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Buying a Safe
- Thread starter Al-Jim19
- Start date
jayhitek
NES Member
Draw attention? Someone breaks in for a quick smash and grab.. and sees a safe. Are they going to try and carry the multiple hundred pound safe not knowing what is inside out of the house or grab what he can carry.
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radioman
NES Member
I was talking to a local police officer in my town. He told me the anatomy of a typical suburban burglary. 2min in the bathroom looking for pills, 2min in the bedroom looking for pills and cash, 1min in the living room looking for electronics such as video game consoles, phones, pads etc... Even phones and pads nowadays are all but useless because they can be turned into bricks so easily. Total on site time,,5min. No interest in dealing with a safe. Leave that for the return trip. By then I hope the homeowner is better prepared.
I guess we're assuming it's a "smash and grab." You seem to be missing my comment about the *CHEAP* safes meaning they aren't multiple hundred pounds and can easily be dragged out of a house by one person. In your scenario a locked closet is equally as effective and again, insurance covers your losses.
Asaltweapon
NES Member
A decent safe is worth the price of a good rifle and optic. Let that sink in for a moment.
radioman
NES Member
A decent safe is 4 to 5K with a real good one being 12K+. Even the low number bests my best rifle and scope? There's a lot to be said for the lower cost safes. They're a lot better than a soft case and a trigger lock.
E.Stoner
NES Member
I really think that people underestimate the power of actually HIDING stuff.
I am not talking about in the back of the closet or under your mattress but actually getting a little bit clever and making a hidden compartments or false walls.
For less than a hundred bucks for bunch of hardware from the hardware store and an afternoon you can make some clever solutions that no one would ever find unless they had hours or knew there was something to find.
Again, the safest safe is the one that no one knows is there.
When i was safe shopping, i was really surprised to see the cost of what most would consider a "good safe." Most were in the 3-5k range which was wayyy out of my budget. I spent 1k on a Red Head 25 gun safe from BassPro and couldn't be happier. Beats the stack on cabinet I was using for 8yrs that had no room for anything else. I was literally using 3m sticky velcro to be creative so I could fit additional pistols and gear in the safe. After a range session, it would take me 30+ minutes to get my rifles lines up properly again so I could just close the door. Glad those days are over. Get what you can afford, anything is better than nothing. And like others have said, try to put the safe out of sight if possible and bolt it down if you can for added security.
Heres the one I got...http://www.basspro.com/shop/en/redhead-ultra-fire-resistant-25-gun-safe
Heres the one I got...http://www.basspro.com/shop/en/redhead-ultra-fire-resistant-25-gun-safe
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If you have time, wait for the right deal to happen. I, too was in your situation and didn't like the quality of the $1,000 safes. I happened to stumble across an ebay deal on TWO safes. An older 3,500 lb. Mosler double door & a single door 1,000lb. Diebold. Both had a 4 hour fire rating and had some antiquated form of tamper resistance, S&G combination locks with relocking devices. Although not up to today's TL-15 or TL-30 resistance, good luck to the average burglar trying to get into them. Only stipulation was I had to move and transport. However, I won the ebay auction and purchase both safes for $100.
I've read decent reviews of the 10 cubic foot Harbor freight safe. About $300 before any coupon.
I've read decent reviews of the 10 cubic foot Harbor freight safe. About $300 before any coupon.
jayhitek
NES Member
That's some big safes.. How'd you end up moving them?
Take a visit to Eastern Security Safe in Mendon. They have an account on NES and sometimes offer group buys. They also have a good tent sale once or twice a year.
They will take the time to show you the ins and outs of safe construction at every budget level. No pressure sales techniques used. You may or may not decide to buy from them... I did and it was worth it.
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They will take the time to show you the ins and outs of safe construction at every budget level. No pressure sales techniques used. You may or may not decide to buy from them... I did and it was worth it.
Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
This thread has actually been pretty surprising to me. I knew most safes can be opened with some power tools and enough time, but are most out there really guarding against the "professionals"? Surprised that there's so little value placed on safes under (it sounds like) $500? $1000$? More?
Im comfortable with something that will keep out a pair of dirt bags equipped with blunt instruments and 20 minutes. I have a hard time believing that it's really that easy for someone with no training and a hammer to get in and out of the following before I get home:
http://www.cabelas.com/product/STAC...VCy1pCh3YewyVEAQYDSABEgKFMPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
or
https://m.dickssportinggoods.com/p/...afe-15fnsufssprtsmn24gua/15fnsufssprtsmn24gua
If the above really don't have any value I'm a little stuck because I can't really afford a "real" safe, nor do I have the physical space.
Im comfortable with something that will keep out a pair of dirt bags equipped with blunt instruments and 20 minutes. I have a hard time believing that it's really that easy for someone with no training and a hammer to get in and out of the following before I get home:
http://www.cabelas.com/product/STAC...VCy1pCh3YewyVEAQYDSABEgKFMPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
or
https://m.dickssportinggoods.com/p/...afe-15fnsufssprtsmn24gua/15fnsufssprtsmn24gua
If the above really don't have any value I'm a little stuck because I can't really afford a "real" safe, nor do I have the physical space.
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Think 9's of protection:
- What do you expect would keep 90% of miscreants out of our ordnance?
- How much better do you need to move up to 99%? 99.9%? etc.
Don't let the perfect become the enemy of the good because you are unable to get a TRTL60X6 safe for your collection. I helped one friend after a break in at his place (no safe, some guns stolen) and I am confident that even a low end Tractor Supply or Lowes "pseudo safe" would have saved his guns.
- What do you expect would keep 90% of miscreants out of our ordnance?
- How much better do you need to move up to 99%? 99.9%? etc.
Don't let the perfect become the enemy of the good because you are unable to get a TRTL60X6 safe for your collection. I helped one friend after a break in at his place (no safe, some guns stolen) and I am confident that even a low end Tractor Supply or Lowes "pseudo safe" would have saved his guns.
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Pallet jack, Johnson bars, plywood, 2 by's. Luckily, the safes were on the first floor of a town finance building. I was able to back my trailer to the door and roll them onto the trailer. Moving them was the easy part. Transporting them 100 miles was the scary part. I had used every strap I had and used wood bracing to keep them in place. My 2 post lift got them off the trailer. It was a whole day affair.
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Just buy the safe that fits your particular needs and what your trying to protect.
I think the there are a number of steps you can take to mitigate risk so the safes you linked are probably fine in the 99% case. (assuming you don't have an expensive collection that is "known" by others, because if you have a 5+ digit value of collection then you can just man up and buy a good safe to protect it.)
Some ideas off the top of my head.
1) Put the safe in a place that isn't easily visible in the house (So some time is spent looking for the shit to steal)
2) Mount it in place (so it can't be moved without ripping it off wall/floor)
3) Limit directions it can be attacked. (Most lower cost safes are strong at door and weak on all other sides, so make the most convenient attack vector the door strongest part)
4) Don't make finding tools for the job easy. (Don't keep valuable prying/cutting equipment in convenient place to stumble upon, and for the love of all that is holy not RIGHT NEXT TO the safe)
jayhitek
NES Member
And something is better than nothing if that's all you can afford.
E.Stoner
NES Member
THIS.
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Real professionals arent the concern for your type of collection.. its the profesional crackhead family member that is the issue... he will put in 80h of work to sell your entire collection for $100.
As far as fire, most people dont get that its not nessisarly the fire that is the issue.. its the water damage or collapse that does it.. many substandard drywall "safes" (RSC) have SAVED guns from some fire damage.
Lots of people think Thier safe provides more theft security than it does. I've move and installed alot of safes..if you know what your dealing with its easy.
The professionals that make me nervous are locksmiths....they are to professionals.
What i hated was everyone from the dealer, shipper, locksmith. Asked me "what do you need a safe like that for?" Its a pretty dumb question, but the reason it makes me nervious is they are smart. They know that when you buy a real safe, at the minmium the safe cost 10% of its contents.
This is what would cause a pro to target you.as far as RSC go its the inside job that gets you.
With such a small collection, unless its sentimental insurance is better than a safe.
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Add: Since it is hard to hide all evidence of guns (how will you hide you Dillon?), put out a cheap decoy safe and use it for your most expendible guns.
A j-frame up your snot locker will open pretty much any safe unless you are exceptionally well prepared
![[grin]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/041.gif "Grin [grin]")
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Add: Since it is hard to hide all evidence of guns (how will you hide you Dillon?), put out a cheap decoy safe and use it for your most expendible guns.
This is a great layer of security, although i prefer to fill a decoy safe with decoy items.
You want it in a easy location to steal, with a nasty letter in it ,a couple glass bottles and a few bricks.
jayhitek
NES Member
You could also put a smaller safe inside a really big safe.. this way when they finally get the first one open.. they get all bummed out when they look inside.
Asaltweapon
NES Member
I guess if my Safe elert doesn't give me enough warning that something is going down then I'm screwed.
I know when the house keepers are cleaning near it. If I was getting multiple alerts and was away from home I know my local PD would be here rather quickly.
I know when the house keepers are cleaning near it. If I was getting multiple alerts and was away from home I know my local PD would be here rather quickly.
Asaltweapon
NES Member
I was drooling all over one a couple of weeks ago out of state. The normal items were nice but the NFA stuff inside another hidden part of the room was pretty cool as well.
