal money you probably have a PVS14 hanging on your lid as well?
 
edmorseiii said:
Just curious, do thermal scopes pick up IR lasers? It seems every time I see a rifle with a thermal scope it has some kind of IR pointer on it. Is that because if you have thermal money you probably have a PVS14 hanging on your lid as well?
Click to expand...

No. There is no overlap between the imaging band of thermal (FLIR) and tactical gun mounted pointers like the PEQ-2. While there are lasers that operate in the thermal band, they are not the kind you can sling on a gun.

You can see NIR pointers like the PEQ-2 with NVG's of course.
 
derek said:
ATN has a $2000 thermal scope on the market now. http://www.atncorp.com/thermal-scope-thor-hd
Click to expand...

This has been big news among predator hunters, HOWEVER look at reviews on the X-sight and their poor performance. This is the same unit except with a thermal core. ATN has a VERY bad wrap as of late. Many have doubts this unit will even function properly.

I'll be the first to say I hope it's great because it's at a very good price. Nothing mentioned about the refresh rate, which is a very important specification.
 
I would be surprised if it was below 30. If anyone is thinking about jumping on to this ATN thermal you should probably wait for some in depth reviews on this unit come in.

I didn't realize the x-sight had some issues, reading a bit it looks like they addressed a bunch of them with updates. I was considering an x-sight for a deer rifle so I could have video.
 
derek said:
I would be surprised if it was below 30. If anyone is thinking about jumping on to this ATN thermal you should probably wait for some in depth reviews on this unit come in.

I didn't realize the x-sight had some issues, reading a bit it looks like they addressed a bunch of them with updates. I was considering an x-sight for a deer rifle so I could have video.
Click to expand...

Yes they did release several software updates which supposedly fixed various issues.

ATN also released a second version of the X-Sight at shotshow, which i'm assuming addresses all the issues they had with the original version.

They just have so many bells and whistles... Why not keep it simple and make something that works smoothly.
 
larueminati said:
This has been big news among predator hunters, HOWEVER look at reviews on the X-sight and their poor performance. This is the same unit except with a thermal core. ATN has a VERY bad wrap as of late. Many have doubts this unit will even function properly.

I'll be the first to say I hope it's great because it's at a very good price. Nothing mentioned about the refresh rate, which is a very important specification.
Click to expand...

I bought the X-Sight 3-12x (when I was considering the Photon XT). With the IR, it works great. I've yet to get a really clear night & full moon, over snow, to see if it's useful without the IR. I tried it with some moonlight, but in the woods, and no way is this thing working there without IR. And with the IR, there's splash to deal with. The thing does work better than I thought it would, for $440 spent on it. One thing about it though, it's got a narrow FOV, for a supposed 3x. I'm willing to be an early adopter of their new thermal Thor HD.
 
^ Yeah all digitals have a super tight field of view, somewhere around 4 degrees. You pretty much need something 1X nonmagnified/nondigital to scan with, and then switch to the scope once you know where they are.

If you look into regular NV, a scope like the Armasight Vampire 3X will have around a 10-12 degree field of view. Still tight but nothing like digital. The flip side of the coin is the digital picture is hard to beat once you have it all dialed in, and a way better picture than you'll get from any Gen1 that could be a few hundred more.
 

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