AR MR2

Hustler One

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Dude... we got it.


Edit: Mods, feel free to delete my post and move AR MR2's first post in the place of mine, if possible. Thanks.
 
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"It also bans semiautomatic, centerfire rifles that have (1) a fixed magazine and can accept more than 10 rounds of ammunition or (2) an overall length of less than 30 inches. "
 

dcmdon

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"It also bans semiautomatic, centerfire rifles that have (1) a fixed magazine and can accept more than 10 rounds of ammunition or (2) an overall length of less than 30 inches. "
Irrelevant. A 14.5" barrelled M4 with a standard A2 Flash hider and the stock retracted has a length of 29.8 inches.

So with a 16" bbl, you are easily over 30 inches.

Colt M4 Carbine
 
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Irrelevant. A 14.5" barrelled M4 with a standard A2 Flash hider and the stock retracted has a length of 29.8 inches.

So with a 16" bbl, you are easily over 30 inches.

Colt M4 Carbine
How is that irrelevant? It states clearly that a centerfire rifle with a fixed mag can't have more than 10 rounds otherwise it is an AW, thus requiring registration. If you are doing that why bother with the MR2?
 

dcmdon

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How is that irrelevant? It states clearly that a centerfire rifle with a fixed mag can't have more than 10 rounds otherwise it is an AW, thus requiring registration. If you are doing that why bother with the MR2?
Did you even read my reply. the "Irrelevant" comment was with respect to the length of the firearm. As explained in the following statements.

You already mentioned the mag capacity and I already acknowledged that it was a great point earlier in this thread. (look on pg 1)
 
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I am wondering if this could be used to legally possess post ban ARs in MA, provided they were only fed 10 round magazines.
provided, however, that the term assault weapon shall not include: ... (vi) any semiautomatic rifle that cannot accept a detachable magazine that holds more than five rounds of ammunition...
now we just have to convince the state that that device when added to an AR makes the magazine not detachable....

probably be easier to crimp the gas tube and turn it into a bolt action :)
 

dcmdon

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now we just have to convince the state that that device when added to an AR makes the magazine not detachable....

probably be easier to crimp the gas tube and turn it into a bolt action :)
MA beaten down dog syndrome rises again. Why would you have to convince the state of that? It isn't detachable. Done deal.

Nothing anyone says, including the AG or anyone at the FRB has any weight of law. The only law around this would be case law.

The state doesn't allow things, it prohibits them. A fixed magazine version of an AR is not prohibited by the language of the law.

Don

by the way. You could have used a bullet button for years if that was your desire as I don't believe anyone in MA has ever issued an opinion (Judge, Jury, FRB, or AG)around the use of a bullet button. I could be wrong on that one. Call me out if I'm incorrect there.

The CT law was written the way it was explicitly to close the "bullet button loophole".
 
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Nothing anyone says, including the AG or anyone at the FRB has any weight of law.
tell that to Midway, Cabella's, Sportsman's Guide...etc

The only law around this would be case law.

that would be the case law created by me being arrested and losing my house, family and everything i own while the DA's office convinced 12 morons that the magazine IS detachable: "all you have to do is pull a pin and lift the top off..."

The state doesn't allow things, it prohibits them. A fixed magazine version of an AR is not prohibited by the language of the law.

couldn't find "fixed magazine" defined in the M.G.L. i will look again though....

by the way. You could have used a bullet button for years if that was your desire as I don't believe anyone in MA has ever issued an opinion (Judge, Jury, FRB, or AG)around the use of a bullet button. I could be wrong on that one. Call me out if I'm incorrect there.

The CT law was written the way it was explicitly to close the "bullet button loophole."

not that it means anything in MA, but how is the bullet button banned, yet this device in hunky dory?
 

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The reason I am cautious is, that the law has been that way for years in MA. I figure someone in an effort to sell more ARs would have done it already. I am guessing it is cheaper for MFRs to sell "compliant" ARs without having to machine off bayo lugs and weld on muzzle brakes. Just attach free state uppers to CA lowers, and done deal. Furthermore, since FFL dealers can posess non compliant rifles, they could have in effect purchase cheaper rifles, and add bullet buttons.

The reason I am interested in this is that there is a NH gun shop that always seems to have great deals on ARs, even in FR mode, even when no one else had any, but they were never MA compliant. At the height of the madness, they said their gunsmith was too busy to "massify." This seems like a 5 minute swap out at best. So I guess, could the NH dealer be convinced to do this conversion, if you showed up with the parts?
 
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Hustler One

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Originally Posted by
not that it means anything in MA, but how is the bullet button banned, yet this device in hunky dory?
It's all how they've written the law: AN ACT CONCERNING GUN VIOLENCE PREVENTION AND CHILDREN'S SAFETY.

Section 25, (i) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least [two] one of the following..

and

Section 25, (F) #4 "Detachable magazine" means an ammunition feeding device that can be removed without disassembling the firearm action;

What this tells me is since you have to disassemble the action of the weapon, an AR15 no longer has the ability to accept a detachable magazine (like it still does with a bullet button) and the one feature test becomes a moot point. Of course IANAL, nor do I wish to become the guinea pig.
 

dcmdon

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The reason I am cautious is, that the law has been that way for years in MA. I figure someone in an effort to sell more ARs would have done it already. I am guessing it is cheaper for MFRs to sell "compliant" ARs without having to machine off bayo lugs and weld on muzzle brakes. Just attach free state uppers to CA lowers, and done deal. Furthermore, since FFL dealers can posess non compliant rifles, they could have in effect purchase cheaper rifles, and add bullet buttons.

The reason I am interested in this is that there is a NH gun shop that always seems to have great deals on ARs, even in FR mode, even when no one else had any, but they were never MA compliant. At the height of the madness, they said their gunsmith was too busy to "massify." This seems like a 5 minute swap out at best. So I guess, could the NH dealer be convinced to do this conversion, if you showed up with the parts?
The reason nobody uses the AR MR2 in MA is because it sucks worse than having a standard compliant AR.

What would you rather have? An AR with a fixed stock, a muzzle brake and no bayonet lug, OR one where you have to open the action to change the magazine.

Comeon, lets be serious here.

About the only application for this device in MA would be if you had some kind of investment grade AR, and didn't want to change anything.
 

dcmdon

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tell that to Midway, Cabella's, Sportsman's Guide...etc
Companies like this as private entities have a right to sell to anyone they wish. That doesn't make it law.

There are other companies that will ship things into MA.

Some of these companies rules are just plain dumb. Last year, I purchased a pre-ban style Rock River arms upper for a friend who was moving to TX. In the same order I ordered a complete lower. They refused to put them on the same order because in sum, they amounted to a complete non-compliant rifle. So we split the order into two and they adjusted the shipping so it didn't cost me any more. Whatever.
 
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About the only application for this device in MA would be if you had some kind of investment grade AR, and didn't want to change anything.
Or if I wanted an adjustable AR that my wife, daughter and I could take to car shoots and it'd fit all three of us.....

'course my wife will never go to a car shoot, and my daughter (at 7 weeks) is a bit young to shoot..... I'd rather take the time on a range gun to change magazines instead of spending the $100 I spent ruining my brand new spike's upper by having the flash hider removed and the bayo lug ground.....

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dcmdon

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A post ban configured AR is every bit as effective as a pre ban one. A fixed mag AR is significantly degraded.

Brakes are preferable to a FH in far more circumstances than a FH is preferable to a brake. I have mostly pre-ban guns and I still run a brake.

A bayonet lug is useless. I don't understand how removing one ruins an upper. If done properly you can't even tell it was done. You simply remove the ears, dress it with a file and cold blue it. Good as new.

So now you are left only with the stock. My wife shoots my fixed stock AR just fine. The reality is that most ARs have such a short length of pull that women do just fine with them anyway. For a child, I agree. But if I cared as much about pre-ban features as you do, I'd simply buy a pre-ban lower.

This is my pre-ban AR with a fixed stock and a brake. I just prefer them. No the brake isn't permanently attached. I like to play with suppressors, so I prefer a threaded bbl.
Don

 
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Just to clarify: This was not designed with MA in mind. If your home state does not use the "disassembly of the firearm action" to trigger the assault weapon definition, there is no need to install AR MR2.

AR MR2 was developed in direct response to this year's bans, which were derived from Feinstien's Federal Bill that failed. For states like CT, CA, NY, and MD, they are adopting the language (in varying forms, but they all seem to use the firearm action as the trigger save NY) from the Federal Ban, which specifically targets the use of a tool for ban.

In my own perspective, no one is going to force me to register anything. I will always find a way around it as it is no business but mine what is in my gun safe. There is, after all, only 2 reasons for the government to want to know what you have:

1.) To tax it
2.) To someday take it away

We are already seeing #2 in California with the implementation of the APPS (Armed Prohibited Person System). We've already seen cases of an innocuous prescription for anxiety leading to a knock on the door and confiscation of firearms. There's also the issue of identity theft, but it's not my intent to delve into this here.

Somebody asked in a prior post why something like AR MR2 hadn't been marketed before now: There was no need for AR MR2 before now. Before, we could use the "Bullet Button" or similar device to qualify "the use of a tool" in the laws to avoid the assault weapon definition. With CT B1160, NY's SAFE Act, and CA SB47, they have outlawed these types of magazine locks thinking they would force everyone to register, or become felons. I find this intolerable, so I invented AR MR2 to prove to our "Servants" you can't ban something unless the people condone it.

The real trick for CT, NY, CA, and MD is interstate commerce after January 1st, 2014. Once this deadline passes, normal folks can't buy AR-15's unless they have fixed magazines. This is where AR MR2 really comes in, as most manufacturers won't alter their production lines for a single state in terms of machine operations.
 
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dcmdon

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The real trick for CT, NY, CA, and MD is interstate commerce after January 1st, 2014. Once this deadline passes, normal folks can't buy AR-15's unless they have fixed magazines. This is where AR MR2 really comes in, as most manufacturers won't alter their production lines for a single state in terms of machine operations.
Agreed. But with your device, it is not unreasonable for an FFL to install it before delivery.

Remember folks. Its perfectly legal for Dealers and Manufacturers to posses assault weapons. So if the gun is shipped into CT and the dealer makes the conversion, both you and the dealer are in compliance.

Don

One of the many exemptions for "dealers".

(2) No assault weapon, as defined in any provision of subparagraphs (B) to (F), inclusive, of subdivision (1) of section 53-202a, as amended by this act, possessed pursuant to a certificate of possession issued under this section may be sold or transferred on or after the effective date of this section, to any person within this state other than to a licensed gun dealer, as defined in subsection (d) of section 53-202f, as amended by this act, or as provided in section 53-202e, or by bequest or intestate succession.

Please note. A dealer is defines by anyone who possesses a FFL (even a manufacturers FFL since the type is not defined) and a State of CT License to sell firearms:

(d) The term "licensed gun dealer", as used in sections [29-37j and] 53-202a to 53-202k, inclusive, as amended by this act, [and subsection (h) of section 53a-46a] means a person who has a federal firearms license and a permit to sell firearms pursuant to section 29-28, as amended by this act.
 
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